Lamar’s chillin’ for L.A.’s next game.(Photo. Tim Tadder)
No NBA games on the schedule yesterday, since everyone knows New Year’s Day belongs to college football. To kick off 2008, though, we’ve got a brand-new NBA Hit List power ranking for you. Not much has changed at the bottom — Al Jefferson and Zach Randolph’s squads are still looking up at the rest of the League — but there is some movement in the Top 5; the Lakers are rising while the Spurs are falling … The biggest piece of basketball news from Tuesday was Lamar Odom drawing a one-game suspension from the League for his textbook form tackle on Ray Allen at the end of Lakers/Celtics (forever known as the Short-Shorts Game). We don’t have a problem with the suspension, but here’s something to think about: Did you notice how Ray got BLASTED, yet his reaction to Odom’s hit was still more mild than Steve Nash’s reaction to Robert Horry’s hip check? Not saying Nash flopped or anything … As you know, Shaq graces the cover of the newest issue of Dime. It’s no secret that M.D.E. is on the decline — putting up 14 points and about 8 boards per game for struggling Miami — which brings up a question: Should NBA superstars retire at the top of their game, or hang on as long as possible? Tell us what you think** either right here or in an e-mail to smack@dimemag.com, and we may print some of the best answers in an upcoming issue … If you’re just returning to work after the holiday, you might’ve missed some of the stuff we’ve been posting on the site lately. Andrew made his first-third of the season team-by-team MVP picks, a list that does not include KG, Nash or Dirk. He can explain. Check out the Western Conference and Eastern Conference most valuables … And over the break we put a few more guys through the Hall of Fame Watch: Mark Price, Shawn Kemp and Tim Hardaway. Check out which one of those three we’ve got going to the Hall … We’ve also been following the drama going on in Chicago: If you haven’t heard, Scottie Pippen recently put the Bulls on blast in the media, prompting Ben Gordon and Kirk Hinrich to respond … In case you were wondering, with the non-conference schedule wrapped up, Illinois freshman PG Jeffrey Jordan (son of G.O.A.T.) has notched a total of five points (1-for-11 FGs), two assists and three steals in seven games (6 minutes per) for the Fighting Illini, picking up six DNP-CD’s in the process. He’s got time, though … One NBA connection from college football Tuesday: Danny Ainge’s nephew, Tennessee senior QB Erik Ainge, threw for 365 yards and a couple of TDs in the Vols’ win over Wisconsin. Erik is projected to be a 3rd-round pick in the NFL Draft … Bowl-related e-mail from Austin: “Talking to my dad about the ass-whoopin’ Georgia is laying on Hawaii, his assessment is that Hawaii’s O-line is just too small to handle UGA’s D-line. He says, ‘Those boys (Georgia) eat cows and greens for dinner. Hawaii’s eating bananas and [stuff].’” … One funny sequence from that game: Late in the fourth, Georgia punted and one of Hawaii’s big guys just leveled UGA’s punter blindside. The punter got up, ran down the guy who hit him, and shoved him to the ground from behind … We’re out like flopping …
**Dime reserves the right to edit submissions for length and clarity**
January 2nd, 2008 at 5:37 am
Mcw says:
it depends on the superstars themselves. Also i think the chase for a championship pushes some of them WAY past their prime (GP, malone, comes to mind). Im not saying they can’t play mind you, its just that their body doesn’t respond as well as it used to and fans rather remember them in their prime rather than been posterised by some 19yr old. just my 2 cents
btw, how KG, Nash, D-Will and Roy didn’t make it as their teams’ respective MVP is mind-bogglin.. yes plz explain
January 2nd, 2008 at 5:45 am
Mcw_1988 says:
a chase for a chip might push some of them to go WAY beyond their prime (e.g. 37+). Personally, I think from a fan’s perspective its better for the superstars to retire at the tail-end of their prime which should be on average around 35 yrs, unless the player is extremely conditioned. Its always better to have memories of your favs in their prime instead of been posterized by 19yr olds…
btw how can KG, Nash, D-Will and Roy not be more valuable than Ray Allen (celts won the 2 games w/o ray very comfortably), Hill (the sun’s last 3 season records w/o him speaks for themselves), Boozer (isn’t deron williams suppose to be their franchise player?) and Travis Outlaw (i don’t even know who he is)?
