Duncan or Barkley?
ChuckAs I write this, the office is in the middle of a heated argument over who we would start on the Greatest Team of All-Time. The two-guard spot was easy: Mike. Small forward wasn’t much of a debate, with Larry Bird getting the call. After some unfortunate young’uns mentioned Shaq and Hakeem, the rest of us set them straight that center really only came down to Wilt versus Russell versus Kareem. Point guard was a tough call; it was really between Oscar, Magic and Stockton, with Isiah and Tiny Archibald’s names also being mentioned.
The most argued spot has been power forward. Anyone who knows me knows who I’m rolling with: Tim Duncan. A lot of people actually agreed with me, but a good number chose Charles Barkley.
So who would you take: Duncan or Barkley>?
April 14th, 2008 at 3:13 pm
Ross says:
Duncan, no contest.
April 14th, 2008 at 3:17 pm
Amar says:
for a career or series duncan, for one game, karl malone.
April 14th, 2008 at 3:18 pm
Amar says:
seriously, #2 ALL TIME scorer in the nba ???
April 14th, 2008 at 3:22 pm
Gareth says:
don’t sleep on prime shaq. you’ve gotta go with Barkley over Duncan… he’s a better scorer and rebounder.
April 14th, 2008 at 3:23 pm
Jnice says:
Barkely for sure……..Duncan couldn’t guard Barkley in both of there primes……..
April 14th, 2008 at 3:26 pm
Mike C says:
Duncan, easily. I’d even put Baylor, McHale, and Malone over Barkley. I mean if you go with rings, you go with Duncan or McHale. If you go with numbers, then you take either the Mailman or Elgin Baylor. Barkley might be the most popular and famous PF ever, but he has neither the rings or the stats that those other guys have.
April 14th, 2008 at 3:31 pm
Prof. TX says:
It’s close, but I’d tend to side with Barkley for this team. With a legendary center in the middle, Duncan would be giving you a team with essentially two centers. (I don’t care what the all-star ballot says, if you’re a post player with your back to the basket all the time then you’re basically a center by most playbooks). Barkely would have a more well rounded game and not be a free-throw liability. Your greatest of all time team should not let it’s opponents benefit from a ‘hack-a-(name)’ strategy.
And I think Hakeem does belong in the list of centers you name. He’s one of the most skilled of all time, with a grace and basketball IQ that most didn’t come close to. His prime didn’t last as long as some (Kareem), he didn’t take all of his team’s shots (Wilt), but he also didn’t just rely on being big enough to knock down other guys and dunk while the refs look the other way (Shaq). With Russell, it’s hard to compare, he faced a very different league at that time.
April 14th, 2008 at 3:47 pm
reidd says:
Duncan . not even close, Barkley is one of my favourite players to watch all time, but duncan is just simply better, i agree with others, id take mailman over barkley
April 14th, 2008 at 3:50 pm
Celts Fan says:
Duncan, no question.
and Amar, “one game, Karl Malone”? Umm, he was one of the biggest chokers in league history. Who came up shorter when it mattered? You need to reach all the way back to Elgin Baylor to find an answer to that.
the starting 5:
Magic
Michael
Larry Legend
Duncan
Russell (the 11 rings to 2 and my blatant homerism made the tie-breaker easy for me. If you’re the best player on a team that wins 11 out of 13 chips, you’re in.)
April 14th, 2008 at 3:50 pm
Cbizzle says:
A lot of people sleep on duncan because he doesn’t wow people with his style of play(I’m not saying dime is), but plain and simple he gets it done. I’d give a very slight nod to Duncan over Barkley because TD was more effective on the defensive end. But Chuck does deserve to be up there, especially seeing how effective he played the four despite being severly undersized to play that position(He was listed as 6′6, even though it is thought he’s really around 6′4-6′5)
April 14th, 2008 at 3:56 pm
Cbizzle says:
Prof. TX, you absolutely nailed it on Hakeem. Aside from what was said, throw in the fact that he was an all-time great defensive player, leading the league in blocks and rebounds in the same year a few times in his career. Also, consider that Hakeem in his prime was the most unguardable player in the league, and also that he dominated an era with more great centers(Robinson, Ewing, Shaq, etc.) than just about anyone mentioned for the Centers. Maybe he still wouldn’t get the top spot, but he definitely deserves to be in the conversation.
April 14th, 2008 at 3:59 pm
Jim says:
Please. Duncan. Whether you want the best 5 or just the best 4, he’s your choice. And I love Sir Charles, but Duncan is better in every aspect of the game except just putting the ball down and scoring, and maybe offensive rebounding.
I don’t like Malone but I would say he would be my #2. He was a much better defender than Barkley.
