First there was the initial “Wow” of the fact that Kevin Garnett actually got traded. Then there was the realization that not only would KG, Paul Pierce and Ray Allen make for an instant championship contender, they’d comprise the most fun video-game team since Shawn Kemp and Gary Payton on NBA Jam. Now we’re sinking into the next phase, asking the obvious question: Can the C’s actually win with that supporting cast? After the Big Three you’ve got Rajon Rondo at the point (young, can’t shoot) and Kendrick Perkins at center (young, serviceable at best), and the worst bench in the East. Boston made a couple moves to shore up the bench yesterday, inking Eddie House and Jackie Manuel to one-year deals. House can shoot, no doubt, but he also pulls a lot — you can just see him jacking treys with 19 seconds left on the shot clock while a wide-open Ray looks at him like “Dude, what are you doing?” and KG has to pull House aside after games to try and talk some sense into him. And Manuel is a good defender, but he played a total of 4 NBA games last year; was he really the answer? If Boston wanted a guy to defend on the wing, they should have made a run at Ime Udoka. And they still don’t have a point guard who’s older than 21 … Danny Ainge did say the C’s aren’t done yet, so look for more moves to come. Boston is said to have an eye on Dikembe Mutombo and P.J. Brown, but then there’s another rumor that Ryan Gomes could get cut by Minnesota (why?) and then re-sign with Boston … Yesterday afternoon, we dropped some behind-the-scenes video from KG’s last cover shoot with Dime. Check it out, dude is intense … From the Minnesota angle, the two main questions are, 1) How will Randy Wittman figure out the backcourt rotation?, and 2) Where does Sebastian Telfair’s career go from here? On the first one, the presumed starting backcourt in Minnesota would be Randy Foye at the point and Ricky Buckets at the two, with Corey Brewer at the three. Then again, you could start Foye, Rashad McCants at the guards and Davis at the three. Or Telfair at the point, Foye at the two, and Gerald Green at the three. Lots of guys there with only so many minutes to go around. For Question No. 2, this could be the best thing to happen to Bassy at this point in his career. There’s not going to be any pressure on him in Minnesota. The kid still has promise, after all … While most of us hit up Reebok Club to play ball last night (where we saw Michael Rappaport), our guy Jon stayed home and sent us this: “Garnett was at the Red Sox/Orioles game to throw out the first pitch. He was wearing a #5 Sox jersey, and threw a perfect strike to Big Papi. The crowd went nuts, as you’d imagine.” … Ex-T’wolf Troy Hudson, aka T-Hud, dropped his solo debut album Undrafted earlier this month. According to the St. Paul Pioneer Press, it sold 78 copies its first week … Baron Davis is in as one of the honorary coaches for this month’s Elite 24 high school showcase at Rucker Park. Last year the coaches were Ben Gordon and Jason Kidd … Gilbert Arenas on his NBA.com blog: “If you’re swimming in the water and a shark bites you, that’s called trespassing. That is called trespassing. That is not a shark attack. A shark attack is if you’re chilling at home, sitting on your couch, and a shark comes in and bites you; now that’s a shark attack. Now, if you’re chilling in the water, that is called invasion of space.” … Will Blalock, the ‘06 Draft’s Mr. Irrelevant, signed with a pro team in Israel … Good thing the Hawks got Acie Law. In the past week, both Speedy Claxton and Tyronn Lue had minor knee surgery. Yes, folks, ATL finally did something right. And from what we saw in the summer leagues, we really like the frontcourt duo of Al Horford and Shelden Williams … We’re out like House’s patience …
Related posts:
August 2nd, 2007 at 5:25 am
Steffen Herder says:
Baron Davis for president!
http://www.squidoo.com/BaronDavis/
August 2nd, 2007 at 8:17 am
Celts Fan says:
I would nut myself if we somehow got Gomes back! That would sure up a few holes and make us much more versatil. I’d say there’s no way, but it’s Kevin McHale we’re talking about…
August 2nd, 2007 at 9:27 am
Jason says:
“Then there was the realization that not only would KG, Paul Pierce and Ray Allen make for an instant championship contender”
LOL you gotta be joking?
A team with NO PG, NO CENTER, NO BENCH, Brian Scalabrine as the 6th man, two of the three “stars” can’t even play defense, KG a career stat-buffer who makes no one better, is going to be a championship contender?
Good luck getting past Chicago, Detroit, Miami, and Cleveland.
