Brand New Flava
Photo. Gary LandI know it sounds dumb, but I kinda feel bad for Kevin Durant and Greg Oden right now. It’s got nothing to do with the fact that they’re each about to be pulling down eight figures worth of endorsement and NBA money. Nothing to do with the fact that they’ve already got an entire region of America in love with them. (Don’t think I haven’t had friends and fam back home asking for weeks for the hook-up on Seattle “Durant” jerseys.) And it’s got nothing to do with the fact that — if they wanted to be like that — they could each have veterans carrying their bags next year. (Looking at you, Petro and Outlaw.)
I feel bad for Oden and KD in this regard: with as much hype as these two are getting, anything less than 25 points a night from Durant and 20, 12 and 3 blocks from Oden is going to seem like a disappointment to a lot of people.
And odds are that’s not gonna happen, because NBA rookies just don’t have dominant seasons anymore. When 16 ppg, 4 rpg and 4 apg (in only 57 games, at that) was enough to easily win my man Brandon Roy Rookie of the Year, it was the latest in a trend that peaked in 2001, when Mike Miller took home R.O.Y. putting up 11.9 points on a not-that-good Orlando team. Put it this way: in Bill Russell’s rookie year, he dropped 14.7 points and 19.8 rebounds a night and didn’t win Rookie of the Year. Who did? Tommy Heinsohn (16 ppg, 9.8 rpg). Seriously, Russell pulled down almost TWENTY REBOUNDS PER GAME (and who knows how many blocks, because they weren’t keeping that stat back then) and wasn’t even the best rookie on his own team.
Maybe Oden and Durant can change the game and put up monster numbers in ‘07-08. But most likely, they’ll do borderline All-Star numbers at best. It’s unfair, but here’s the scale these two are working on: some of the best rookie seasons over the last 30 years …
Shaquille O’Neal, Magic (’92-93)
It’s been a while, so you might have forgotten that 20-year-old Shaq practially invented the term “beast.” You know how everyone flips when Dwight Howard puts up a 20-20 line? In his rookie year, Shaq had eight 20-20 games. In the third game of his career, he gave ‘Zo (also a rookie) 35 points, 13 boards and 3 blocks. Two days later he dropped 31-21-4 on Washington, and later in the year went for 30-20-8 against Indiana, 38-16-8 against Philly, 46-21-5 against Detroit, and ended the year with averages of 23.4 points, 13.9 boards and 3.5 blocks. Everyone nitpicked on Diesel for his foul trouble and free throw shooting at the time; while he did commit a career-high 321 fouls his rookie year, his 59 percent from the stripe would turn out to be the second-best season of his career in that department. Shaq finished second in the League in boards to Rodman that year, and second in blocks to Hakeem. He broke a couple of baskets, too.
Michael Jordan, Bulls (’84-85)
Sick. Everyone remembers the ‘84 Draft and the ‘85 All-Star freeze-out, but MJ did a whole lot of damage in between all of that. Only Bernard King and Larry Bird got more buckets than Mike in ‘84-85, as the rookie put up 28 points per game to go along with 6.5 boards, 5.9 assists and 2.3 steals, leading the Bulls to the playoffs and setting the stage for arguably the greatest career in sports history.
Ralph Sampson, Rockets (’83-84)
If you think Greg Oden is getting a lot of hype now, you should have been around for the Ralph Sampson Hype Machine. It was bananas. Just to get an idea, imagine if Oden had played all four years at Ohio State, won National Player of the Year three times and copped four SI covers while still in college. Impossible hype to live up to, but Sampson still managed 21 points, 11.1 rebounds and 2.4 blocks per game and made the All-Star team.
Mark Jackson, Knicks (’87-88)
They say it takes a while for a young point guard to really “get it” in the NBA, but Jax looked like a vet from jump, putting up 13.6 points, 10.6 assists and 2.5 steals a night in his first year. Of course, it didn’t hurt that he had Pat Ewing, Gerald Wilkins, Bill Cartwright and Kenny “Sky” Walker on his squad to drop dimes to. Everyone who’s made a big deal about Chris Paul getting an All-Star snub in ‘06, know that Jax didn’t make the ASG his rookie year, either. Then again, he had Isiah, Doc Rivers and Mo Cheeks ahead of him in the East.
