Q let the dogs out. (Photo. Jordan Brand)You think Quentin Richardson regrets talking reckless about the Celtics now? In Thursday’s New York Post, Q was quoted about their date with Boston last night: “We’re not in awe of them. They ain’t won no championships. They have a good record right now, but that don’t matter. Dallas showed that [last season].” He added, “They’re not that deep of a team. After those three, there’s a significant drop-off.” It doesn’t matter that Q’s statements were all true; why open your mouth and provide motivational material for an opponent who could be ripe for an upset (the loss to Cleveland and the near-loss to Charlotte) and when your own team is playing so well (wins over Utah and Chicago)? Of course Doc Rivers posted Q’s quote on the C’s chalkboard, and Kevin Garnett later admitted it got the team amped up to go out and open up a Pandora’s Box on the Knicks. It was ugly, like 300-style ugly (”Give them nothing! But take from them EVERYTHING!”), a clinic on both ends of the floor. In the second quarter, Boston was up 20. In the third it was 30. In the fourth it was 40, then the lead stretched to 50 (”Cuuuuurtis!”) with about seven minutes left. The final tally was 104-59, and the only thing that saved NY from its all-time lowest score in franchise history was a halfcourt bomb by Nate Robinson at the buzzer … Nate’s shot also made him the only Knick to hit double figures (11 pts), while Big Baby scored more (13 pts) than anyone in orange-and-blue. No one on the Celtics put up crazy individual numbers, but that’s mostly because KG, Pierce and Ray didn’t have to play much more than 25 minutes apiece … And even with the huge lead late in the ballgame, Boston’s bench was still playing inspired defense and not giving anything away. They had a little something to prove as well … TNT was going to show a clip from Isiah’s post-game press conference, but all they got was a freeze-frame of Isiah’s defeated facial expression, which was just perfect for the moment. Said Barkley: “The problem with the Washington Generals is that the Harlem Globetrotters were just too good.” When they got the video working, Isiah said he thought his players all came into Boston looking to make their own mark on national TV rather than making a mark as a team … Gutsy move by George Karl to have Anthony Carter guarding Kobe last night, and it looked like it would work for a while. Denver went up by 17 in the first half and Kobe wasn’t killing, but then Mamba (24 pts, 7 asts) led a comeback and capped it with a runner at the halftime buzzer in K-Mart’s eye two make it a two-point game … The Lakers took control in the second half and turned it into a rout; Kobe barely played (if at all) in the fourth quarter, chilling on the bench while Sasha Vujacic and Luke Walton put on The Bong Show. Carmelo got so frustrated that he throat-checked Vujacic and got himself ejected … Before everything fell apart, ‘Melo was busting Lamar Odom’s ass. He wasn’t even really giving him any moves, just pulling jumpers in his face … And right before ‘Melo got ejected, J.R. Smith hit an amazing shot that won’t make any highlight reels because, 1) It didn’t count since J.R. had been fouled on the floor, and 2) ‘Melo laid his goon hand on Sasha on the very next possession. On the shot, J.R. went up on one side of the rim and almost did a 720 in the air before flipping it in over his shoulder on the other side … Note to announcers everywhere: It’s not a “no-look” pass when you look at the guy, make the pass while you’re still looking at him, then turn away real quick when the ball leaves your hands … Andrew Bynum had a sweet spin move through the lane for a dunk, prompting Kevin Harlan to say, “That’ll put a smile on Kareem’s face.” Of course, every time the cameras showed Kareem, he had that same bored look he always has … Doug Collins: “The Magic have a chance at being a three-star team if Kirilenko keeps playing the way he has.” OK … And to wrap up a night of blowouts, the Warriors smoked the Rockets. What did we say yesterday about Yao constantly looking out of shape? A team like Golden State is a horrible matchup for him; on defense he couldn’t keep up with anyone, and the fatigue might have had an effect on his shooting, as he went 4-for-12 … It didn’t help Houston either that T-Mac was real quiet (11 pts), and the Warriors actually won the battle of the boards. Monta Ellis had more rebounds (10) than anyone on the Rockets …
Remember Bassy’s SI cover?Steve Nash has a “Got Milk” ad coming out soon, joining ‘Melo, Vince, T-Mac, Jason Kidd, Avery Johnson, Josh Howard, Pau Gasol, KG and Pat Ewing on the list of NBA guys who’ve donned the fake milk mustache. You can check out the behind-the-scenes footage of Nash’s ad shoot here … We’re out like Carmelo …
November 30th, 2007 at 6:37 am
the_don_mega says:
what can i say???
FIRST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
November 30th, 2007 at 7:12 am
Amar says:
all those houston homers who felt they could have gone to the west finals last season (if they beat the jazz) can all be quiet now. GS would have ran them out of the building in 5 games because Yao has the conditioning of Shaq. (but without the miles on that body)
good strong wins for the lakers and warriors, and well, man, the celtics . . . that’s the type of beat down that gets russell to phone kg and tell him the franchise is in good hands.