April 14th, 2008 at 4:02 pm
James says:
Duncan- 4 year college player- all american,player of the year
four time champion, all nba team every year in the league- i could go on and on- duncan without question
April 14th, 2008 at 4:05 pm
MoxWestCoastRep says:
All time 5
Magic
MJ
King James
KG
Kareem
My team smokes yours celts fan. My regards to Larry legend but couldn’t stay in front of bron to save his life!
April 14th, 2008 at 4:11 pm
rangerjohn says:
barkley could not compare to duncan, their carreer averages are almost identicle but if you look at their totals, duncan needs 2-3 seasons to pass barkley in rebounds, and points, he will come close to matching him on steals, and assists, but duncan already has more then double the blocks. barkley had a better shooting % (not by much) and his freethrows are not THAT MUCH better. 73%-69%. barkley has the personality and that is it over duncan.
on top of that, duncan has 2 mvp’s to one for barkley, the finals mvp’s and four rings
no contest.the ring is the thing
April 14th, 2008 at 4:16 pm
K Dizzle says:
LOL @ post 14. Mox, that’s cold but true.
This is impossible so I’m just goin with my twelve man squad.
Point - Magic backed up by Stock
2Guard - MJ backed up by Kobe
3Man - Larry backed up by Dr. J
4Spot - I don’t like Timmy but if i got money ridin, I gotta, backed up by Chuck
5 - He who avged 50pts( really think about that) and 25 rbs(think hard about that) 48 and 20 is a below avg. night in 48.5 MINUTES PER backed by by B Russell, only a fool ignores the rings
11th and 12th - Oscar gotta be on and my back up big is Kareem
That is your definitive all-time team, but it really hurts me to leave Worthy off and put on a two celtics and Tim. Damn.
My Laker all-time startin 5 so i can sleep tonight: Magic, West, Big Game, Wilt, Kareem - out of respecK to the vets, Shaq, Kobe on the bench
April 14th, 2008 at 4:20 pm
MoxWestCoastRep says:
K diz, no Vlade?? Lol.
April 14th, 2008 at 4:26 pm
K Dizzle says:
Mox
Oh you know Vlade’s deep on the bench with Nick at Nite, Coop, Elgin, Goodrich, Fish, Eddie Jones, AC and the man who carried us for a couple seasons….Ced Ceballos LOL
April 14th, 2008 at 4:41 pm
2 Easy says:
Kdizzle u saved me time and finger cramps. Ur all team is exactly the way I was making mine. Starting 5 same way. Good job homie. Wat about Devean George?
April 14th, 2008 at 4:41 pm
Jah says:
Greatest Lineup of All Time:
PG - Magic Johnson
SG - Michael Jordan
SF - Larry Bird
PF - Karl Malone
C - Wilt Chamberlain
BENCH
PG - Isaiah Thomas
SG - Kobe Bryant
SF - LeBron James
PF - Tim Duncan
C - Shaquille O’Neal
April 14th, 2008 at 4:43 pm
2 Easy says:
I forgot to say that I woulda chose Zeke to back up Magic instead of Stock but their both good
April 14th, 2008 at 4:44 pm
2 Easy says:
Crap I messed that up, I woulda had Oscar back up Magic and Zeke on the bench. There we go
April 14th, 2008 at 4:52 pm
kobeef says:
All players circa their MVP seasons (indicated in parenthesis..and best season for those with multiple)
PG = Oscar (1964)/ Nash (2006)
SG = MJ (1996) /Kobe (2008)
SF = Magic (1987)/Lebron (??)
PF = Duncan (2002) /KG (2004)
C = Shaq (1999)/Wilt (1966)/Kareem
A few comments to counter the attacks
- Shaq circa 1999 was the most unstoppable force ever to enter the low post. Stilt played in an era of shorter, weaker players and so his stats should not be your guide.
- Agree with the previous commnet re. Larry Legend. Great player but no match physically for circa 2008 Lebron.
- TD vs Barkley is a joke. TD is the greatest PF to play the game. End of argument.
- Oscar is listed as a PG and played the role. Imagine a starting 5 of MJ, Magic, Oscar, Lebron, Shaq. It would be possible on this team.
April 14th, 2008 at 4:53 pm
MoxWestCoastRep says:
Good call k diz, maybe even Rick Fox for the Hollywood factor.
How about this all time 5
J Kidd
Kobe
Pippen
Mail man
Dream
Yikes that’s filthy.
April 14th, 2008 at 5:00 pm
SaveOurSonics says:
c’mon now, its gotta be Barkley, He revolutionized the PF position, given he was undersized (height wise at least). i mean i love TD’s game and i respect the Mailman but they all had their respective HOF sidekicks (TD had Robinson, Mailman had Stockton) while Barkley had to it all by himself. Plus for some dude of his stature to average double-double(points and rebounds) throughout his career (remember he’s listed at 6′5″ on a good day)thats just amazing especially nowadays you got 7 footers that can’t even average at least 10 boards a game (umm i.e. Eddy Curry, LaMarcus Aldridge).