Damon Stoudamire, Raptors (’95-96)
Unless you lived in Canada at the time, you probably never saw Damon do his thing as a rookie out of Arizona. Carrying a God-awful expansion team in its first year, with a supporting cast that included Oliver Miller, Tracy Murray, Carlos Rogers and Zan Tabak playing significant minutes, the 5-10 Mighty Mouse (remember that one?) dropped 19 points and 9.3 assists per game. On 24 occasions Damon put up 20-point, 10-assist stat lines, including two 30-10s and a triple-double.
Vince Carter, Raptors (’99)
Remember when “settling for jumpers” couldn’t be stamped next to Vince’s name? In the Lockout Year, VC’s numbers weren’t historic in his rookie run with the Raps (18.3 ppg, 5.7 rpg), but the highlights … damn. Let’s take a trip down memory lane.
Larry Bird, Celtics (’79-80)
Was he worth the wait? What do you think? Boston drafted Bird as an underclassman in ‘78, waited a year, and saw him drop 21.3 points, 10.4 boards, 4.5 assists and 1.7 steals a night as a rookie. Not only did Larry make the All-Star team, he was also All-NBA First Team. People just don’t do that anymore. And Bird outshined the other superstar rookie from that year, a guy by the name of …
Magic Johnson, Lakers (’79-80)
The numbers were impressive (18 ppg, 7.7 rpg, 7.3 apg), just not enough to get Rookie of the Year over Bird. But Magic’s rookie year will always be remembered for what he did in the playoffs. You know the line: 42 points, 15 boards and 7 dimes while playing center for the injured Kareem in Game 6 of the Finals.
Tim Duncan, Spurs (’97-98)
Of course, Duncan’s first year numbers look just like every other stat line he’s put up since: 21 points, 11 boards and 2.5 blocks a night while leading the Spurs to 55-plus wins and making the All-NBA First Team. The third game of TD’s career was a 19-22 line against the Bulls; the Jordan/Pippen/Rodman still-in-their-prime Bulls.
David Robinson, Spurs (’89-90)
And Duncan’s rookie year wasn’t even as impressive as The Admiral’s. Like Bird, Robinson made the Spurs wait a while after drafting him (military duty), but when he showed up, he killed the game. Robinson averaged 24.3 points, 12 boards, 3.8 blocks and 1.6 steals as a rookie, making the All-Star Game and going for 15 points and 10 boards there. Still probably the most athletic 7-footer you’ll ever see.
Terry Cummings, Clippers (’82-83)
For whatever reason, the best season of Cummings’ 18-year career came when he was a rookie. Doing his thing for a terrible Clippers squad (then the San Diego Clips), Cummings went for 23.7 points, 10.6 boards and 1.8 steals a night.
Allen Iverson, Sixers (’96-97)
First night out of the gate, A.I. hangs 30 on Milwaukee. He went on to run off five straight games of 40-plus later in the year, and of course there was the crossover on MJ. Iverson finished the year averaging 23.5 points, 7.5 dimes and two steals a night, and by the time he was done, had affected an entire generation of ballplayers and fans both on and off the court.
June 25th, 2007 at 5:03 pm
"JC" says:
How come you didn’t include LeBron’s numbers! (Straight out of highschool)
June 25th, 2007 at 5:09 pm
Girlybballluver says:
Random thought…I still don’t think lebron deserved the ROY award. It was a popularity contest that year.
June 25th, 2007 at 6:03 pm
karan says:
i agree with girlybballluver… the lebron ROY was totally a popularity contest… melo had a much higher scoring average AND his team made a significant jump to the playoffs… it should have at least been shared
June 25th, 2007 at 7:54 pm
Giacomo says:
i think it should have been a draw for ROY personally… nut ‘karan’, In his rookie yr LBJ avged 20.9 ppg, while melo dropped 21ppg, in what way is that a “much higher scoring average”.. thats an impressive 8 more points on the full 82 game season than lebron…
June 25th, 2007 at 10:19 pm
djKianoosh says:
yeah yeah, Shaq, Mike, Bird, AI, nice nice nice.. but what about Shawn Bradley?!
oh yeah. 10-6-3. strong, baby, strong.