August 2nd, 2007 at 10:08 am
Celts Fan says:
Jason, Rajon Rondo is a very good PG and will be one of the best very soon. He’s an all-NBA caliber defender who’s lightning quick and a great distributor. He’s fearless and will bang w/ the bigs trying to get boards. Ya he can’t shoot, but he doesn’t need to on a team w/ KG, Pierce, and Allen.
Also, we’re infinitely better than last year’s Cavs, and a team w/ KG, Ray Allen, and Paul Pierce has a legit shot at beating anyone in a 7 game series. I’m not saying we will, but to say we can’t is dumb and proves you have no business talking about basketball.
August 2nd, 2007 at 10:17 am
IGP says:
The C’s are nasty…even though Rando can’t shoot he won’t need to do too much on offense, and if he can defend and pass alright that should be enough. The bench sucks, but I did hear Gomes would probably be back, plus maybe Brevin Knight and they just got House. That’s not too bad. LeBron really did do it pretty much by himself. Remember when he kicked it out to Donyell for a WIDE OPEN three and he bricked it? That’s not going to happen in Boston.
August 2nd, 2007 at 10:20 am
Jason says:
“Also, we’re infinitely better than last year’s Cavs, and a team w/ KG, Ray Allen, and Paul Pierce has a legit shot at beating anyone in a 7 game series”
OK now I know you’re clueless.
Beating ANYONE? The C’s can beat the Spurs, Rockets, Mavs, Suns, Nuggets, Jazz, Pistons, Heat in a 7 game series? LOL!
“LeBron really did do it pretty much by himself.”
No, LeBron made ALL his teammates better, something Garnett can’t do.
August 2nd, 2007 at 10:53 am
Austin Burton says:
Does KG really have to make Pierce and Allen better?
August 2nd, 2007 at 10:54 am
Celts Fan says:
Jason, the Celtics absolutely CAN beat anyone in a 7 game series. You’re telling me if Pierce, KG, and Ray Allen all have a monster series (entirely possible) there’s anyone that you can flat out say, we can’t beat. I’m not saying here that we’re definitely winning a ring. I’m just saying I like how we match up against anyone and that we have the ability to beat anyone. You don’t know what you’re talking about. Also, KG’s one of only 4 or 5 guys in NBA HISTORY that have averaged 20ppg, 10rpg, and 4apg in 5 straight years (he’s at 9 now, an NBA record) so he obviously can make his teammates better, but, to quote Tommy Heinsohn (about Andrew Bogut), “You can’t squeeze water from a rock!”
I say again, you don’t know what you’re talking about Jason. Go to a WNBA board or something…
August 2nd, 2007 at 11:00 am
Austin Burton says:
Miami has Shaq/Wade as the Big Two. Their PGs are Smush/J-Will, who aren’t exactly a killer combo. If Toine isn’t totally washed-up yet, he’s at least in his last spin cycle. You’ve got a decent PF in Haslem, and the bench is Zo, Daequan Cook, Doleac, Dorrell Wright, Simien and Chris Quinn. Are they really THAT much better than Boston?
August 2nd, 2007 at 11:23 am
Ian says:
ill go with jason on this one but not with all those teams
i also think garnett is a stat buffer , cant be counted on in crunch time and doesnt make anyone better
hes a really good player but not the mega star people many think
the 20 10 4 thing and all those weird things people tend to overrate
lets say someone avgs 3 3 3 3 3 thats unique but does it make him better than a 20 10 3 guy
on the east ill say only chicago is really better
detroit is overrated and miami is old
but in the finals the celts cant beat utah phoenix dallas
and for sure they cant play the spurs doesnt matter how hot they get
for one manu can play pierce bowen can d up allen and timmy is better than kg
August 2nd, 2007 at 11:33 am
Jason says:
Celts fan, I can understand you are excited about Garnett, but you are WAY WAY WAY off here.
Have you ever considered how many PPG Pierce and Allen give up on Defense?
LOL!!!!!!! You think they can beat the Spurs?
Who guards Tony Parker?
Bruce Bowen on Pierce, Ginobli (most underrated SG in the last decade) on Allen, and Parker doing layup drills on Rondo.
YOU ARE SO SO OFF.
“KG’s one of only 4 or 5 guys in NBA HISTORY that have averaged 20ppg, 10rpg, and 4apg in 5 straight years (he’s at 9 now, an NBA record) so he obviously can make his teammates better”
How does that make his teammates better? Like I said, he’s a stat buffer.
Chris Webber has also been a stat buffer, but he involved his teammates more.