April 14th, 2008 at 5:17 pm
tigerdan says:
I think it depends on how you look at it. If you are looking at taking a player at their best then you take Barkley. His talent was amazing and he played above average defense, at his best. Another thing you have to look at is Chuck was the focal point of his team and the opposition’s defense. Excluding his first 2 years in the league, he played on some horrible Sixer’s teams during his prime years.
Now if you are taking a player based up consistency then you take Timmy D, hands down, I would even take him over the mailman. Remember Karl was good but he did not play defense as well as Timmy (except steals) and Karl would always start shooting that fadeaway jumper when he needed to go to the hoop. I am a Bulls fan and I must say that I truly believe that the Jazz would have won one of those series if Karl went to the basket more.
April 14th, 2008 at 5:35 pm
ldawg23 says:
ALWAYS TAKE THE WINNER…That is duncan, barkley was great. But he never won….Anything…other than Gold medals playing along side other greats. Timmy his a proven winner….If this was a pie eating contest BARKLEY hands down all day everyday son
April 14th, 2008 at 5:50 pm
Nimit says:
were talkin about an all time team here guys….no way LeBron gets ahead of Larry Bird…it may be different in 10 years….but right now….Larry Bird beats…and its not even close…
Duncan, everytime…although im wondering what happens to this question if KG wins a couple of rings with the Celts in the next 3-4 years…
The Team :
Magic, MJ, Bird, Duncan, Kareem
April 14th, 2008 at 6:06 pm
Mr Intl says:
1. Lebron
2. Mike
3. Kobe
4. Hakeem
5. Wilt
Not as much a perimeter threat as other lineups but creates a symphony of matchup nightmares. With LBJ as a floater on D, it’s a steals and swats lampoon. Dominant boards and just imagine a fastbreak led by Lebron, MJ tongue out and Kobe on the wing, Wilt trailing…Call the game at halftime, the bullies already crushed it.
April 14th, 2008 at 6:07 pm
Billy Sunday says:
I’m not sure about having Wilt or Bill being on my first team. I mean, who did they play against? Come on now, they played in an era that only had 8-17 teams. And, you can’t take away Barkley not being a winner. It is not his fault he played in the Jordan era. No one won during the Jordan era except during his first retirement. Even Tim Duncan’s Spurs would have lost to Jordan. I think DREAM should get the 5 spot. I think it could go either way with Barkley or Mailman @ the 4 spot.
April 14th, 2008 at 6:08 pm
snook says:
Duncan
April 14th, 2008 at 6:22 pm
daquest?on says:
barkley, even though duncan is taller, barkley has that swagger and plus hes wayyyyyyyyy more fun 2 watch than duncan
April 14th, 2008 at 6:22 pm
Bron42 aka I had springs before slamball says:
alot of you really dont kno ur sports history and are overlookin barkley.
first off lebron sholdnt even be mentioned in teh greatest of all time list if kobe isn’t on it.
second you mention barkleys rings? the only reason he didn’t have rings is cuz a guy named jordan was around and last i checked he was really good. Outside of shaq, whose team routinely beat duncan until recently, who has duncan really had to go against? Barkely was playing in the golden age of the nba when big men were big men and not 7′ foot small forwards or dunkers who had no other real game. not to mention he was 6′4 runnin the break (sixers) and clutch as hell while putting up big numbers on consistantly good teams (phoenix). I mean the ring argument is kinda funky since we all know theres a bunch of bigger hall of famers who are bitter that they played in the jordan era instead of now…i mean hell if your talkin rings, steve kerr is better then malone, barkley, duncan etc..
April 14th, 2008 at 6:25 pm
struan says:
1)AI,
2)steve francis,
3)lebron,
4)kobe
5)vince
run all these teams out of the gym.
April 14th, 2008 at 6:32 pm
struan says:
that’s what i thought, no one can front on my list
April 14th, 2008 at 6:36 pm
balla says:
It’s about time Franchise got some love, that boy can flat out play.
April 14th, 2008 at 6:49 pm
reezzy says:
I’m a huge Barkley fan and even I say Duncan. Duncan changed games defensively too. I would also put Malone in the mix too, though I hate his guts.
April 14th, 2008 at 6:52 pm
reezzy says:
By the way Dime, why is this part of your water cooler talk? Thought the people in your office should be debating topics with more insider NBA stuff
April 14th, 2008 at 7:04 pm
Bron42 aka I had springs before slamball says:
um barkley played defense.
struan put vince on a list like this? lol i worked with vince and i wouldnt even put him on my list.