I remember like it was yesterday. Chris Webber, Shawn Bradley, Penny Hardaway. 1, 2, 3. Gotta love those post-Barkley-pre-AI Sixers.
June 25th, 2007 at 11:21 pm
Bust Jlaze says:
Bron Bron got the ROY based purely on hype and potential…everyone knew he was gonna be SICK wit it, but Melo had the better year.
June 25th, 2007 at 11:29 pm
bron42 says:
hes always gonna be a popularity contest. Just look at the mcdonalds all american dunk contest..the guy wins with a reverse double pump at 6′8 when guys are doin 360’s from almost the foul line. And for those of you who cant dunk flashy, FYI a reverse double pump isn’t hard for a 6′2 guy with hops, let alone a 6′8 guy. But he won it anyway IN his home town, ALL the judges ended up bein future cavs teammates etc..Same with rookie of the year, while lebron couldnt make the playoffs in the east with a better team, melo was in the playoffs by pretty much himself. Melo and wade have been in the playoffs since they got into the nba and lebron just now gets there last year and suddenly people expected him to be the savior of basketball. He gets extra hype always has, always will.
June 26th, 2007 at 1:36 am
Micha says:
Timmy D gets a mention with 21 points, 11 boards and 2.5 blocks while once again Olajuwon gets snubbed with the line of 20.6 points, 11.9 boards (4th best in the league) and 2.85 blocks (2nd in the league) while also being in the top 20 in field goal percentage in his rookie year?
June 26th, 2007 at 2:04 am
Austin Burton says:
Splitting hairs?
June 26th, 2007 at 8:11 am
grayworld says:
Magic Johnson 42 points 15 boards 7 dimes in the finals playing center, as a rook ..it doesn’t and never will get better than that…i dont care whatever someone does as a rook in the regular season..he did it in the finals
June 26th, 2007 at 9:39 am
Ben says:
As a rookie, Wilt Chamberlain averaged 37.6 points and 27 rebounds.
He won both the MVP and NBA ROY, he also won the NBA All-Star Game MVP with a 23 point, 25 rebound performance for the East.
And you dont even mentionned is name in the best rookie season ever, nobody is even close.
June 26th, 2007 at 10:00 am
Ray says:
Just to Chime in on he Lebron-Mello Debate.. Carmello came out of college and was supposed to have one defined skill over Lebron.. The Ability to score, that was supposed to be his advantage. And you could say rebounding to a lesser extent. And for all that he only averaged 0.1 more then Lebron and 0.5 more RPG. Lebron had more steals assists and blocks. And also as for Carmello “Leading” Denver to the playoffs. They added Andre Miller , who was a top 10 PG at the time, and Vashon Lenard who avg 15 ppg.. So lets while Carmello was a factor, lets not give him too much credit.
June 26th, 2007 at 10:03 am
Austin says:
Ben, read the intro. Best rookie seasons of the last 30 years.
June 26th, 2007 at 12:07 pm
Bron42 says:
andre miller’s best year was as a cav and hasnt done much since other than throw decent lobs and play no defense. And vashon Lenard? hes been fat and on the bench SINCE melo got there, why do you think A) he got bounced b) the nuggets are still looking for a outside shooter. Melo carried that team when he had to and lebron still had 80% more hype then melo even though he went to college. Melo has always been beter than lebron, even if you watch them play in high school which is why lebron never beat him in his career until last year. Cuz if you look at it like miller and lenard, Big Z was a allstar lebrons rookie year and the cavs still didn’t make the playoffs
June 26th, 2007 at 12:36 pm
kudabeen says:
How do people keep disrespecting Wilt. He is just the most talented player to ever be in the NBA. A center that beats eveyone up and down the court. The best or at least 2nd best rebounder/shotblocker ever behind Bill Russell. Led the league in Assist, got steals, and Lets not get into scoring… Even when his knees were shot, he still was an All-star and better than everyone, except a much younger Lou Alcindor (spelling).