January 2nd, 2008 at 5:49 am
Christoph Beermann says:
In my opinion NBA Superstars should play as long as they want to play and as long as anyone gives them a contract. If they are still able to go through a full season without life rescuing treatment afte the games, which is questionable with Shaq, they should do what they love to do as long as they want to do it.
January 2nd, 2008 at 6:12 am
Fish says:
Don’t think you can really like-a-like with Allen/Nash.
Regular season / playoffs.
Half hearted steal followed by trip / intentional hip check.
Nash is a smaller guy.
I don’t see any way Nash could have stayed upright in that collision.
January 2nd, 2008 at 7:16 am
Korady says:
I personally feel like NBA superstars should play as long as they can make an (positive) impact for their team. Zo didn’t retire at the top of his game or when everyone said he was finished. He came back and made a huge impact in Miami. Shaq is definitely past his prime, but what other player can Miami bring in at center that will put up his numbers (barring a trade that may be a lateral or backwards move)? Tim Duncan isn’t in his prime anymore, but he’s still a huge part of the Spurs (and granted still very good). I’m sure even Bill Russell couldn’t have been in his prime for all those championships he won, though (I would assume) he still definitely made a huge impact for the Celtics. You just don’t win that many and not have an impact. I’m sure if I or anyone else went back and looked at as many superstars careers as possible, we would find that plenty of superstars played past their primes and still made impacts. There’s probably a very small percentage who played past their primes and either (a) made their teams worse or (b) were dead weight, which wouldn’t have made the team any better anyways.
January 2nd, 2008 at 8:43 am
Kobeef says:
This situation actually is as much about the coach as it is about the player. Shaq’s problem now is that either a)he won’t accept his physical decline and alter his role or b) Pat Riley won’t accept his physical decline and alter his role, or c) both are in denial.
My guess with the heat is that the don’t have another option but to ignore the obvious with Shaq’s $20milion contract.
I always thought Dikembe was a good example of a player who contributed effectively in his declining years (into his 40’s?). He has adjusted his game accordingly (more head, less body) and provides some leadership/mentorship to the rookies gained from years of experience. D. Martin (Raptors) is another player who has embraced the “wise old vetran” role. Not that he is playing but Kareem has also shown how a vetran can help a young team/ player (Bynum) in a role with a team.
January 2nd, 2008 at 9:30 am
calvin brodus says:
Doesn’t Odom look like he has tiny head in that picture? It’s like the end of beatlejuice when that witch doctor is sprinkling magic dust and shrinking everbodys head.
January 2nd, 2008 at 9:37 am
K-Dizzle says:
@ Fish
“I don’t see any way Nash could have stayed upright in that collision”
Hey, man, don’t know if you new to this or not, but it’s widely accepted now that Dime don’t like Nash…or Dirk…or Yao.
All in all, it’s good to see that 2008 is gonna be just like 2007. That was just the first Nash cheapshot of the year. Stick around, there’ll be more
Travis Outlaw - Blazers MVP? ………it’s called credibility and Katz don’t have it on this pick
January 2nd, 2008 at 10:01 am
racistpete says:
It’s interesting that Dime hates on those guys (Nash, Dirk, Yao), considering their race. Must be something against the Aryan race and them damn yellows.
January 2nd, 2008 at 11:00 am
T Ton says:
Had Snaq Attack kept himself in shape and worked on his free throws the way Karl Malone did there is no reason why he couldn’t still be a top player in the league. Snaq has always relied on his God given talents to be successful and never really appeared to improve on his game by actually working on it.
January 2nd, 2008 at 11:13 am
Myrie says:
Players should play as long as they want. Shaq is 35yrs old and still in better shape than any other 320lb’er in the country. He is not on a true decline. Just has no lift. He can still be 9some)effective.
A player leaving at the top of their game is only for storybook glory; thats not true reality.
As for fans, we’ll always remember the best years of a given player, regardless of how it ends for them.
I mean….how many of us really remember Karl Malone as a Laker? Patrick Ewing has a Magic or Sonic?
MJ is a different case because he’s MJ. But when we relive his time as an NBA player, its as a Bull; not a Wizard.
Players should hang on as long as they can.