April 14th, 2008 at 7:23 pm
Rob says:
Seriously, no one mentioned Malone, I am not a fan but, should be the a front runner for real. Duncan over Barkley
Peace
April 14th, 2008 at 7:29 pm
kobeef says:
@34
That is hilarious. I like the all “me first” team. I like Lebron but you gotta admit he likes being the man.
@Nimit
Larry made plays, had a nice handle and was a cold blooded shooter but the NBA today is a different world than it was in the 80’s. There are many, many reasons while the league and the world are diffent but I’ll leave it by suggesting that if you want to pick Larry fill your boots. Lebron would have 10 blocks on Larry in the first half and there’d be 10 new posters made of lebron dunking on Larry.
Anyone who thinks Sir Charles could take Duncan needs a lesson (watch http://youtube.com/watch?v=uN9FQ3RGjX8)
In the clip Duncan owns just about every all star big/defender in the modern era: Malone, Rodman, Shaq, Olajuwon…
Duncan is one of those rare athletes that is so extraordinary that he makes it look effortless but if you watch him play he tears teams apart (see last year’s playoffs as evidence)
April 14th, 2008 at 7:35 pm
Don Mega says:
CB34 , baby . rainin’ threes !
April 14th, 2008 at 7:39 pm
Ding Dong the Knicks are dead says:
Barkley took Shaq down in a fight (and many others). Enough said.
April 14th, 2008 at 7:51 pm
AY says:
why wouldn’t you run russell next to wilt? he was 6-10. magic mj bird russell wilt.
April 14th, 2008 at 7:53 pm
Don Mega says:
Furthermore ,
Duncan has a tongue ring .. .
and Sir Charles ‘effed Madonna .. come on !
April 14th, 2008 at 8:31 pm
BlazeMcHerbs says:
I hate to use the all-star game as a comparison, but you cant help but notice that if you have a dominant 5 like Wilt, or prime time Shaq, Tim Duncan’s game is completely useless if Michael and Larry are on the court. Hell, I’d rather have Barkley anytime. I’d take Amare Stoudamire over Duncan if i was making up this team. These guys dont need the ball to score, and when they do have the ball, they can score from all types of angles, and without the ball they are high flying rebounders. Just that i wouldnt take Amare because of his defense, but a young Shawn Kemp would do. KG. Anyone but Duncan.
April 14th, 2008 at 9:14 pm
godfreyallstar says:
duncan
April 14th, 2008 at 9:25 pm
The Truth says:
The numbers don’t lie. Barkley’s numbers were consistently insane. even his career averages are better than Duncans.
April 14th, 2008 at 9:44 pm
Marvin says:
-Russell (11 rings in 13 years as a pro in whatever era or sport this is tough to do and will never be duplicated)
-Duncan (4 rings and he at least is committed to playing team defense unlike barkley)
-Bird (3 rings and a len bias away from having more. Got the most out of his physical limitations. Just imagine if he had lebron’s body)
-MJ (6 rings greatest ever no argument)
-Magic (5 rings ultimate team player and entertainer)
Remember teams win basketball games not the individuals.
April 14th, 2008 at 10:19 pm
marcus the great says:
magic is listed as a point guard, but why not run him at the three?
stock/isaiah thomas
jordan (duh)
magic
i havent decided on the big men yet lol
April 14th, 2008 at 10:25 pm
marcus the great says:
oh yea, but i think i’d go wit Duncan over Barkley, as much as i hate that robot…
April 14th, 2008 at 10:26 pm
Ferdiberdi says:
I’ve crossed out malone. Choked every time.
Duncan is so fundamentally good it’s insane. His post moves and defense is textbook. He has it all.
Barkley plays with the most heart though. Gotta go with Barkley over Duncan just because I think there were more kids who wanted to grow up and play like Sir Charles LOL.
April 14th, 2008 at 10:55 pm
Promoman says:
Duncan. Worse case scenario, his offense is as good as Barkley’s. Barkley doesn’t compare at all defensively to Duncan. The only edge Barkley has on Duncan is sound bites.
April 14th, 2008 at 11:07 pm
kowtz says:
Barkley…
6′4″
serious rebounder…
better scorer…
faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaar better range on the J….
April 15th, 2008 at 12:28 am
Sam Boobie says:
Well, what a surprise — no mention of LeBron James. Here is further evidence, then, that Dime Magazine maintains an instituionalized bias against LeBron, and thereby severely weakens its credibility with the basketball community.