November 30th, 2007 at 7:55 am
bsteezy3 says:
HA! What the heck was Doug Collins talking about??
I know people have pride and all…but why is ANYONE on the Knicks providing other teams with bulletin board material??
November 30th, 2007 at 8:14 am
dre in o town says:
Yao needs a treadmill for christmas. And one of those instructional videos on how to play defense.
November 30th, 2007 at 9:23 am
Kobeef says:
Is Yao’s slowness really a conditioning issue?
I am not sure he can exercise more and become fast. Most really big guys are just slow by nature. I am not sure why. Anyone?
Over the past couple of weeks it seems that Kobe is trying to make a point with his passing. He is averaging something like 6 assists and I think it is because he is having trouble with Lebron’s triple-double hype.
Like Dime said, Kobe was making weird “no-look” or otherwise flashy passes every chance he got last night. It just seemed that he wanted make a statement about his passing by putting a bit of flash on each pass. Odd as it seemed, it also occured to me that Kobe is a very good passer when he wants to be.
November 30th, 2007 at 9:41 am
Tom Toronto says:
This is SPARRRRRRTAAAAAAA! Damn the Celtics are nasty right now. Everyone keeps saying “once one of the big three gets hurt they’re done,” and it’s true they have very little depth, what happens if they don’t get hurt? What happens if Ray, P Double and KG just keep playing 40 minutes a night?
November 30th, 2007 at 10:11 am
dagwaller says:
Went on the Warriors website, checked out the box scores from the last few Warriors games. The only center in the last 5 or 6 games to put up better than 50 percent shooting on the Warriors (read: a good offensive game) was Amare. In other words, the only center in the League to have a good game against the Warriors (one of the fastest teams in the League) was someone who makes his mark with his athleticism. Surprise surprise. Amare was 5 for 9 that game, too - SHEER DOMINATION.
All centers (generally the biggest guy on the court) are going to have problems against a team that likes to run as much as the Suns.
November 30th, 2007 at 10:13 am
isotope says:
True the warriors run but what really halped them last night was their 3 pointers were hitting. The rockets smoked the suns the night before. You gotta account that into Yao’s fatigue. Playing 40 minutes versus Phoenix the day before GS will make anyone tired. Shoot. I was tired just watching both games.
November 30th, 2007 at 10:13 am
dagwaller says:
But you’re right - that move JR Smith made was SICK! I did a double take, and was hoping for a replay the rest of the night.
Funny moment: AS the announcers were talking about how bad the Knicks were quitting on Isiah (which in hindsight, I guess they were doing all night), the camera was on the Knicks bench. Closeup of Q-Rich and a couple other guys. Q was just slowly shaking his head back and forth, as if in disbelief. Classic.
November 30th, 2007 at 10:22 am
laballer says:
they almost lost to the heat in the first game and i think wade had a shitty game if im not mistaken..lets see how they do tonight…i think the celts are doing great but im not ready to jump on the “big three” wagon yet..like bill simmons said..(celts biggest fan of life it seems)..let em win a chip before we start givin them nicknames and all that..and i mean their coach is still garbage..its just all being overlooked now cause he has talent..anyone remember last year when EVERYONE thought they should have fired him??..kobes always been a great passer..he just doesnt get great assists cause his teammates arent great finishers..wow the ny situation is gettin out of hand..im pretty sure isiah put the team together while playing nba live or something and making trades on there..i mean video game wise..they are a good team..in reality tho..wow..cant say one thing positive about them cept their young guys..
November 30th, 2007 at 10:25 am
isotope says:
best way to deal with Celts is to get Garnett in foul trouble.
November 30th, 2007 at 10:34 am
chrisGO says:
he_don_mega
you a loser.
November 30th, 2007 at 10:34 am
Big Freeze says:
Wow, the Knicks are terrible. I hope they wait until the end of the season to fire Isiah because I enjoy watching this train wreck. How about David Lee’s attempt at a reverse dunk? Needless to say, he clanked the dunk and the ball went flying towards the stands. That about summed up the Knick’s night right there. Thankfully the rout didn’t happen in the Garden or there might have been a riot.
Yao is a 7 foot 6 statue with a huge head and tiny T-rex arms, but he is still the best center in the game right now, until Dwight takes over in a year or two.
November 30th, 2007 at 10:34 am
djKianoosh says:
being a longtime suffering sixers fan i loooooooved watching the knicks get shellacked last night, even if it was the celtics. at least one of them stinks as bad as we do. but the knicks are more disappointing cause the supposedly have enough talent to have a good record. but these guys will never be a good team because they just dont have team-first guys.
can’t wait till the celtics play the top teams out west. their games against Dallas, Suns, Spurs, Utah, Denver, Houston, etc will be really good.
November 30th, 2007 at 10:41 am
heavy d says:
I’m guessing that Doug Collins can’t tell his Kirilenko from his Turkoglu. Or maybe he only studies when he’s interested in getting back to the bench?