I have no reservations in what I said. Lan is completely right too.
Let’s also not forget that Boston’s head coach is DOC RIVERS. Are you trying to tell me this pathetic coach can outcoach the geniuses like Jerry Sloan, Gregg Popovich, Rich Adelman, Avery Johnson?
Celt’s Fan has the Celtics so far down his throat, he rejects everything else. Ask any NBA Analyst in the world if the Celts can beat the Spurs or a western juggernaut in a 7 game series and they’ll die of laughter
August 2nd, 2007 at 11:38 am
Jason says:
“Also, KG’s one of only 4 or 5 guys in NBA HISTORY that have averaged 20ppg, 10rpg, and 4apg in 5 straight years”
And what has this amounted to? 12 years of being a loser
August 2nd, 2007 at 11:48 am
Celts Fan says:
and when they gave him a decent team (before McHale screwed him out of 4 #1s in his absolute prime) he went to the conference finals. Also, a layup drill on Rondo? Are you retarded? Rondo’s one guy that could stay w/ Tony Longoria. In terms of defense, we have KG and Perk to protect the rim and a future all-NBA defender in Rondo on the perimeter. We’ll be better defensively than you think. Also, people would’ve died of laughter if you’d said Detroit would beat LA 4 years ago, but they did. Anything can happen. We have the fire power to win any 7 game series. I never said we definitely would (which I’ve said 8 times now, but you choose to ignore), but you can’t say a team sporting those 3 guys has no chance.
August 2nd, 2007 at 11:55 am
Jason says:
You obviously have not seen the sickness of Tony Parker with the ball.
Perkins? He is a joke.
No, I knew Detroit would beat LAL because that team had CHEMISTRY, GREAT DEFENSE, no egos, and a G.O.A.T. coach.
For your information, fire power gets you nowhere. If it did, the 2000 Blazers, 2005 Mavs, current PHX Suns, and 1999 Rockets would all have trophies.
Chemistry, veterans, and defense win championships. Not a bunch of career losers who can score points, but two of which don’t play defense.
Anyway, enjoy Garnett, who is an outstanding player. You also didn’t address any points I made about coaching or how those numbers indicate Garnett makes others better.
Thx.
August 2nd, 2007 at 12:10 pm
FK in Toronto says:
Wow - a lot of sleeping on Toronto - not even brought into the fray discussing the East.
Bosh has done a great job of containing Garnett head-to-head over the years (with the Raps winning the last six straight against him goign back to 2005).
Pierce and Allen are lethal, but I’ll take a supporting cast of Bargnani, Ford, Parker, Calderone, Garbojosa, Kapono, Delfino and Rasho any day.
See you fools in the playoffs.
August 2nd, 2007 at 12:28 pm
Celts Fan says:
Jason, I’ve said a million times that I’m talking in terms of “can” not “will.” Calm down. and Perkins is not a joke. He’s probably better suited as a backup, but his strengths (rebounding and blocking shots) are all we need from him, so he works. And if you’ve ever watched him play, you know KG can make others better, but the numbers don’t show it when you have no one to pass to. 9 times out of 10 in Minn., KG forcing up a shot w/ 3 guys on him was better than passing to an open teammate. The one year he had talent around him, they went far.
You are right about one thing though, Doc Rivers is a joke and should have been fired long ago.
August 2nd, 2007 at 12:43 pm
Ian says:
im not taking anything away from the wolves and that monster series that garnett had vs the kings
but if the spurs and lakers (which they did) both woulda beaten the wolves
the kings were chokers and couldnt beat any good teams in the playoffs
celts fan i know u said CAN not WOULD but no they CANT
August 2nd, 2007 at 12:56 pm
Celts Fan says:
We’ll see. I think you guys aren’t giving enough credit to one of the best trios in the league in years. Again, not saying we’ll win a ring, but there’s no reason to believe that there’s anyone in the league we can’t compete with. Anyone that says otherwise is just plain wrong.
August 2nd, 2007 at 1:18 pm
Frenchy says:
maybe the celts can bring back the kandi-man to roam the paint! i’m sure he would come at a nice discount
i’m with “FK in Toronto” on this one…dem Raptor boys are gonna run tings again this year in the ATL
i can’t wait for the first home game against Vince Quitter!