You’ll never get close to a complete package like that again…
Wil Chamberlain…make that name a part of you NBA vocabulary. Yes Jordan was a competitive beast and yes Russell was the greatest winner every, but Wilt was a so talented that people don’t even bother to bring his name up in comparisons…How ofter do you hear KG reminds me of Wilt or That Dwight Howard rebounds like a young Wilt or Amare’s athleticism brings back memories of Chamberlain.
Too good for words shouldn’t mean people just stop mentioning him…
June 26th, 2007 at 12:38 pm
kudabeen says:
Wilt Chamberlain…Respect this man:
http://www.nba.com/history/players/chamberlain_stats.html
June 26th, 2007 at 1:21 pm
lebomb says:
Kudabeen……
Yes Wilt was the man, but he played in an era where he was literally the ONLY huge guy on the court. I doubt very, very seriously if Wilt would have put up the numbers he did during the 80s, 90’s or now. With players as tall and athletic as he was……he would have been a 25/12 guy in my book. Those are still outstanding numbers, but not the ungodly numbers he used to have. *rolls eyes*
June 26th, 2007 at 1:44 pm
Bron42 says:
wilt is 7′3 playin against 6′6 white guys. his biggest competition was 6′9 bill russell. thats like you playin against your lil brother and still losin
June 26th, 2007 at 3:23 pm
kudabeen says:
I won’t even get in to the facts with you about height in the 1960 - 1973 seasons.
I’m talking talent. Walt Bellamy, Nate Thurmond, and Bill Russell aren’t the great Hall of Fame players they are, because they couldn’t play. You people crack me up when you make references to guys in the past like they weren’t fast, they couldn’t leap, they couldn’t do the thngs on the basketball court that made them Hall of Famers in todays game. Shaq, Dwight, Amare, David Robinson, Hakeem, KG, Duncan, Yao are all more talented than Wilt Chamberlain, they are all bigger, stronger, more athletic and more skilled than Wilt?
Clowns… That argument has no basis A 7-1 275+ world class athlete, who happens to be a vicous rebounder/shotblocker and also possess the discipline to work on being better and never fouling out of a single game in his career, doesn’t change with time. So who is better than Wilt? Shaq? Greg Oden? Dwight? Amare? David Robinson? Hakeem? Ralph Sampson? Adbul-Jabbar? Who!
Don’t just say the man wasn’t the best to ever do it, say why. He wasn’t as good a rebounder as ____, He wasn’t has skilled as ____, He wasn’t as good a passer as ____, He couldn’t bang downlow like____, He wasn’t as disciplined as ____, He didn’t have the mix of speed and power like ____
And have three of those blanks filled by the same guy. Don’t come at me with. Hakeem had guard skills, Shaq was bigger, Abdul -Jabbar played longer, etc. Who was better than Wilt and Why!?! Please educate me. I seem to be ignorant.
If there was a World Class track and field athlete, 7-1 275+ pounds, who could pass, defend, rebound and even hit a 12ft jumpshot along with an array of offensive moves around the basket (where he has a lengthy history of scoring 50+ at every level against all competition)…What player in NBA history would you take over him? Or is it because his name is Wilt and he played between he years of 1950-1973 that you would take Michael Jordan, Duncan, Shaq, Kobe, LeBron, Iverson, Wade, KG, Magic, Bird, Hakeem, over him.
Wilt did his thing…Ask about him:
http://www.nba.com/history/players/chamberlain_bio.html
June 26th, 2007 at 3:50 pm
Girlybballluver says:
Lebron - the so called savior of basketball plays in the EAST for christ’ sake. He couldn’t make the playoffs his first two years.
Melo - plays the forward in the much bigger, and better WEST and at least made the playoffs.
Wade even made the playoffs in the East and advanced…making game winning shots and all (not choking under pressure like the poster boy)…as a rookie.
I wish everyone would hop off of the lebron’s nuts. Sheeesh!!
June 26th, 2007 at 4:17 pm
MP says:
Amen kudabeen! Also to note, Kareem, Lanier, Russell, Reed, Cowens, Thurmond — all guys in the HOF that are 6′10 and up that Wilt played against. I’m sorry but how many HOF big men that are 6′10 and up have played in the Shaq era? Robinson, Olajuwon, Ewing, Malone (close enough at 6′9 and some), Duncan, KG. Maybe Yao, Dwight Howard and Dirk one day?