November 30th, 2007 at 10:45 am
Prof. TX says:
Maybe the Knicks can rehire JVG to coach. They could do alot worse and he’s looking for work. I’m not saying he’d make them contenders or even take the 8th spot, but a little discipline might go a long way.
November 30th, 2007 at 10:50 am
DOC says:
Lets talk about the Knicks playoff chances guys. We’ll be hearing that again when they beat some bullshit ass team tomorrow. I cant knock it though cause if I had a website i’d talk about the Sixers every night.
November 30th, 2007 at 11:36 am
jimsonjackabee says:
DOC,
Good thing you dont have a website then.
NY Fans,
All you idiots who thought the Knicks even had a chance at making the playoffs, I hope you are watching and wanting to kill yourselves. The Knicks are the worst team in the NBA…and are probably the only team that would probably lose if they had to play in the NCAA.
Isiah is a crooked racist bitch who has completely ruined every thing hes touched since he stopped playing. If this were feudal Japan, Isiah would do the honorable thing and commit seppuku. It sucks that this isnt feudal Japan…
November 30th, 2007 at 11:46 am
skurv says:
i (heart) seppuku…or maybe just the idea of isiah taking that upon himself. then again, without isiah my spurs wouldnt have been able to get rid of malik rose. maybe isiah does have a purpose afterall
November 30th, 2007 at 12:11 pm
MJax says:
For all the Rocket haters; We’ve known forever that Yao wasn’t fast and ran out of breath posting up. You are supposed to when you play the Warriors and Suns, who doesn’t. Name a center who keeps up with either team anyway not named Amare. It was one loss, and we all know come playoff time the Warriors will either self destruct behind “Whoo” Jackson, the upcoming injury to their backcourt or their overwillingness to shoot the three on every possession.
And when doug collins is doing a game, I turn the volume down and watch the game and listen to music!
November 30th, 2007 at 12:29 pm
isotope says:
Go Rockets!
November 30th, 2007 at 12:30 pm
Bron42 says:
I love how you all give excuses for why yao is slow an unathletic. The excuses don’t really matter cuz a) it proves any team who makes him run will beat the rockets b)he doesnt play good defense anyway. And to say hes the best center until dwight howard takes over? what has yao done that dwight hasnt lol…Cuz yao can hit a 15 footer hes the best center by default? Yao is older, has more experince and bigger yet dwight still does just as much, if not more AND yao doesnt do anything in big games (check his playoff records). So how has yao garnished best center qualities?
And Mjax duh, we all kno the warriors and suns run..so heres what you do. a) um don’t play their type of game, just slow the tempo down. b)yao is STILL the biggest guy on the court, so he should be able to impose his will whenever he wants. But since he isn’t aggressive and settles for jumpers, his fatigue plays a big part specially when his fade away misses and then he can’t get down the court. So please everyone stop ridin yaos jock like he has 12 rings and destroys everyone. Hes tall, has a soft touch and…hmm..i think i covered it all…
November 30th, 2007 at 12:48 pm
the_don_mega says:
*chrisGO says:
he_don_mega
you a loser.
= sourpuss… haha!!!
November 30th, 2007 at 12:49 pm
isotope says:
Bron42 = Genius.
Compare Yao’s playoff stats and Dwight’s playoff stats. Not to mention Dwight plays in the east. Most of his points are put backs and alley hoops. Yao actually works for his shots and has range. Howard is a much better shot blocker but a much worse free throw shooter.
Centaur is great no doubt and right now is a close second to Yao as best center in the league. And will prob pass him up very soon.
Rockets lost last night because the rest of the team didnt help when Yao was getting the double teams. If Rafer, Steve, and Battier were hitting their shots it would have been much different.
November 30th, 2007 at 1:01 pm
Amar says:
utah has beaten both gs and phoenix by slowing it down, and also by running. the key is to have a center who doesn’t have to run baseline to baseline to be effective (memo who has three point range), and a bunch of quicker, smaller guys who score inside (boozer, millsap, kirilenko, harpring . . . etc).
I like making fun of tmac, but really, yao is the hidden reason why that team underachieves . . .
November 30th, 2007 at 1:05 pm
Bron42 says:
Bron42=Brilliant
get it right
how are we comparing their playoff stats when dwight has been in the league, what 3 years? and look who he has been playing with compared to yao has been playing with? real easy comparison to go by…francis or tmac as a sidekick or….hedo… And to say yao has to work lol by work you mean post up and then shot over people since your 7′5? Hate to break it to you, takes alot less work to hit a fade away or spot up for a 10 footer than it does to get position and dunk on someone your own size. Its not like dwight is abusing guys 6 inches shorter than him. And on top of that, yes hes in the east but the east does have legit powerforwards ya kno…they just dont have as many good wing players. On top of that, dwight is just as abusive when he plays west teams. so that idea goes out the window. Dwight blocks more shots, scores as much (with dunks and putbacks), rebounds more and can get up and down the court. So like i said, because yao can hit a 15 footer and is a better foul shooter..hes the best center right? even though hes NEVER won a big game in his whole nba career. You say last night like this is the first time its happened…yes, yao can score, but he doesnt do much else. Hence last years playoffs when he was abused by everyone on the jazz…or the year before that when he was a no show, or the year before that. Yao is playin with how many more quality guys than dwight? So like i said, what has yao done, that puts him ahead of dwight?