August 2nd, 2007 at 1:31 pm
Celts Fan says:
The Raptors are still a year away from really contending for a Finals spot though. Let’s see how they do w/out Mo Pete, if Garbojosa can come back from that horrific injury, and how Kapono (you guys overpaid, but a nice pickup) can gel into the team. I like what you guys are doing though…
August 2nd, 2007 at 1:40 pm
Frenchy says:
No doubt we’re still a minute away from the finals but anything with the word “playoffs” in our schedule is much better than any other team in the city has done in a loooooong while…so you can see our excitement!
And we may have definitely paid higher than market value but at least we didn’t “Rashard Lewis” ourselves!
Looks like i won’t have to wait long for Toronto/Jersey rematch - TO’s first home game is agains Jersey (schedule just posted on nba site)!
August 2nd, 2007 at 1:49 pm
Celts Fan says:
Very true. Seems like you’re building around the “team first” mantra, and playing the right way. Gotta love Chris Bosh surrounded w/ experienced international talent. Landing Colangelo was HUGE too…
August 2nd, 2007 at 1:50 pm
Celts Fan says:
Rasho on the other hand…
August 2nd, 2007 at 1:52 pm
Celts Fan says:
and I’m a HUGE fan of Bargnani. He seems to have that killer instinct and willingness to bang that some outside-oriented bigs (looking at you Dirk) are lacking.
August 2nd, 2007 at 2:01 pm
Ian says:
celts my man i rather have rasho than kandi man
August 2nd, 2007 at 2:01 pm
Frenchy says:
and bargnani’s release on that 3 is QUICK! he’s heartless on that 3 line
but it’ll be interesting to see what happens in 3 or 4 years as EVERYONE’s contract including Colangelo’s is up at pretty much the exact same time!
August 2nd, 2007 at 2:13 pm
JOSEF says:
Don’t sleep on Rajon Rondo. Yeah he’s got no J, but the Celts don’t need offense from him anyway. Rajon, along w/ Tony Allen, will give you some of the most insane perimeter D in the East. You fantasy hoopheads can recall that Rajon has had nights last season where his box score showed Gerald Wallace-like numbers in the steals category.
Oh, and about the Smack comment “…not only would KG, Paul Pierce and Ray Allen make for an instant championship contender, they’d comprise the most fun video-game team since Shawn Kemp and Gary Payton on NBA Jam”….what about Larry Johnson & Alonzo Mourning of the Charlotte Hornets? Man that was fun..we’d smoke everyone using this tandem. It was amazing that the original NBA Jam version of Zo could hit 3’s like he was Mark Price..
August 2nd, 2007 at 2:16 pm
supafly says:
Boston may be able to hang with Toronto with their starting 5 out there, but as soon as they go to the bench, they are going to get DRILLED by the Raptors backups….and that’s putting it lightly.
August 2nd, 2007 at 2:18 pm
Buck says:
One question I have yet to hear,”How long do before Doc Rivers is on the hot seat?” Dude is a good filler coach (i.e when you’re youngf and rebuilding or stuck in mediocrity), but I do not see them going anywhere with him at the helm. Once he get canned (I doubt he makes through the year), who’s out there who get them over the top?
August 2nd, 2007 at 2:24 pm
Celts Fan says:
I’d MUCH rather have Kandiman than Rasho (keeping in mind their salaries and cap ramifications) Kandiman will probably be making just over the vet’s minimum, while Rasho was upwards of $8M I think (if not more)
Thank you Josef! Glad to see someone who actually watched the Celtics last year on here. Rondo is sick.