Not too much difference in the numbers. Also to expand on the world class athlete comment: Wilt was an NCAA high jump champ at Kansas that had a 45-inch vert and was a pro volleyball player. Anyone whose ever been around volleyball players, and I’m not even talking about college level guys just the club guys, knows the sport teaching them how to leap. Look at Buddinger at U of A.
He’s also the only player ever, EVER, that the NBA competition committee changed the rules of the game for to try to contain his dominance. They widened the lane, instituted offensive goaltending (tipping the ball back in above the cylinder or pulling a shot out of the air heading to the basket and redirecting it back in), and the also prohibited teams from inbounding balls over the top of the backboard from the baseline.
They actually used to inbound the ball to Wilt by throwing it over the top of the backboard and letting him go up to get it. How sick is that?
The guy would jump to grab D rebounds, and while still in the air turn and throw a half to 3/4 court pass to streaking teammates before landing. Russell invented this move and Wilt borrowed it, but seriously, who even does that now?
Watch the film. Read up on the facts. RESPECT the game.
June 26th, 2007 at 4:23 pm
Ben says:
Back in Wilt days, there was less players, less teams, less games. Wich means more talent and more intensity. There’s so much bad players in the league right now, so much guys that come from HS or college and need 4 years to grow into a real NBA player. When Wilt was playing it was against real ball players. The spurs prove my point, old team win champonship, not the young ones. Wilt era was tougher to play in (in and off the court). I know its best rookie season from the last 30 years but they mentionned Russel and not Chamberlain, that’s insane.
June 26th, 2007 at 4:26 pm
Gametime says:
Yo kudabeen,
As a player and an athlete I don’t think anyone is taking away from Wilt.
The issue simply is the Era he played in. I mean look at the career head to head numbers between Wilt vs. Russell.
Then keep in mind that there weren’t that many athletic, dominant big men of his nature or stature in his time. And also the evolution of the shot clock, and no 3 sec rule.
You could easily take your argument and flip it as to say that Shaq, Kareem, Bill, The Admiral, Tim Duncan, Hakeem, or KG (i.e.) couldn’t do what Wilt did in that Era against that competition, with those rules?
It’s the same argument with baseball with Babe Ruth. Though he was an amazing all around player, he only played against the best of the white guys (no racism). Where baseball is dominated primarily by Latino/Hispanic players now with a smattering of African Americans. Then Willie Mays and Barry Bonds come up into the debate (allegations aside).
We all respect Wilt, and always will. But everyone has their knocks. Except for maybe MJ, Tiger, and Roger…
June 26th, 2007 at 4:37 pm
MP says:
Gametime,
I can see you mean no disrepect but I think you’re confusing the Wilt era with Mikan’s. The shot clock was instituted in 1954. Well before Wilt’s rookie year and the 3 second rule is even older - it came in 1944.
June 26th, 2007 at 4:48 pm
Gametime says:
MP
You know what, you’re right. My bad. That aside though, do you think that any of the aforementioned bigs could do what Wilt did in his era in their prime?
June 26th, 2007 at 4:49 pm
Ben says:
Gametime,
I dont really think you ever looked at Wilt and Russell head to head numbers. Its a documented fact that Wilt dominated Russell (he took 55 boards against him one time). Russell had a better team but except for a small number of games he was always crushed by Wilt.
June 26th, 2007 at 5:08 pm
kudabeen says:
Thank you MP…
My point is simple. Wilt was as strong and as athletic as anyone if not moreso. To minimize his dominance, because of when he was born is absurd. So 20 years from now I guess Jordan, Magic, Bird, Shaq, etc will all be obsolete and not worth mentioning (Austin This List is a Crime against Basketball without Wilt on it. You should atone by writing a feature about how great he was).
Babe Ruth is a different arguement. Wilt didn’t benefit from bias or ducking competition. He played everyone who was anyone, it just so happens they weren’t much in comparison to him.