Dwight: 23.5 ppg, 14.5 rbg. 1.5 apg. 2.7 blks
Yao: 21.7 ppg, 10.1 rbg. 2.4 apg. 2.0 blks.
November 30th, 2007 at 1:07 pm
Bron42 says:
Amar, its not really a hidden reason when people have been sayin it since francis was the starting pg 4 years ago lol
November 30th, 2007 at 1:07 pm
SWAT says:
Mjax and isotope great info. I really dont have to say much because you guys already covered the bases. Bron here we go again huh…honestly Yao does piss me off sometimes because he doesn’t assert himself but when he does he can easliy change the outcome of games. Year after year he has constantly got better in conditioning and scoring. Now the rest of my boys who couldn’t buy a bucket last nite need to get their shooting touch together, and believe it or not their are just certain teams that are terrible match ups. But, in a 7 game series i refuse to believe that we would lose to Golden state.
On another note though…did you guys see Chuck rip the Knicks last nite? He basically said that they were just there to collect their paychecks, and by the 50 point ass whooping last nite you really can’t argue with him. C’mon starting point gets 4 pts last nite. WTF?
November 30th, 2007 at 1:38 pm
Bron42 says:
here we go again what? i’ve already agreed with you swat…yao has gotten in better condition..so he has gone from terrible slow and unathletic to slightly slow and unathletic. And for the last time, the game isn’t just about scoring. Lots of guys in the league can score. that goesnt make him the best center, specially when dwight scores more. And in a best of 7, the warriors would beat them because they would wear yao down just like the jazz did last year. So unless its a slow team, yao is pretty much the weakest link in a best of 7 series. Keep in mind i’m a rockets fan..so while i hate seein them lose, i’m not gonna sugar coat it when it happens. Any center is a terrible match up for yao since a) no one is slower b)barely any are less athletic c) in a best of 7, he has no time to really recover. I mean come on…okur was bustin his ass last year to the point where tmac whent 30 and 10 and they still lost.
November 30th, 2007 at 2:16 pm
isotope says:
Yao was not the reason the rockets lost the series to Utah. Yao averaged 25.1 ppg and 10.3 rebs. (They really wore him down) He did his part. I remember there was a game in that series when the bench came up with 0 pts for a whole game. And I think they still scored decent points that game.
Yao doesnt just score. He’s a pretty good passer and a decent defender. He changes more shots than he blocks and he had to chill on defense a couple years ago cuz the refs were blowing the whistle whenever guards ran into him. I so hated that! Now all he does is put his hands up most of the time to avoid fouling out. He’s a better than average defender. And he helps the offense cuz he’s out there setting picks trying to get plays for others. He does more than just score.
November 30th, 2007 at 2:44 pm
DOC says:
yAO NICE BUT AINT NO SMART MAN TAKIN HIM OVER DWIGHT THE MONSTER
November 30th, 2007 at 2:57 pm
Reed Ewing Frazier says:
jimsonjackabee- how is Isiah racist? that is a new one(lol)
The Knicks took a beating from a good not great team they caught us on a bad night we still have over sixty games to go in the season so calm down haters like my man Coach Denny Green said “We know who they are if want to crown them then crown them!!” (lol)
I love being a Knick fan times are bad now but we will be back in 2-3 years I still got love for Isiah and Steph but it is time to stop the madness We need to just start over but the bottomline is that we are not that bad as that game last night would suggest.
KNICKS UP everyone else down!!!
November 30th, 2007 at 3:17 pm
Big Al says:
dude dime smack is pretty much the funniest sports column out there. they’re awesome
November 30th, 2007 at 3:23 pm
Bron42 says:
yao scored but the fact is, EVERYONE on the jazz front like murdered him. Boozer averaged almost 40 on him. Okur killed him cuz yao can’t guard outside the key and milsap who is only 6′9 bullied him and in the deciding games he just no showed once again.at 7′5 you shouldnt be a DECENT defender. At 7′5 and the “BEST CENTER IN THE LEAGUE” you shouldnt be a decent defender. Hence your basing it on his scoring. And he doesn’t score much in big games. And the refs have every right to blow a whistle cuz theres no reason a 7′5 guy should be tryin to take a charge, specially when he doesn’t have the foot speed to get in position early or the athletic ability to really challenge shots without using his body like mutumbo did. So fine, technically EVERYONE does more than score, but at the same time, he doesn’t set himself apart from anyone else other than bein 7′5 and scoring.