April 15th, 2008 at 12:53 am
jaceofspades says:
i actually think of the actual game that would go down if we were thinkin all time greats team. at pg id go with magic.. all point guards are around the same level of greatness but with magic i feel like hes so versatile if i had to sub someone else out he could fit in any position down the line and play well too. his height is great for defensive purposes too. mj at the 2, nuff said. at the 3 id go with larry bird to stretch the floor. at center, im gonna have to go with wilt. he was a harlem globetrotter man. dominance AND style. and at center if i were choosing between barkley and duncan… id go with barkley. a lil biased because im from philly. but as far as scoring, speed, rebounding, leadership, passion.. barkley by FAR. plus he’s funny. i could see this team runnin everyone off the court on the fastbreak with magic, jordan, and barkley. then if we had to slow it down.. wilt and bird with the inside outside game perfection.
April 15th, 2008 at 1:17 am
soydog says:
Duncan will end up being the best PF of all time, but there is no chance to put Barkley even in th #2 spot. Malone is (numberwise) the best PF and had one more Final appearance than Bark, played better D, knew his limitations (not trying to shoot the three) and took care of his body.
And by the way, what’s up with Elvin Hayes?
April 15th, 2008 at 2:47 am
todd says:
Still a lot of Duncan haters. Barkley over Duncan? Barkley scores and rebounds better than TD, I’d give him that. But giving the offense more dynamic with post play and that 15 foot banker? Anchoring the D with smart shot blocking? Not to mention underrated man to man D? TD definitely. Even over the mail man.
April 15th, 2008 at 3:12 am
karan says:
magic
MJ
bird
duncan
shaq
April 15th, 2008 at 5:01 am
marcus the great says:
after sleepin on it, i decided on the bigs. not taking into consideration the comp level back then, my 4-5 combo is russell-wilt. but all time, against superior athletes its the damn robot(TD is almost flawless), and lew alcindor (kareem for the slow) he played into his 40s and was a BEAST. dream shake backs him up along wit circa 2000 shaq.
which makes my squad somethin like:
isaiah/stock
duh/kobe
magic/lebron
duncan/sir charles
kareem/dream
***all respects to wilt, russel, O, bird etc i respect their games but this squad is unbeatable
April 15th, 2008 at 7:03 am
Big Al says:
i go with duncan, but then i never saw barkley play
April 15th, 2008 at 7:19 am
GEE... Where Brooklyn At? says:
Duncan!
April 15th, 2008 at 7:22 am
Lebron James says:
come on. Sam Boobie’s right. I get no love from nobody. No commercials, I’m hardly ever on tv anymore. Why you hatin on me, Dime? No more covers. I should be on every one. Dammit, I was on Vogue. Gimme my juice. I should have my own segment daily. You guys think about that.
My team is like this
PG - J
SG - A
SF - M
PF - E
C - S
April 15th, 2008 at 7:23 am
Lebron James says:
come on, Dime. Sam Boobie’s right. I get no love from nobody. No commercials, I’m hardly ever on tv anymore. Why you hatin on me, Dime? No more covers. I should be on every one. Dammit, I was on Vogue. Gimme my juice. I should have my own segment daily. You guys think about that.
My team is like this
PG - J
SG - A
SF - M
PF - E
C - S
April 15th, 2008 at 8:58 am
Celts Fan says:
You guys CAN’T put LeBron on this team yet. What has he ever done to deserve it? Come on fellas. Maybe when all’s said and done you can do that, but that’s a complete joke right now. Plus, don’t you want a dead-eye shooter to work off of everyone else? He’s the best fit for the TEAM, and he’s the best 3 ever, at least for the next 10 years until LeBron can prove he’s worth putting over him, which isn’t a foregone conclusion by any means. All of you trying to discredit Larry Bird need a history lesson.
April 15th, 2008 at 9:03 am
Celts Fan says:
The Full Squad:
1. Magic/Oscar
2. MJ/Kobe
3. Larry/Dr. J
4. Duncan/Malone
5. Russell/Wilt
April 15th, 2008 at 9:43 am
Nautic says:
pg = oscar
sg = jordan
sf = lebron
pf = garnett
c = wilt
most versatile team ever….everyone on here gets at least 6 rebounds, gets at least 4 assists and scores at least 20 points on average…. so thats
at least 100 points
at least 20 assists
at least 5 blocks
at least 5 steals
at least 30 rebounds
most consistent and versatile teame ever and thats based on minumum contributions…scary…..
April 15th, 2008 at 9:45 am
Nautic says:
those 5 guys, are doing what teams who play with 8-15 players do…and they all pass, rebound, score, defend….those 5 could prolly play 40+ minutes too or even 48 minutes each and beat a majority of teams in the league now with current rosters…assuming no foul trouble too..