January 2nd, 2008 at 11:46 am
jo says:
Author, who left KG & Nash out of MVP list, this is for you: http://fc02.deviantart.com/fs7/i/2005/265/e/c/Unique_by_krash.jpg
January 2nd, 2008 at 12:37 pm
Ian says:
myrie but not every 32o lbs man in the country is in the nba.
players shouldnt stay around for ever is pathetic
my fav player ever (admiral) retired just in time
his peers hakeem and patrick well they kinda played two extra seasons they shouldnt have it was pathetic
and mj is not a dif case i remember him a wizard too
January 2nd, 2008 at 1:06 pm
Celts Fan says:
Ray Allen got tackled, Steve Nash ran into a guy and bounced off. I didn’t see the definitive intent in Horry’s nearly as much as I did w/ Odom’s. The Nash hit looked like a play where 2 guys were running to a spot, Horry got there first, Nash a second later, and cuz Nash is like 5′10″, 160, he went flying. I’m not saying Horry tried to get out of the way, but it didn’t seem like he was trying to flatten him either and it definitely didn’t seem like the huge deal people made it out to be. Wonder if that would’ve still been the case had it been 2 black dudes (ya, a white guy did just pull the race card. It can happen!) It seemed EXTREMELY overblown to me then and still does.
January 2nd, 2008 at 1:25 pm
control says:
Celts,
I doubt people were looking at the Nash-Horry thing like “woah, look at that white guy get crushed by that BLACK GUY!!! HOW DARE A BLACK GUY LAY HANDS ON A WHITE GUY!!!” and go crazy because of that. If it were Chris Paul, then I think the reaction would have been the same…look at the Al Hortford and TJ Ford thing. I think a majority of the drama the resulted from that, wasn’t because of Horry leveling Nash, but from Amare getting suspended for the same length as Horry just for taking a few steps. That was a complete bullshit move by the NBA and it completely ruined the series (I refused to watch the rest of the playoffs after the Suns were robbed).
At least we didn’t have Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton coming to Horry’s defense, saying that Horry was suspended ONLY because he’s black…now that would have been some bs.
January 2nd, 2008 at 1:30 pm
Ian says:
control that was amares fault
do u remember what happened to the knicks in the playoffs
why make an exception with amare and let him play???
like celts said the hit wasnt that big a deal
and suns fans need to stop talking about how the ALWAYS beat the spurs and the one time they didnt was because tehy missed the duncan stopper amare
comon please
January 2nd, 2008 at 1:55 pm
control says:
I’m not a huge Suns fan or anything, I like watching them play but they aren’t “my team” or anything. I just thought it was complete bullshit that the NBA enforced that rule when the situation didn’t even FIT the rule. The rule only applies during an “altercation”. There wasn’t an “altercation” there, so the rule didn’t apply…especially since the hit “wasn’t a big deal”. Amare only walked two or three steps along the sidelines, not onto the court, guy maybe left the bench area by a foot or so. If there WAS an altercation, why wasn’t anyone suspended (or even recieved techs) because of it?
It’s bullshit, but it’s in the past. The point I was highlighting was that the hit itself wasn’t what hyped shit up, it was the fact Amare(and Diaw) got suspended. Race had nothing to do with it at all, though maybe there were some idiots somewhere saying the Suns got screwed over by the NBA because Steve Nash is white or something, who knows.
January 2nd, 2008 at 2:10 pm
Coldchain says:
There was an altercation. After the Horry hit, Raja Bell jumped in Horry’s face and Horry forearmed him or something like that. I think Nash jumped up like he was trying to so something, too.
January 2nd, 2008 at 2:15 pm
Celts Fan says:
Control, didn’t mean it like that. Just saying that it looked, to me anyway, that Steve Nash basically bounced off of Robert Horry (who admittedly did lower his shoulder a bit and made no effort to stop Nash from falling) as opposed to Ray Allen who got hit-sticked into the front row (though they were both levied the same suspension.) Nash is a poster-boy to the game for “White America” (aka retard rednecks) and I think that it may’ve been different had it been CP3 bouncing off of Horry instead. I hate debating race and am far from that “white bread redneck” I’m thinking this may’ve been for, but I don’t think that was a big deal and think it may’ve been different had it been someone other than the league’s marquee whiteboy that bounced off Big Shot Bob.
and I wasn’t saying the Suns got screwed (those suspensions were a bit much, but there’s a decade of evidence saying that Stern will follow the letter of the law on that rule every time.) I think that the hit got over-hyped and Horry got crucified for nothing more than an over-zealous screen.