And as for jim…ya when did isiah become a racist? and on top of that, isiah has helped most teams hes been on, just not the knicks cuz the guys have ego issues. Your hatin on the guy who drafted tmac, camby, saw the potential in jermaine oneal (where would the pacers be if he was still a blazer). Isiah see’s potential and sometiimes overlooks personality, thats his main flaw.
On accomplisments and up side alone..no way u take yao over dwight.
November 30th, 2007 at 3:46 pm
isotope says:
At least the Rockets made it to game 7. The magic got swept by the pistons. Who was their starting center? Webber? And who was ending up leading the Magic in scoring-Centaur? No. Turkoglu. The best center in league couldnt score more than 16 points a game against Chris Webber in a playoff series? And couldnt even get 1 win?
Like i’ve been saying. Dwight has more upside and will pass Yao up soon. But not yet.
And you say Yao can’t guard outside the key? Since when can Dwight? Put him out there for a guard to cross him up. And a post game does take work. Both players have different skill sets. The one that can take advantage of his the most will be the better player.
November 30th, 2007 at 4:03 pm
derrick says:
i think isotope just ended the discussion.
November 30th, 2007 at 4:09 pm
MJAX says:
Bron42, do you play much hoop or coach? It doesn’t matter if they slow it down. If your style is to get it out the net, or rebound and go, it won’t matter. The key is your athletes not getting caught up in wanting to run back. Like I said the Warriors will have one of those issues if not all, so they are not a concern. You also still didn’t name a center. And if the Warriors played the Magic, would would be so different?
November 30th, 2007 at 4:17 pm
Anon02 says:
Is it me, or are some of these “commentators” starting to get annoying? DIME touched down on it about them calling a regular pass a “no-look pass”, but sometimes they just seem to not know what they are talking about. I know that they are professionals, but it seems like sometimes the avaerage FAN knows more about the PLAYERS then them. Example: Lastnight I was watching the LAKERS/NUGGETS game, the announcer was talking about ALLEN IVERSON and he said “Allen is 31 yrs. old now, and it’s AMAZING he hasn’t even slowed down” (as if it is so far of a stretch that a player of his caliber hasn’t slowed down yet when he’s ONLY just beginning his 30’s) and I thought to myself “no he’s not, he’s 32 yrs. old”…. then the announcer said “He’s a 7-time ALL-STAR” and I thought “NO, he’s an 8-time ALL STAR”…. i’m just a FAN and I know more about the PLAYERS then THEY do. And to make things worst, they FLIP FLOP worst then a fish out of water, they jump on and off of BANDWAGONS worst then the average sports fan. It’s a mess. I started to wonder lastnight wether I should start watching the games on MUTE, so I won’t have to hear the constant NONSENSE.
Also, I find it funny that KOBE’S team plays better when he doesn’t shoot as much and shares the BALL. His team isn’t as BAD as people try to make them out to be, grant it they certainly won’t get through the WEST in the PLAYOFFS, but they aren’t the KNICKS either. Their win against a team like DENVER lastnight was empressive (although CHARLES BARKELY was DISGUSTED at how they were dancing on the BENCH just because they got a win, LOL). If Kobe continues to share the BALL, they should be able to pull in some more wins. I know KOBE will have to take over at times, but when it’s not necessary, he should sit back and just play (atleat untill they figure out if they are trading him or not)… Lastly, I agree with what someone said about the CELTICS, I wish them the best of luck, but i’m NOT ready to jump on a BANWAGON just because they are better then what they were a YEAR ago. They may be able to pull off a 45 pt. win against some TEAMS in the EAST, but that ain’t going to fly in the WEST, they played a tired DENVER team coming off a back-to-back game, so I don’t even count that meeting… I highly doubt they could do that again against DENVER again or anyother of the top WEST teams (San Antonio, MAVS, SUNS or UTAH)…. oh yeah and I watched the Re-play of MELO and I don’t think that was a FLAGORENT FOUL, VAJACIC needed an OSCAR for how well he acted like MELO yulked him up. At first I was with everyone else saying “what is MELO thinking”? Then I watched the replay and it looked like they just got tangled up and homeboy wanted to put on a show.