I’m not naive. I can’t say that if wilt came in the league today he would avg 37ppg and 28rpg. I do feel that he had all the gifts to still be better than all others. 30ppg and 18rpg or how about 29ppg and 15rpg…It’s rediculous to just toss numbers around. Let’s stick to talent…measurments…skills. Who is better than Wilt? I haven’t heard that answer…Are you saying that Everyone That played since Wilt retired is better than him and If you play in 2007 over 1967 you are automatically better? Please tell me Dime’s faithful have a better sense of basketball, history, and reality than that. A 45inch vertical, hook shot, rebound, assist, block, high jump, floor speed, on and on isn’t altered as much as you guys think over time.
I guess we should make it easy to discredit Wilt and say he used ‘Performance’ Enhancers. That’s the only way greatness at that level is acheived. Bonds wasn’t an multiple time MVP/Supertalent before he used enhancers and Wilt couldn’t have possibly been as gifted without such assistance of the drug called ‘Era’.
June 26th, 2007 at 5:12 pm
grayworld says:
i thought it was supposeto be over the last 30 years so wilt doesn’t count……read the entire article first
June 26th, 2007 at 5:13 pm
Gametime says:
Ben,
I know, I was suggesting that in favor of Wilt. As to say, he could dominate against the best competition. Because I really didn’t want to take anything away by suggesting that their weren’t other considerably good or great players he competed against during his career. Sorry I wasn’t more clear.
June 26th, 2007 at 5:21 pm
MP says:
Gametime,
I think Garnett, Duncan, Robinson and Ewing would be beasts. I think Shaq would have a tougher time than many might expect because while defense overall in this era is superior (especially on the perimeter) post defense was rougher back then.
I don’t mean they were more skilled defenders or as athletic, which overall they weren’t, but the things they did regularly in the pivot back then to defend would be considered fouls (bordering on flagrants) these days.
Kidney punches, elbows, grabbing and twisting the sides of an offensive player’s abdominal section who was trying to post up, knees to the but to force a player out of possition… it’s part of the reason why you see so many big men back then taking hook shots and turn around shots 8 to 10 feet from the basket on the regular.
That’s why Shaq would have a harder time than one might think, Olajuwon’s game (which was that of a guard in the pivot and a lot of his big go-to moves were walks) wouldn’t translate.
As for Kareem, his prime years were right when Chamberlain was on the downside of his career only putting up 20pts-18rbs! You can’t forget Kareem played in the NBA for 21 years and was way on his downside (as good as he was) when I figure most of the people posting here might have saw him play.
Walton arrived in the League like 2 years after Chamberlain retired so the eras are comparable.
June 26th, 2007 at 5:30 pm
Gametime says:
Kudabeen,
I don’t believe that’s the idea. I don’t see anywhere in writing where it states that they are better, but it does say Rookie seasons in the last 30 years, which would mean since 1977. Wilt is monster in his own right and I think for the sake of argument, or someone as knowledgeable of Wilt’s feats as you, that starting point was given as another barrier due to Wilt’s game (as he has done so many times in his career. XD) Get off the defensive; Nobody’s dissing Wilt!
And shame, that’s an unfair hit on Bonds. Bonds, I mean, he is a 7 time MVP, and no allegations even surfaced until what? 2004? I mean, It’s conceivable that most athletes take natural supplements or vitamins as long as it’s within legal standards. And though I’m not condoning use of illegal enhancements, It takes more than just physical gifts to be a great player, to anticipate, to hit, field, steal bases, hand-eye coordination, etc. Granted power will help your slugging %, HR totals, and throwing arm, it doesn’t primarily boost any other aspects of the game of baseball (and I don’t even really care about baseball >.>…but I respect it.) Still end the end if he did it when it was legal, (HGH) then there’s no harm done. Afterwards, then it’s cheating to a degree.
June 26th, 2007 at 5:38 pm
MP says:
Yo Gametime,
I think Robinson, KG, Ewing and TD would have been beasts.
But I think Shaq and Dream would have had a harder time than we might all think.
Defense today overall is superior (especially on the perimeter) but because of what they were allowed to get away with back then post defense was rougher.
Post defenders would throw kidney shots, bows to the back, knees to the butt and would do the grab and twist ( where they claw into a chunk of the side of the abdominal region of player trying to post, then they’d grab and twist!)