April 15th, 2008 at 9:45 am
boogey banger says:
most of the cats on this board probably started watchin the NBA in the mid to late 90’s. The y don’t know that the chuckwagon was a beast in the early 80’s/ and most of the 90’s. I’m going with Chuck because he could do it all. If you don’t believe me go ask your papi and he’ll set you on the path to enlightenment.
April 15th, 2008 at 9:47 am
Nautic says:
backups would be
pg…healthy and motivated vc
sg= kobe
sf= healthy and motivated tmac
pf = duncan
c= healthy and motivated shaq
scary team for a 2nd unit too…
April 15th, 2008 at 10:01 am
Chris says:
The debate should be between Duncan and Malone, not Duncan and Barkley. Chuck was good, but not nearly as dominant as Mailman. He delivered for over a decade whereas Barkley did not have nearly the dominance that Karl enjoyed.
PG: Magic/Stockton
SG: Jordan/Kobe
SF: Bird/Baylor
PF: Duncan/Malone
C: Chamberlain/Shaq
April 15th, 2008 at 10:05 am
banga says:
How do you now go with tim duncan???
Sir charles was great, but he’s not even in duncans class…. and who said duncan doesn’t have a decent outside shot??? That banker from fifteen feet is all the room he needs to destroy teams…
If Duncan was a prima donna like barkley and other NBA superstars his points stats would be soo much better than nobody would even debate… That’s why Charles has ZERO championships and duncan has 4
April 15th, 2008 at 10:08 am
Nautic says:
maybe scottie pippen instead of lebron or tmac….dime needs to do a top all time versatile team, top 2 way (offensive and defensive players too)
April 15th, 2008 at 10:10 am
Nautic says:
dime needs to do a top all time 2 way players, most versatile team ever, top defensive plays by position too…
April 15th, 2008 at 11:01 am
Marvin says:
You only compete with who the competition gives you so don’t give shitty arguments such as barkley never won because jordan was playing argument. It’s like saying jordan never won the chip during the 80’s because kareem, magic, bird and isiah were around. Barkley’s teams never won because they lacked commitment to playing consistent defense. So what if Duncan’s Spurs never played those 90’s Bulls teams. The fact is they won 4 championships under his leadership. Cased closed. And don’t give arguments that steve kerr or (insert role player with championships) is greater than whoever because even though they had rings, they still never lead any team.
April 15th, 2008 at 2:28 pm
vertman says:
My vote is Barkely. Duncan is great too, but is toooooo soft & sucks monkey balls at FT’s.
April 15th, 2008 at 2:55 pm
Celts Fan says:
ummm, Duncan isn’t soft. He may complain a lot, but he’s anything but soft. Now the FT issue on the other hand…
April 15th, 2008 at 3:27 pm
Best PF says:
Kevin McHale.
April 15th, 2008 at 3:34 pm
Chuck says:
Timmy all the way baby!
April 15th, 2008 at 6:45 pm
doc says:
Duncan is better than Barkley. And if yall want to get technical Malone is too.I’ve seen plenty of games where Barkley just could not fuck with Malone’s size and strength and would get dominated in the clutch.Check the archives.This is MY 5 Magic,MJ,Larry Legend,TD,Kareem.Larry got the legacy but Lebron would give him 101.
April 16th, 2008 at 7:18 am
MSkittle says:
Call me old school but what about Bob Pettit? He averaged 26 pts and 16 rebs over his career! And Malone had a better career than Barkley.
April 16th, 2008 at 6:00 pm
smooth says:
id take barkley coz hes my boy, but duncan should get the spot he has the rings & finals mvps 2 back that up
April 23rd, 2008 at 8:34 pm
Javier says:
Barkley as others say “By Far Better Than Malone in His Prime” and definetly better than Duncan who is really a center playing in an overrated league. That also says Malone is better than Duncan especially in his prime .
Barkley has better complete game and better career averages than both too. This is not a race to see who played longer healthy or who won more titles its about who was batter B-Ball Player, and in that department Barkley wins because he was “Better, “More Efficient”, “More Talented”, “More Complete Gamed”, “More Important for His Team” (who fucking new the Suns before Sir Charles?) and “Better All Around Player Than Malone or Duncan”.
If i say Duncan is big time overrated i must also mention how Malone`s leveL in the play-offs always dropped contrary to Sir Charles. Why? It quite simple really: it was because he was finally guarded by better players not the lousy players of lower teams in the West but the better teams and his stat averages went down clearly contrary to Chucks.
Malone`s scoring game is work of the coaches not of his natural talent. That has even been seen in interviews where even his 1st coaches told him to go home work out more on his shooting and ball handling skills, exact reason why he was not in the top 10 picks in 1985 even though he was the PERFECT PF BODY PROTOTYPE BODY: TALL, STRONG UPPER BODY, ATHLETIC and had GREAT WORK ETHIC ….