November 30th, 2007 at 4:21 pm
dre in o town says:
sorry everybody but stats don’t mean anything in the case of Yao and Dwight. Dwight would beast and best Yao in any game. I don’t care how much shooting touch Yao has. A decent shooting game doesn’t make up for hard nose defense and hustle. Shooters go cold sometimes, the key is to be a good defender which Yao isn’t. Defense wins the rings. Look at the Spurs when they played the Sun’s or any other team, yeah they can score through the roof too but simplicity of playing good defense is what stands out. Other than the Amare/Diaw debacle the Spurs shut down the offensive attack with good defense. Yao can shoot all day but if he can’t play some gritty defense and has trouble hustlin’ up and down the floor i may as well kiss my championship goodbye. Yao only gets his stats cause T-Mac is injured half the time and they have to justify building the Houston Rockets around this dud of a pick. Ouch …
November 30th, 2007 at 4:40 pm
Bron42 says:
Iso: lol you point out they lost to the pistons. Yes in dwights what, first playoff game? against a championship pistons team? a team that has how many other 7′0 guys who double and triple teamed him? webber was the starting center but u make it like sheed, maxiell and all them arent on the team. Its not like webber guarded him alone lol ya..so big difference. Yao got scrubed by a 6′8 guy and it was to the point where mehmet okur said and quote “yao is pretty predicatble with his moves, so hes not hard to really guard once you play him.” and saying yao can’t guard outside the key..he cant guard in the key either. the point was boozer shitted on him with nothing but post moves and 7 footers. then they tried to hide it by puttin him on okur and okur started puttin jumpers in his face. So no matter WHERE you put him, hes a liability.so like i said, yaos skill set is he is tall and has a 15 foot jump shot. He doesnt use his size that well other than shooting over people.
Mjax:I’ve played and coached on every level except NBA and currently work in the NBA. first off, most centers in the league are converted powerforwards…amare can get up the floor, dwight, even duncan still can. Yao and mutumbo are probably the slowest in the league. Also in a league like the nba where everyone is slowly moving to run and gun style. Any team that beast the rockets up the court is gonna have a 5 on 4 advantage cuz you merely beat yao up the court or get him winded. If the warriors played the magic it would be different based on the fact, running the offense through dwight really doesnt slow the game down. He can get up and down the court, blocks shots, is athletic enough to keep up wit other centers. Not too many guys are just gonna burn dwight down the court. And you say it doesnt matter? look at the spurs. They can beat the suns anyway they want..they can run with them and have a high scoring shoot out OR slow it down and just milk every shot and have a 86-90 game..same with the pistons from a few years ago. So it does matter. Problem with the rockets is they have to run everything through yao, taking away from tmacs skills, and turning everyone else in to spot up shooters which everyone outside of head and batteir arent. Plus if you slow it down, everyone collapses on yao…if you try to speed up the tempo, yao cant keep up. Hence, yao is STILL the weakest link. good bye.
November 30th, 2007 at 4:45 pm
DOC says:
the same team lebron beat by his fuckin self
November 30th, 2007 at 4:46 pm
isotope says:
Dwight’s stat line versus Portland a couple days ago:
9 pts 14 rebs
Dude was definitely beasting and besting…Joel Pryzbilla? lol
If they played straight up they’d both foul each other out which is why they probably wouldnt. Most of DH’s blocks shots come from the weak side anyway not straight up.
BTW the Rox BEAT the spurs when they had their full squad. The Magic lost to them. Y’all forget that dude just played 40 minutes the night before against the Suns. Both games on the road. And in that Suns game Yao scored 30 and TMac wasnt injured. Sorry that kills ur argument.
November 30th, 2007 at 5:09 pm
isotope says:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RtRssX5PmYs
You’re right. Dude plays NO defense. lol
November 30th, 2007 at 5:21 pm
Bron42 says:
lol if anything you proved my point..the guy is just tall and stood there. and how does that kill my arugment when you name 3 games and i’m talkin his whole career? And were not talkin the magic in general cuz I agree the rockets have a better team. but its not like dwight sucked against duncan lol…Since when did this turn into a who has the better team debate? Besides not only does yao not get many blocks, you make it like his arent help side either HENCE why he gets dunked on alot cuz he doesnt have speed to get there in time. So to say dwight blocks help side and all barely 2 of yao’s blocks a game are face up? please. And then you post dwight game against the blazers like yao has never had a bad game lol…plain and simple iso, your doin fine but you cant win a argument by basing all your stats on one game..and even though by dwight standards, they still won and he still had 14 boards. So the fact still remains. yao is not the best center from a stat standpoint. He isn’t assertive the way a 7′5 guy should be. dwight has way more upside. yao bogs down the offense.
November 30th, 2007 at 5:24 pm
Bron42 says:
and doc…your usually smart, dont screw it up now…the lebron didn’t beat the pistons himself. Even mike brown said the pistons fell apart more than the cavs beat them. Lebron had one really good game and they still would of lost the series if daniel gibson didn’t go off in the last game. don’t make it like he dominated the whole series lol. plus you can triple team a center alot easier than you can a 6′8 guard.
November 30th, 2007 at 5:45 pm
dagwaller says:
Bron, you’re ridiculous. I love it when you put games up when Yao has a bad game, but when someone puts up a good game, you either ignore it or treat it like an aberration. Or that, for some reason, your generalizations like Yao’s WHOLE CAREER have more merit than anyone else’s opinions…why? Oh wait, they don’t.
I DO think it’s funny that you keep arguing about how bad Yao is when he is, statistically speaking, the second best center in the League right now, and the only guy better (D-Ho) started putting up those huge numbers just this year. Even if you don’t want to go with statistics, you’d sooner pick guys that were “more athletic” but can’t shoot as well? You’re right, shooting is overrated. Putting it in the basket isn’t all there is. But when you combine the defense with the offense, Yao is right at the top of the list. Goodbye. Ha, goodjoke lololol.