I remember using that LJ/Zo combo in NBA Jam. Unstoppable…
Also, to those who think our bench is weak (which it is) don’t sleep on the fact that there shouldn’t be many minutes a game (assuming all 3 are healthy) when all 3 of Pierce, KG, and Ray are on the bench. A good coach (damn) will find a way to keep at least one out there most times…
August 2nd, 2007 at 2:25 pm
Celts Fan says:
and to the Doc Rivers question, he should have been canned by last Thanksgiving, so who knows, but the sooner the better…
August 2nd, 2007 at 2:26 pm
K-Dizzle says:
Wow. Could the haters(Jason) please wait til the all-star break before they rip on the Celts…and I’m a Laker fan. First of all, who said anything about beating the Spurs? and why is Boston being compared to them? These ain’t your daddy’s Celtics.They haven’t had a threesome like this since Bird, McHale and Parish. If you mentioned the Celts and playoffs one month ago, you’d been crazy, now they bein ripped cuz they improved and jumped into the top 4 in the Leastern Conference? Kevin Garnett’s a loser cuz he averaged 20-10-4 on teams where the other starters wouldn’t start for last year’s Florida team? I don’t know if you watch basketball, but NOBODY wins on their own and if you watched the playoffs, you’d know that Lebron made nobody better. He lit up Detroit in the 4th quarter for 29 straight while his teammates watched the show. How’d the finals go? You even have a team? and you wouldn’t want KG? Ask Kobe. Put down the pipe. I’m not even gonna touch the issue of whether Rondo can play any defense. You’ve OBVIOUSLY never seen dude play. If the Celts even make the Finals, it’s been a good year. Kevin Garnett’s a former MVP, bringin the lunchpail type who DOES make players better. It’s not his fault McHale’s a jackass who couldn’t find talent on Playstation and that Marbury bailed when they should have been the next Stock-Mailman. KG’s GOIN to the Hall of Fame. Respect the legends of the game and appreciate that you got to see a dude who put up 20-10-4 when his team gives him no chance to win. Now go watch tape
August 2nd, 2007 at 2:35 pm
supafly says:
There is no way Boston plays KG, Pierce, and Allen an average of 40 minutes per game. That would be suicide considering the recent injuries to Pierce and Allen. So lets say they average around 35-38 minutes a game. There are still 10-13 minutes that need to be filled at each position. Sure- you obviously don’t sit all 3 at the same time, but that’s plenty long enough for a team with a deep bench to do damage. Eddie House and Scalabrine just aren’t going to cut it.
August 2nd, 2007 at 2:42 pm
Bron42 says:
I agree with alittle bit of both arguments.
A) anyone sayin Kg is just a stat buffer is a moron. hes been one of the most consistent guys in the NBA. Is he gonna make gold out of straw? no! but you cant suddenly make it like hes a no talent bust. I said it before and i’ll say it again, people can’t keep jumpin on his case like he was in control of who the team put around him. If you put time duncan on a team of high school players, no matter how good people say duncan is, that team would still suck and he suddenly becomes jsut a stat buffer. Thats pretty much what KG has had to deal with his whole career. hes the barry sanders of basketball…where everyones like “he was good, but couldnt win anything” this isn’t tennis, you need a supporting cast to win. Duncan has a system BUILT around his needs. So if Tim has a bad night, theres guys who can step up without him. KG has guys who wouldn’t start on 90% of the otehr teams in the nba. So if KG has a bad game, they get blown out by 50. Duncan has guys who played for national teams for how many years before comin over. KGs most traveled players are randy foye and mccants. So again, lets not make it like KG has been playing with allstars and just milked his paycheck for years while never gettin over the top sort of like say….steve nash? KG has put up number, done pretty much EVERYTHING in his power to win and carry his team and managment didnt help him.
As for the celts…The have no bench, two of their stars are injury prone and not really known for defense. So while I don’t think their automatically winning the east, it does make them better than teams like the cavs and probably wizards. I still think the bulls can hang with them and if miami makes a few moves their still in the top with detroit also.
As for doc rivers…hes a decent coach who has never really been in a position with a good team. Its not like hes some air head.
My question is why are you both havin such a heated argument over the internet about something that only time will really tell like you’ll change eachothers minds lol.
August 2nd, 2007 at 3:05 pm
Celts Fan says:
Because it beats work!
August 2nd, 2007 at 3:07 pm
Celts Fan says:
Doc Rivers is like Norv Turner or Mike Martz in the NFL. If he’s on your staff, you love it, but you don’t want him calling the shots on gameday. He’s great at developing young talent, but setting and sticking to a competant rotation has been his downfall. This year he shouldn’t have much choice who he plays, so let’s see if he really can coach…
August 2nd, 2007 at 4:04 pm
smity says:
Doc Rivers IS kinda terrible when it comes to coaching…and everyone thought it was t-mac’s fault for losing in orlando
August 2nd, 2007 at 4:32 pm
Eric says:
Wow, a lot has gone on here today. My man Jason, you take a deep breath and count to ten yet? I hope so, for the message boards sake.
Before I respond to some of Jason’s commentary, Bron42, how does Pierce get classified as injury prone? One freakish injury last season and he is injury prone, check his games played each year and the beating he takes. You made very good points about KG.
Ok Jason, K-Dizzle got after you a bit and now so will I. KG is a loser? Do you watch the game at all? This guy is heart and soul each and every night. His intensity and effort in practice and on game nights alone is going to raise the level of every Celtic from Pierce to Allen to Scal to Pruitt, they will all be working at a higher level. Does that mean they automatically win the East? No. But this team will have chemistry, there is no doubt.