But He Was Simply…
“Not Naturally Talented”
If You are Not Naturally Talented” you have to work harder in the skills departament, as like did for example Dennis Rodman, whom worked his body to become a great Defender and Rebounder (because thats all he could do). Malone worked his body movements to become like a football reciever that feeds of the great quarter-back Stockton on the fast break, “Coach Designed” “pick and rolls” for him to get loose from his defender were they key to his sucess pretty much because he obviously had alot of trouble in the one on one game deprtment or increating his own shot or creating of the dribble etc
Later in his career 1996 on he developed a good fadeaway shot due to “Hard Work”
This is quite obvious for people whom have watched both Charles and Malone play in their primes, see that “Malone was All Hard Work” and “Charles was All Pure Natural Brutal Talent”.
Only thing that Charles had to work on was going from 285 lbs to 250s and 260 and even when weighing 285 lbs or more between 1984 and 1988 he could do things that both Duncan and Malone could only dream of doing.
Lets analize Barkley`s, Malone`s and Duncan`s stats obviously taking into account that Barkley and Malone had way better competition in the 80s and 90s and also the fact that their averages dropped do the fact they played longer and age is age ofcourse.
CHARLES BARKLEY (Regular Season)
POINTS PER GAME: 22.14
SCORING EFFICIENCY FG%: 54.1%
REBOUNDS PER GAME: 11.7 (4 Offensive Rebounds Per Game)
ASSITS PER GAME: 3.9
STEALES PER GAME: 1.54
BLOCKS PER GAME: 0.83
3-POINT SHOOTING EFFICIENCY FG%: 26.6%[/COLOR]
KARL MALONE (Regular Season):
POINTS PER GAME: 25.0
SCORING EFFICIENCY FG%: 51.6%
REBOUNDS PER GAME: 10.1 (2.4 Offensive Rebounds Per Game)
ASSITS PER GAME: 3.6
STEALES PER GAME: 1.41
BLOCKS PER GAME: 0.78
3-POINT SHOOTING EFFICIENCY: 27.4%[/COLOR]
TIM DUNCAN (Regular Season):
POINTS PER GAME: 21.6
SCORING EFFICIENCY FG%: 50.8%
REBOUNDS PER GAME: 11.8 (3.1 Offensive Rebounds Per Game)
ASSITS PER GAME: 3.1
STEALES PER GAME: 0.8
BLOCKS PER GAME: 2.4
3-POINT SHOOTING EFFICIENCY: 19.0%
———————————————————-
“IN THE CLUTCH” (PLAY-OFFS):
[U]“Notice how Karls Numbers decrease in the clutch even do having better players in their Prime such as Stockton passing to him always and watch how Chucks increase”[/U]
CHARLES BARKLEY (In The Clutch, Play-Offs):
POINTS PER GAME: 23.0
SCORING EFFICIENCY FG%: 51.13%
REBOUNDS PER GAME: 12.9 (4.15 Offensive Rebounds Per Game!),
ASSITS PER GAME: 3.9
STALES PER GAME: 1.57
BLOCKS PER GAME: 0.88
FG% 51.13%
3-POINT SHOOTING EFFICIENCY FG%: 25.5%
KARL MALONE (In The Clutch, Play-Offs):
POINTS PER GAME: 24.7
SCORING EFFICIENCY FG%: 46.3%,
REBOUNDS PER GAME: 10.7 (2.6 Offensive Rebounds Per Game)
ASSITS PER GAME: 3.2
STEALES PER GAME: 1.34
BLOCKS PER GAME: 0.699
3-POINT SHOOTING EFICIENCY FG%: 16.2%[/COLOR]
TIM DUNCAN (In the Clutch, Play-Offs)
POINTS PER GAME: 23.8
SCORING EFFICIENCY FG%: 50.7%
REBOUNDS PER GAME: 12.5 (3.47 Offensive Rebounds Per Game)
ASSITS PER GAME: 3.5
STEALES PER GAME: 0.67
BLOCKS PER GAME: 2.75
3-POINT SHOOTING EFFICIENCY: 13.0%
———————————————————-
In Their Prime 11-12 Years of Chuck, Karl and Tim:
- I will take away Charles and Karl’s first year away since both of them where not starters giving the benefit to Duncan too and study their Stats, Averages and Complete Game. We are talking about 22-23 year old youngsters up untill they where 32-33 year old veterans.