November 30th, 2007 at 7:07 pm
Bron42 says:
dag dag dag…always the last to the party..you said it yourself. I comment on ALL of yaos games. ANd i use facts from his whole career. I’m not just like o well yao only had 2 points last night so he instantly sucks. I say yao has been soft and overrated his whole career. Most of my arguments arent even about this season since were not that deep into it which is why i overlooked the dwight thing. And if he mentioned anything about anyones whole career then he would have a point. but he goes “o well dwight had 9 points against the blazers” so i commented on the one instance he stated.
And like you said he is “statisticly the second best center” SO HOW THE FUCK IS HE THE BEST CENTER IN THE LEAGUE!! Thats my whole argument. Is yao good? ya sure, the center position is weak and theres probably 5 guys in the whole league who do anything at the 5 spot. But yao isn’t the the best center plain and simple. Plus dwight as always put up big numbers, he was havein 20-20 games last year. Now he has someone else good on the team, something again yao has had his whole career. And yes i’ll take a athletic center who does more overall but cant hit a 15 footer than a soft tall center who wants to play small forward. The whole point of putting it in the basket is tru, but I want MY CENTER to assert himself and do it. I don’t need him fading away. And fine, if thats yaos game thats cool but bring more to the table than being a tall guy with a soft tough. Dominate games. Lastly, when yao combines defense with his offense you let me know. Cuz just like the youtube video shows. No one is scared to go right at yao for a reason. So bein top 5 center in a league with 5 good centers doesnt say much, but hes def not the best center.
November 30th, 2007 at 7:13 pm
Bron42 says:
p.s: theres been plenty of centers who couldnt shoot for shit and put up big numbers. and i never even said shooting was overrated, just dont need my center to think hes the teams best shooter.
November 30th, 2007 at 8:07 pm
dagwaller says:
Actually, Bron, this is exactly what we were talking about yesterday…hardly “last to the party” material.
Thanks for conceding the point: you’re just generalizing his whole career, instead of looking at the player he is now. As I’ve said before, D-Ho has a bigger upside than Yao. But up until the last month (i.e., this season), Yao has done more.
Here’s the last points that I made yesterday, which you didn’t seem to have an answer for (since I made them once, you ignored them and just repeated what you said before).
He’s not a defensive presence…except he’s 10th in the league in blocked shots. So…yea. How many different ways do you want that put?
There’s no stat for “blocks against centers”, and I doubt you watch every Rockets game, so you really can’t say who he blocks and who he doesn’t. Besides, does it really MATTER which players he blocks? Especially when, as we agreed a few days ago, most of the centers in the League now are either not good or are defense oriented?
Nowhere in my posts did I say that Yao was BETTER than Howard - Howard’s irrelevant.
Yao isn’t an offensive center - he’s a superior center who happens to be better at offense than every center in the league other than Howard. The reason I brought up the offense is because a.) odds are he was playing offense and banging the boards before taking off on his “long slow trots”, as opposed to the other defensive minded centers that might have started walking back already, and b.) the other centers in the league that are all “in such better shape” generally only concentrate on one end. In other words, you won’t find them among the league leaders in points AS WELL AS blocked shots. Yao, you will.
You’re always talking about how this guy is soft, or that guy is soft, but you never really define what makes someone soft. Is it blocking more shots than just about everyone in the League? Is it being part of an elite defensive team the last few years? Is it putting up big points numbers despite being in a plodding offense? Is it putting up big points and rebounds against other elite centers? If so, I guess that you must be wrong, because he does all that.
And seriously, stop whining about how he’s 7′5″ and “doesn’t do more”. There are tons of taller guys on the planet that don’t do more, and there are, pound for pound, inch for inch, better players than Yao. Who cares? It’s the role that they fulfill, not their size, that matters, and Yao can do a hell of a lot more than just about all of the centers in the League.
November 30th, 2007 at 9:24 pm
Bron42 says:
Last to the party meaning today ass…and I don’t check back on other pages..so it wasn’t about ignoring you. I never read it. On to today. I love how people only seem to read parts of my posts and comment on those ignoring the rest lol.
Yes i take in his whole career. And not much has changed. Yao went from a horrible athlete to a bad athlete. I’ve looked at how he is not too. Pointing out last years playoffs and how bad he was on defense, its not like i was talking his rookie year. The playoffs are recent. So yao still was a bum on defense i.e last season as he is now ie this season ie this month. on to your points.
So your telling me, we should be proud that the games tallest player ranks 10th in blocks? That makes him a good defender? how many of those block (which he ranks 10th in) are merely cuz he is tall, not about skill or positioning. Hell, shawn bradley had blocks, but god knows he wasnt a good defender. It was more that he was tall.
And when did i say anything about who he blocks? Iso said how howards blocks are help defense and I said so were yaos the few times he does block people. I said he doesnt really block people. I said other people block him.