Pierce, Allen and Garnett have the same goal, win. Period. Pierce has been an average defender, you think he is gonna slip on defense this year or pick it up? You think Ray Allen is gonna let his man torch him?
Obviosuly the games are played on the court not by our debates, but something called Pride and Passion is going to be very evident in regards to the Celtics this season. Defense will be stressed from day one with KG leading the charge.
Yes, they need more depth. Yes, Rondo needs to get better qucikly.
Let’s just see what happens between now and training camp as far as the roster goes.
It is easy to pick on Doc, why bother…
August 2nd, 2007 at 4:36 pm
kudabeen says:
Thanks Bron42 for bring some semblance of inteligencia back into the fold…
To call Ray Allen, Paul Pierce, and KG Losers or to even try to argue with an idiot that would say such a thing is pure ignorance. Kevin Garnett is a rare talent with a oh so familiar storyline. Hall of Fame player who has the misfortune of being a part of a poorly run franchise. Give me KG over anyone else in the league to start my team with. His passions infuses confidence in the hearts of those he play with (if they have heart to begin with). Look at his playoff losses and his overall performances against the best. He competes, but what is the team around him doing. When they were lossing in the playoffs, The wolves was favorites to beat the top tier teams in the league. If you don’t respect KG, then why are you in a basketball forum discussing basketball, when you clearly don’t enjoy it enough to watch it?
Ray Allen is a loser, because of last season? Because he had his best individual season on a losing team? because he never played with a great cast? When he was with the Bucks, he had Glen Robinson on his squad, so that meant no championship, but plenty of scoring and playoff bow outs. Then when he got to the Sonics there wasn’t a funtioning Shawn kemp and Gary Payton waiting for him… Ray is one of the most talented offensive weapons to play and his defense is not as bad as advertised. He’s not bodying cats up, but he has pride enough to not sit on his hands and watch a guy give him buckets. Give me Ray in my top 10 SGs to play in the last 20 years…
Paul Pierce has to be loser right? All those great teams he played on and no ring? That guy sucks…All-star appearences aside, All-NBA 3rd team aside, Being incredibly resilent after stabbing broken teeth, and various other injuries that lesser players use as excuses to stay home aside, incredible playoff performances’s aside, scoring and rebounding aside, being called one the better one-on-one defenders in the league by Michael jordan aside…He is a real loser…
These are the top tier of the NBA talent who aren’t just flashy, but can really play and are complete players. Not one of them are ball hogs, none of them lack the fortitude to accept the challenge of getting after it on D, taking a last shot, or not taking it and letting someone else shine. This type of Trio deserves all the hype, because they have not only proven to be great basketball players, but great professionals and examples for the game. I don’t think they are a lock for championships, but I will say their supporting case as it stands is not as bad as what people are saying. Glen Davis is going to scorer around the basket, make space and rebound. Rondo is going beat his man off the dribble, force numerous turnovers, and give the overall energy needed at the 1 to aid these great professionals in winning, Perkins will provide the muscle so KG doesn’t have to do all theheavy lifting he’s been doing. Tony allen, if healthy, is an above average defender and scorer in the NBA (i guess once injuried you are talentless). Clown Scalabrine, but he knocks down open shots and makes smart plays, even if he looks gross doing it. Powe will be more than servicable in a limited role to provide reboundind and toughness off the bench.
The Celtics are a Veteran 4/5 and 1 from being totally legit to contend. Time will tell though. What has already been written about these three stars over time warrants respect, not empty baseless arguments on how they are losers and can’t contend with the Western conference.
Related, but an a side nonetheless, I wonder how much of Doc Rivers’ rep is related to his background as a player and his race. What great teams did he ruin and limited their potential to be great. How many games were lost in the end from his horrible decisions. His teams usually weren’t in games, because the players made it so. To solve this he changed his lineups often trying to find a player with desire to be a consistent producer. His teams have sucked. The Magic team that was overachieving is forgotten. why? T-Mac mouthing off and lossing to a great Detroit team is Doc’s fault. Whatever… The jury is still out on Doc, but this season won’t sway me one way or the other on how good a coach he is, because the game is played on the floor and he has three of he best doing out there. If he gives the team orders to run off a cliff into a ridged stones and one of those veterans don’t say ‘Hey, coach! how about this play instead’ That still wouldn’t be his fault, with this team, it will be on those veterans on the floor. Coaching can only do so much. 70% of the game is on the players 20% on the coach, and 10% on how the Refs are calling the game (which is sad, because this should be 0%)
Just my thoughts
August 2nd, 2007 at 4:45 pm
kudabeen says:
meant to say KG’s wolves weren’t the favorites to win in the West.