January 2nd, 2008 at 2:17 pm
Celts Fan says:
and to the Suns fans bitching about the suspensions, Stern will suspend anyone for breaking that rule. We’ve seen it over the past decade, and the brawl in Detroit and the Melo “fight” at MSG further proved that. If you don’t coach your players how to react in that situation and don’t have the control not to run off the bench, take your 1 game and shut up. Notice how the Spurs stayed on the bench…
January 2nd, 2008 at 2:20 pm
Celts Fan says:
*the brawl and MSG “fight” showed that Stern will be even more stern with any altercation. No one could have seen the way he punished guys over the past 10 years to the letter of the law on that one, then seen the fights over the past few years, then thought, “Maybe Stern will be more lenient with that rule now.”
January 2nd, 2008 at 2:38 pm
Ian says:
control i understand what u r saying but it was kinda of a an altercation nash looked like he was about to fight when he got up.
January 2nd, 2008 at 3:08 pm
control says:
Celts,
Most ironic thing you posted was “Nash is a poster-boy to the game for “White America””. Nash is Canadian
I agree that the hype difference between Ray Allen getting straight up tackled and Nash getting hip checked is really out of wack, though Ray definately had a rougher ride than Nash. I’m just saying that the difference is because of it being playoffs, and the suspensions, etc from the whole Nash thing took it to a different level.
Ian,
Nash got up like he was going to fight, but anyone would after getting tossed like that (cept Melo, he’d probably back pedal into the locker room). Ray was trying to getup the same way, but was literally being held down. He definately didn’t look happy being tackled.
If there was an “altercation” then why wasn’t anyone suspended for the “altercation”…there have been suspensions for far less than the small scrum that happended when Nash got up. The rule is the rule, but I think in this case it was really fucked up, especially since the NBA at least had the apperance of favoring the Spurs big time.
January 2nd, 2008 at 3:20 pm
Celts Fan says:
Horry got suspended for the “altercation,” and was the only Spur to do anything, so he was the only Spur suspended. That’s why it looked like they were favoring the Spurs. One team let their emotions get the best of them, the other team was smart.
and I know Nash is Canadian, but let’s be real here, who do you think the typical “retarded redneck” I’ve previously mentioned identifies most with in terms of superstars in the NBA? I don’t agree with it, I’m just saying it does happen.
great line on Melo too. backpedal all the way to the locker room. that’s great!
January 2nd, 2008 at 3:29 pm
control says:
Didn’t know rednecks watched much basketball, thought Nascar pretty much filled their limited intellect. If they did identify with anyone, I’d think it would be Kyle Kover, he even has that stupid trucker hat thing down…
January 2nd, 2008 at 3:31 pm
Celts Fan says:
that’s why I said “in terms of superstars.”
January 2nd, 2008 at 4:47 pm
RedNeck says:
Kyle Korver is a stud. So is Jason Williams and so was Chris Dudley.
January 2nd, 2008 at 6:47 pm
doc says:
Yall should change the name of this site to good objectives on B-ball except for Dirk Yao and Nash
January 2nd, 2008 at 8:10 pm
K-Dizzle says:
Celts
“and I know Nash is Canadian, but let’s be real here, who do you think the typical “retarded redneck” I’ve previously mentioned identifies most with in terms of superstars in the NBA? I don’t agree with it, I’m just saying it does happen….Ray Allen got tackled, Steve Nash ran into a guy and bounced off. I didn’t see the definitive intent in Horry’s nearly as much as I did w/ Odom’s. The Nash hit looked like a play where 2 guys were running to a spot, Horry got there first, Nash a second later”
-Seriously, cuz this really is a question.
WTF are you talkin about?
You usually make sense but you got me believin maybe you didn’t see the Suns-Spurs game.Suns were up, Nash was tryin to kill clock, Horry hip-checked him in frustration and the rest is history. Everyone who saw the plays knows Horry was tryin to hit nash. Don’t make it seem like an accident and please don’t make a basketball play about race cuz that’s just ignorant
January 2nd, 2008 at 9:37 pm
Ian says:
control yeah anyone would get up like nash and like u said not melo but comon man only horry was involved and he was suspended if anything raja bell shoulda gone too.