And hate to break it to ya, most of my comments are in response to what you say. So while you didn’t bring up “who is better yao or dwight”, chances are when I responded to that it had nothing to do with you or what you feel on the situation. so its irrelevant to you but again, you weren’t the one i was talking to at that part when this all started.
And you said yourself, hes a supeior center to people OTHER than dwight. SO HES NOT THE BEST CENTER. my point of this whooooolllleee argument. So from this point on there should be “yao is the best center in the league” comments. EVER. And the fact that you even mentioned yao “bangin on the boards” is a joke when the rockets are a terrible rebounding team.
As for soft, yes, me AND ALOT OF OTHER PEOPLE have called yao soft. you keep pointing out how good he is among other centers and then say most centers now days suck..way to point out hes one of the smart kids in the retard class. Yao is soft,(and guys liek dirk and anyone else i’ve named carter etc are soft) because they don’t show up in big games, they settle instead of imposing their will. Take yao, sure he bullies crappy centers in the regular season. What has he done in the post season to take his elite team over the top? When has he showed ANY ability to carry the team by himself when tmac goes down? tmac carried the team when yao went down with 50 year old mutumbo takin his place. Yes yao scores, we all kno that, he can shot, we all kno that. but braggin about his blockin ability and defense when hes 10TH IN THE LEAGUE means theres 9 other guys smaller than him who are better and that just makes no sense. Is he the worst defender in the league? no, never said that. but as a 7′5 guy who people wanna hype as the second coming he doesn’t really do all that much.
And for me to stop whining? umm..his height plays a big part of the issue dumbass. if he was 6′5 i wouldnt care that all he does is shoot and barely blocks shots or anything. The fact he is usually the biggest guy on the court means alot. And chances are the “tons of taller guys on the planet” you speak of, last i checked, werent playing in the nba, so their irrelevant. Yao is 7′5 and doens’t use it to his advantage the way hes should. ever heard a coach say “so and so is 6′9 but plays like hes 6′1.”
So while I enjoy arguing with you on EVERY FUCKIN POST no matter who the player is, you’ve already proven my point so i’ll leave it there. Yes, yao does alot more than MOST centers in the league, but not all. THEREFORE YAO ISN”T THE BEST CENTER IN THE LEAGUE. thats what the whole statement was. sure people harped in other stuff but thats it. Once someone said “yao is the best with dwight in close 2nd” their argument was automatically wrong. so whatever other things you want to point out? i dunno…yao has the best touch of most big man, he can cook a mean ham sandwich…none of it matters cuz hes not the best so it shouldnt be said. Next time do me the favor of understanding how the argument originates before you jump in. Stay classy.
December 1st, 2007 at 5:48 am
K-Dizzle says:
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December 1st, 2007 at 9:05 am
DOC says:
you better stop talkin about Vince Bron aint you they trainer. He gonna black out on ya ass
December 2nd, 2007 at 11:38 pm
dagwaller says:
I’m glad that you mentioned “understanding the argument”, because you seem to be overreacting to what I’m saying. My point is that no, Yao is not a bad athlete (he looks like he’s out of shape because, as you pointed out, no one else on that team rebounds much or generally hangs out in the paint EXCEPT FOR HIM), and that his height is irrelevant with regards to his actual basketball skill (otherwise, Manute Bol should’ve been the greatest player of all time).
Yea, being 10th in the League in blocked shots is good. Who cares how tall he is? Every center in the L is going to have more blocked shots in general because they’re tall. There are guys that are 7′2″ that don’t have great block numbers, despite being “better athletes” than Yao. They also don’t have the same offensive game that he does. The only player in the NBA that combines blocked shots with general good offense as well as Yao is Dwight Howard.
A few weeks ago, I said that I would take Yao over Dwight Howard THIS YEAR, because Dwight hadn’t proved anything yet. Upside? Future? I even said back then that I’d take D-Ho. Now, I’m backing off of the first statement, and granting D-Ho best-in-the-league status. But that’s NOT REALLY WHAT MY POINT WAS. It was just that Yao’s much better than he’s given credit for here. Terrible athlete? Soft? More like elite center. If you hadn’t noticed, I already said that I agreed that there aren’t that many great centers out there, so I don’t really know where you’re going there.
Might want to stop contradicting yourself on the size thing, too. You’re the one that always says that Yao has short arms, which kind of takes away from his height. Either way, you’re talking about a 4 inch height difference between him and most decent sized centers - and somehow you think that should be good for…what? An extra block a night? Imagine if there was a guy that was 7′7″ - Bron thinks he’d block 10 guys a night! And think about it: as much as you say that he’s soft, or that he should block more shots, and that he doesn’t “affect games” defensively, keep in mind the fact that he’s been anchoring what’s been one of the Assocation’s best defenses for the last few years. It wasn’t Rafer Alston.
A lot of the time you trade on your basketball knowledge for credit, but some reading comprehension classes might go a long way.