August 2nd, 2007 at 5:34 pm
IGP says:
Playing with consumate professionals like KG, Ray and P Double will make someone play better. You’re telling me that if you had any of those 3 on your team telling you to step it up you wouldn’t do it? I think the Bulls should be the favorites to win the East, but the Celtics are still a very good team. I think the Pistons have some great experience, but they are older and do not like as good as they once were. I think it will be the Bulls or Celtics in the finals.
August 2nd, 2007 at 5:36 pm
smity says:
when i said that doc was a terible coach, i shouldnt have. i should have said that much of the crticism against him comes from the fact that given the situations that he’s been in, hes failed thus far to become something other than a bad coach. in many cases bad coaches fail at doing the things that good and great coaches are known for doing. Good and Great coaches teach and inspire their players and they also command and earn the respect of their players. now i wont go out and say that doc is a terrible coach (i was having a “dumb eric”( not to be confused with the “respectable eric)” moment when i said that doc was terrible. i will say that he hasnt proven himself to be good yet so like kudabeen said, the jury is still out on him.
the people’s general perception of doc (especially here) has little to nothing to do with “race” (unless youre talking about the one true race which has the word “human” before it) so i wouldnt even attribute his being perceived a bad coach to his ethnicity…and semi unrelated/ just for the hell of it- good coaches dont get choked out in practice.
August 2nd, 2007 at 6:25 pm
Diction says:
wow, Celts haters. just stop it. If KG and the wolves can almost win the west (and they probably would have if cassell didn’t get hurt) w/ Spree and Cassell. What makes you think they can’t win it all w/ Allen and Pierce. You think Cassell and Spree were out there playin any Defense? They were veterans, which matters in the playoffs. And Rondo does have crazy D. and so does KG. He still clogs up the Middle. They got a decent shot. and they’re gonna be real fun to watch unless Doc screws it up.
August 2nd, 2007 at 8:39 pm
Jason says:
“KG is a loser? Do you watch the game at all? This guy is heart and soul each and every night”
Yes, I do. I’ve been a diehard NBA fan for 2 decades now. KG is a stud who is one of the most talented players in the history, but that does not translate to winning. KG has had 12 years to show something, and to say that his 5h!t supporting casts took fault all that time is entirely wrong. KG has had Ricky Davis, Joe Smith, and a bunch of above-average talent to work with in the last decade, but has proved nothing.
“Pierce has been an average defender, you think he is gonna slip on defense this year or pick it up? You think Ray Allen is gonna let his man torch him?”
Yes, actually I do. Pierce has put some years on him since he was a true superstar back in the early part of this millenium. He is slower, has never been a known defender. As for Ray Allen, he’s only a 6″5 SG, plus he has never played defense, plus he’s been around for quite a few years, so do the calculations.
I’m done arguing. Don’t have time to read all these posts.
I think the Celtics are overrated and will be fully exposed when Pierce and Allen get injured and Garnett is stuck playing with Rondo and a bunch of NBDL scrubs.
Good luck.
August 2nd, 2007 at 8:42 pm
Jason says:
And just for the record, here are some similar scenarios over the last decade of teams loaded with 3 or more studs:
SAC Kings (2001-2003 or so)
Mike Bibby, Peja, Chris Webber. All three were true stars, but couldn’t win (no defense)
Houston Rockets (1999)
Scottie Pippen The Dream Barkley
August 2nd, 2007 at 9:12 pm
George says:
@ Celtics Fan:
“one of the best trios in the league in years”
On paper, they may be one of the best trios in years, but it’s still the off-season. They haven’t played a single game together and you’re already predicting they can go deep into the playoffs. Can we at least wait until the preseason to see them play at least one game together? And, enough of this “we” shit. Unless, of course, Celtics Fan is actually Rondo.
August 2nd, 2007 at 9:14 pm
IGP says:
Hey Smity…good point…this has NOTHING to do with race…there is only one race and that is the human race…skin color is like eye color or hair color…Doc just has to make this happen with this Celts team…I think he will, but only time will tell.