PRIME YEARS (IN THEIR PRIME):
PRIME CHARLES (1985/86-1995/96)
Regular Season:
POINTS PER GAME: 24.2
SCORING EFFICIENCY FG%: 55.04%
REBOUNDS PER GAME: 11.87
ASSITS PER GAME: 4.16
STEALS PER GAME: 1.69
BLOCKS PER GAME: 0.909
3-POINT SHOOTING EFFICIENCY FG%: 25.94%
Play-Offs (Clutch Time):
POINTS PER GAME: 25.7
SCORING EFFICIENCY FG%:53.99%
REBOUNDS PER GAME: 13.29
ASSITS PER GAME: 4.41
STEALS PER GAME: 1.65
BLOCKS PER GAME: 0.96
3-POINT SHOOTING EFFICIENCY FG%:25%
———————————————————
PRIME KARL (1986/87-1996/97)
Regular Season:
POINTS PER GAME: 27.1
SCORING EFFICIENCY FG%: 52.90%
REBOUNDS PER GAME: 10.9
ASSITS PER GAME: 3.28
STEALES PER GAME: 1.46
BLOCKS PER GAME:0.836
3-POINT SHOOTING EFFICIENCY FG%:20.59%
Play-Offs (Clutch Time):
POINTS PER GAME: 27.1
SCORING EFFICIENCY FG%: 46.42%
REBOUNDS PER GAME: 11.84
ASSITS PER GAME: 2.59
STEALS PER GAME: 1.42
BLOCKS PER GAME: 0.79
3-POINT SHOOTING EFFICIENCY FG%: 11.53%
———————————————————-
PRIME TIM DUNCAN (1997/98-2008)
(Regular Season)
POINTS PER GAME: 21.6
SCORING EFFICIENCY FG%: 50.8%
REBOUNDS PER GAME: 11.8 (2.4 Offensive Rebounds Per Game)
ASSITS PER GAME: 3.1
STEALES PER GAME: 0.8
BLOCKS PER GAME: 2.4
3-POINT SHOOTING EFFICIENCY: 19.0%
TIM DUNCAN (In the Clutch, Play-Offs)
POINTS PER GAME: 23.8
SCORING EFFICIENCY FG%: 50.7%
REBOUNDS PER GAME: 12.5 (3.47 Offensive Rebounds Per Game)
ASSITS PER GAME: 3.5
STEALES PER GAME: 0.67
BLOCKS PER GAME: 2.75
3-POINT SHOOTING EFFICIENCY: 13.0%
———————————————————
To Summarize it All:
Scoring Per Game: Malone(Stockton Help)
Scoring Efficiency FG%: Barkley
Free-Throw Shooting Efficiency FT%: Malone
3-Point Shooting Efficiency FG%: Barkley
Rebounding Per Game: Barkley
Offensive Rebounding Per Game: Barkley
Passing/Assists Per Game: Barkley
Steals Per Game: Barkley
Blocks per Game: Duncan
TOTAL AREAS OF GAME DOMINANCE:
Barkley = 6
Malone= 2
Duncan= 1
CHARLES IS THE GREATEST MODERN POWER-FORWARD OF ALL TIME
END OF DISCUSSION
May 7th, 2008 at 3:43 am
Javier says:
Rank Player PER
1. Michael Jordan 27.91
2. Shaquille O’Neal 27.14
3. David Robinson 26.18
4. Wilt Chamberlain* 26.13
5. Bob Pettit* 25.37
6. LeBron James 25.17
7. Tim Duncan 25.10
8. Neil Johnston* 24.67
9. CHARLES BARKLEY* 24.63
10. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar* 24.58
11. Magic Johnson* 24.11
12. Kevin Garnett 23.93
13. Dirk Nowitzki 23.92
14. Karl Malone 23.90
15. Hakeem Olajuwon* 23.59
16. Julius Erving* 23.57
17. Kobe Bryant 23.57
18. Larry Bird* 23.50
19. Tracy McGrady 23.38
20. Oscar Robertson* 23.18
21. Jerry West* 22.90
22. Elgin Baylor* 22.70
May 7th, 2008 at 3:44 am
Javier says:
Career EFF Leaders
1 Wilt Chamberlain 41.50 14
2 Bill Russell 31.71 13
3 Oscar Robertson 31.61 14
4 Bob Pettit 31.11 11
5 Kareem Abdul-jabbar 30.93 20
6 Larry Bird 29.77 13
7 Elgin Baylor 29.74 14
8 Michael Jordan 29.19 15
9 Magic Johnson 29.10 13
10 CHARLES BARKLEY 28.16 16
11 Jerry Lucas 28.13 11
12 Shaquille O’neal 27.59 16
13 Hakeem Olajuwon 27.17 18
14 Kevin Garnett 27.13 13
15 Jerry West 27.10 14
16 David Robinson 26.98 14
17 Karl Malone 26.94 19
18 Tim Duncan 26.59 11
19 LeBron James 26.46 5