That’s stuff is not only illegal today but would probably get you tossed from a game. That’s why when you look at the footage, so many of the post players from that era, Chamberlain included, took 8 to 10 ft hook shots and turn arounds on the regular.
If they went close they were pushed and forcebly (and now illegally) moved away from the hoop. That’s why Shaq would have a harder time. Don’t get me wrong he’d still be very good but he’d have to put in much more work to refine his basketball skills beyond 5 to 7 feet shots.
As for Dream, his offensive game (guard in big man’s body) wouldn’t translate as well because a lot of his tricky and slick go to moves actually are travels when you focus on his feet. He would also be good but he’d lose a chunk of his repetoire and would more resemble the athletic force that came out of Houston in 84 as opposed to the sleek scorer he became.
While KG plays like a guard too, his skills translate more because he does less jukes with the ball and doesn’t tend to walk on his post moves… but that’s because he has so few. But what he can do, he does very well.
As for Kareem let’s not forget that when he retired in 87 he had played 21 seasons … in other words he played at the same time as Wilt, when Wilt was on his downside and the dipper still was putting up 20 pts and 18 brds per game!
As for Walton he came on the scene a year or two, I don’t remember exactly when, after Wilt retired. So the eras of the two weren’t that different.
June 26th, 2007 at 5:40 pm
MP says:
sorry double-post. the server told me my message didn’t post. Man all that writing!
June 26th, 2007 at 9:53 pm
basketbolista says:
I believe that LeBron is one of the most overrated players to ever set foot on an NBA arena. Melo and DWade had better rookie seasons than him yet he still won the ROY. Sure, he has the talent and the potential but the hype surrounding him is something you’d describe as an “over kill”
June 27th, 2007 at 8:10 am
Jose Chung says:
Two of the best rookies I remember were Seattle Supersonic forward Xavier McDaniel (17 and
and Golden State Warrior guard Mich Richmond (22 ppg and rookie of the year).
June 27th, 2007 at 2:37 pm
kudabeen says:
Gametime:
Sorry I didn’t insert a sense of sarcasm so that you could follow the Bond’s comment. My point as it was in my first post is Don’t Minimize a Guys Achievements Without FACTS!! Players like Bonds and Wilt are routinely minimized, but people have no facts or anything behind it. Just speculation and I believe envy.
Simple and plan. To minimize Wilt is a Diss in my book. To use ‘Era’ as a knock is lame, just as it is to speculate on Bonds who was an MVP before the accusations (I’m aware of this that’s why I mentioned). He was a Hall of Famer before the question of Steroids is my point and Wilt was revered and respected by real ball players in his day and now, so why does his DOB matter…?
For Grayworld:
I read and enjoyed the article as I usually do, but I don’t care what the time criteria is in the article frankly. If anything the article is a good excuse to toss in how totally mind blowing Wilt’s rookie year was. As soon as he said the words rookies and dominate, Wilts line should have followed. But whatever…I guess if it’s not Jordan, something current or easily accessible we don’t see it as relevant or legitimate.
I’m not some rambling pre-teen. Come with better stuff if you are going to assume that I don’t read or know what I’m talking about fam.
Done.
July 26th, 2007 at 6:14 pm
Ian says:
peeps dont be stupid talking about eras
shaq is bigger than everyone else and couldnt come close to wilts numbers in his prime
i agree with one post about the duncan robinson and ewing could play and be monsters back then
robinson is the most athletic center ver
December 22nd, 2008 at 8:01 am
Jordan says:
Ok first of all melo and wade did not have better rookie seasons than lebron…lebron carried his team, and nobody can say lebron had better team mates than melo or wade that’s just stupid…wade and melo did make the playoffs…who the fuck cares…the MVP voting is before the playoffs anyways…lebron did more with less help he deserved the award…and for the wilt arguement, yes he was a very talented player but you are giving him way too much credit…he was good for his time..if shaq played against babies he could score 100 points too! And Robinson was a more athletic center than wilt…my point is wilt would be able to do much against today players…Jordan is the greatest player ever and that’s why people talk about him and not wilt, it has nothing to do with the name…and for ppl talking about lebrons hype…he’s living up to it, his career has been way better than Melos or wades…