August 3rd, 2007 at 12:20 am
Ian says:
bron
true that if u switch timmy for kg the wolves arent winning
but they make the playoffs and the spurs arent as dominant as they are
question for u if u r starting a team who do u pick 1st timmy or kg
admiral and elliot my nba jam combo
August 3rd, 2007 at 12:23 am
Ian says:
kudabeen
Give me KG over anyone else in the league to start my team with. His passions infuses confidence in the hearts of those he play with
sure take kg
ill take duncan and knock your team out of the first round if u make it
August 3rd, 2007 at 12:58 am
Matthew says:
You’re crazy if you don’t pick the greatest PF of all time as the man to start your team with.
Tim Duncan
August 3rd, 2007 at 11:58 am
kudabeen says:
What team? I think KG is best player in the league. You can compare him to duncan all you want. Fact is. He never played with the players Duncan has, he didn’ in the league and has never played with legit Hall of Famers Coach or players. All that and he still competes and produces at a high level.
So Duncan, is a better scorer, passer, defender, leader, rebounder, and has a higher IQ than KG? Ifyou believe that we operate clearly with totally different paradigms. We are talking about individual talent, not team success here. Tim had all the benefits that KG wasn’t afforded. Not Tim’s fault, but it doesn’t make him better than Kevin.
Whe I say give me KG it’s not just a “How many rings” thing it’s spirit and personality. It’s the heavy community work. Have you ever had the chance to talk to KG?? He is as personable and seems as ginuine as a person can be. I never had that opportunity with Duncan and cannot knock him at all, but when he is choking at the line, when he is being outplayed by Amare Stodamire and just having a bad overall game the Spurs still win. KG doesn’t have that and never really has. Even the year with Spree nd Cassell, KG was the man for 3/4ths of the game and Sam/Spree were great closers.
Give me KG like I said over anyone. On whole he is the best the NBA has to offer. Tim is a Hall of Famer no doubt. A top-notch stud and consistent. I just rate fire and all the intangibles KG brings higher. not fair to compare team success to individual talent in their case.
August 3rd, 2007 at 12:53 pm
Bron42 says:
i swear, people keep lookin at it as a team thing when they say duncan is better than KG lol. When you ask someone “who would you rather have KG or Tim” the team stats go out the window. It becomes who would bust who’s ass in a game of one on one and theres NO way u tell me Duncan owns KG. Duncan has had a crazy supporting cast since he stepped into the league and the only reason that happen is cuz the spurs had one bad fluke year so he was drafted by a team that should of still been in the playoffs. So instead of goin to a 12-59 team, he went to a 50 win team that already had david robinson and tons of other vets like mario ellie, avery johnson, etc…KG hasn’t had ANYONE…when you consider his best teammate was MAYBE sam cassel and compare that to duncans best teammates as possibly david robinson OR tony parker OR bruce bowen OR even manu, your gonna tell me tim duncan has to carry the spurs by himself all these years? In the finals, how often did u hear about duncan having a dominant game? he didn’t have to cuz parker did all the work. How many games do you hear when KG has a sub par game and the twolves won? barely ever cuz he had no cast. Thats all it comes down to. So you cant compare a guy with no help, to a guy with all the help in the basketball world and use that to say who is better. Peyton manning becomes arron brooks if he doesnt have a lineman who block and recievers who cant catch. same with basketball.
August 3rd, 2007 at 3:51 pm
kudabeen says:
Amen…
August 4th, 2007 at 2:25 pm
Ian says:
lol
garnett better than duncan because who wins one on one
hahahahahahahahahaha
people dont compare timmy to a good player on a bad team
compare him to alltime greats
check timmys teams and compare it to the past
lets check jordan had a better supporting cast than tim
so did bird
so did magic
and tim wins like they did
please just shut up and watch the man play
and on the the comment about timmy going to a 50 win team
didnt jordan retire and the bulls still won 50 and the knicks BARELY beat them in the second round
take timmy out of the spurs and they dont make it past the first round
gets your facts straight when talking about the greatest power foward ever
im still laughing about the part that timmy chokes and that garnett has a higher IQ
garnett sucks in crunch time timmy always takes over thats the difference between them
u want more proof check out the 2000 playoffs duncan got injured before the playoffs and that awesome supporting cast with david robinson lost 3 1 to a bad phoenix team in the first round
you are comparing garnett to a 10 time all nba (9first team)
10 time all d
2 times mvp
3 times finals mvp (something garnett will NEVER win)
puh please
u r asumming garnett would win if he was a traded for duncan
lol
what u 2 just said is like saying that well richmond is just as good or better than jordan because he does that on a team that doesnt have the talent
didnt magic johnson land on a 50 win team
when he was drafted
get your facts straight and use the same criteria for everyone before talking out your asses