Does the NBA need a Stephon Marbury Rule?
Stephon (photo. Mannion)Maybe the NFL’s collective bargaining agreement is too drastic. Being able to cut a guy and totally void out his contract seems a bit one-sided. But with the current state of affairs in the NBA – Stephon Marbury holding the Knicks hostage for $21 million and Jamaal Tinsley reaching a total stalemate with the Pacers – it seems like something needs to be done.
This ongoing saga, specifically with Steph, is absolutely deserving of one of those clauses you hear about being added to a League’s CBA after a player has been a recurring problem for a while. In football, Roy Williams got the “Roy Williams Rule” after he horsecollared Terrell Owens and almost snapped his leg in half. In the NBA, Allan Houston got his name on a rule because his salary could have bankrupt the Knicks if it was magnified by a luxury tax penalty.
For all of the lawyers out there, what could the League actually do to help a team rebound when they’re stuck paying the salary of a guy who they desperately don’t want to have on the floor? Is there a way to create a new rule without tipping the balance of power in favor of the owners? With European teams lurking in shallow waters, hoping to nab the League’s talent, this might not be the time to change the face of player contracts. The day that contracts aren’t guaranteed is the day that CSKA Moscow sends a $30 million offer up front to the NBA’s biggest stars.
Does the NBA need a Stephon Marbury rule? And if so, what should it be?
September 26th, 2008 at 3:40 pm
Sam I Am says:
Yeah cuz a lot of these fools don’t deserve soo much money and they liabilities???!?!! ..
SORRY BUT NO!!
September 26th, 2008 at 3:42 pm
Michorizo says:
The rule should state “No Boning in the Parking Lot”
September 26th, 2008 at 3:42 pm
justice says:
Stop hiring these stupid phucking GM’s get someone that knows how to count in the building…balance ur budget, everyone can’t do what the knicks and lakers do these people will never lose money because of their location..know ur market…hint,hint(orlando)
September 26th, 2008 at 3:44 pm
Coop says:
I see Dime has sorted their website game out haha.
I posted my opinion on this in the section below but it bears repeating:
The onus is on the management of teams to engage their brains. Bailing out their retarded decisions doesn’t aid anyone apart from the richest of rich suits.
Take responsibility for your actions, SUITS!
Damned right he deserves the money he’s contracted to receive.
September 26th, 2008 at 3:49 pm
French says:
HELL NO – if the team makes an offer for X number of years at X dollas, they have to stay committed to that (unless the player does something to void the contract or something like that)…it’s the risk of doing business…why should they be allowed to get an opt or be saved
It’s like these idiot American Banks (sorry I’m Canadian)…why the hell should the gov’t step in with $700 B to save them, that’s basically saying you guys ALL completely screwed up but you know what, we got your back – what kind of message is that sending??? What kind of responsibility is that being placed with the decision makers? It’s pathetic…
People have to be held accountable for their decisions that they make period!
September 26th, 2008 at 3:53 pm
s.bucketz says:
i think sucking as bad as marbury does should void his contract
September 26th, 2008 at 3:54 pm
Desrat says:
As fuct as it sounds I agree with Coop. A signed contract is sacred, all the way back to Faust. It is the job of the management to make sure those contracts are good contracts. I can’t even get out of a cell phone contract that I sign, why should some dudes get better treatment than us in regards to contractual law?
September 26th, 2008 at 3:54 pm
Ace says:
heck no. marbury is owed $21.9 million and that is EXACTLY what he should get. he shouldn’t accept a penny less
September 26th, 2008 at 3:56 pm
Desrat says:
Plus, an NFL rostyer has support something like 65 guys all making 6 figures plus practice squads etc. It is to the benifit of the leauge that they get to cut players that are now dead weight (S. Alexander). NFL also doesn’t have CSK Moscow competing for the talent.
September 26th, 2008 at 4:00 pm
Celts Fan says:
NO! The NFL of all sports needs guaranteed contracts, not the other way around. If you sign a contract, fine, that $$$ is guaranteed, BUT GMs need to grow a pair. When Vince openly dogged it in Toronto or Marbury in NY, if I was the GM, I’d say, “Fine, play how you want, but we’re NOT trading you and you’re not playing. Go home; you’re not welcome here. Your checks will continue to come in full, but you will not embarrass this team anymore. I hope wasting ___ years of your career doing nothing is worth it. You will not be moved or bought out. You will be on our roster and nothing more until the day your deal expires (or the trade deadline when it’s an expiring deal.) Enjoy becoming the definition of wasted talent.”
It’s what the Birds shoulda done w/ TO, what the Raps should’ve done w/ Vince, what NY should do w/ Marbury, what the Raiders should’ve done w/ Randy Moss during his “football isn’t a priority to me” phase, and what the Sox should’ve done with Manny. I like most of those guys (all the non-basketball ones,) but if you don’t like your deal, DON’T SIGN IT. If you do and the checks are still coming, SHUT UP AND PLAY. If you’re making top 5 in your position (or league) money, YOU are expected to help raise up the team and make them better. Don’t complain that you need help or hate the situation.
September 26th, 2008 at 4:06 pm
Quest??? says:
yoooooooooooooooooooooooo did u know that lebron james is grew an inch and is currently 6′9 instead of 6′8 and not only that , he weighs now 260 instead of 250. Those are karl malone type body measurements!!!!!!
September 26th, 2008 at 4:06 pm
Quest??? says:
take out the is
September 26th, 2008 at 4:09 pm
that's whats up says:
nah, it was Lebron’s dick that grew an inch once Quest??? rubbed up on it.
get your facts straight
September 26th, 2008 at 4:18 pm
Prof. TX says:
You could make the full salary contingent on some factor. Say that half of the money is guaranteed and the rest depends on being active for 41 games, or something like that. That way, teams aren’t hit with full price for guys that won’t (or are too injured and can’t) play.
Or, if they don’t mind really making him mad, the team could fine him for ‘conduct detrimental to the team’ or something like that and end up recovering part of his salary in fines. Sneaky, but it would work.
September 26th, 2008 at 4:19 pm
me says:
they should do it like football. make a contract voidable, but allow for bonuses to be paid upfront but be divided by the numbers of the deal for team accounting. that way they get a certain amount guaranteed but if they don’t earn after awhile they can get cut while still having gotten a good amount of money and that would keep the franchises from being handcuffed.
or the teams could stop doing this arms race thing where one team offers more than the rest, so the next time more teams offer more (but one still offers even more), rinse and repeat. that’s how they got to where they are now. The very concept of a fully guaranteed contract is ridiculous, you can’t guarantee what that player is gonna do during that contract so why should the money he gets be guaranteed?
If they’re gonna keep it that way tho, then i don’t see why any player would accept anything less than what they’re owed. Nothing personal, just business. that’s what the team would tell the player if the player gets screwed, right?
September 26th, 2008 at 4:26 pm
mules says:
A contract is a contract, true…but that goes both ways. How many guys have a breakout season 1 or 2 years into a 5-6 year deal and immediately want more money? I’d love to see every player in the league on a short term deal (1 year max for the stars, everyone else gets 10-day contracts) for a minimal base salary with all sorts of performance incentives built into the contract. Something like winning teams get $500K to split between their players and losing teams get $250K. Maybe VC would actually try to make an impact every now and then if his paycheck depended on it.
September 26th, 2008 at 4:28 pm
Coop says:
Guaranteed contracts are there because of player-power. And fair play to them. The guys that own NBA teams aren’t poor. The amount of money these guys make for their ‘owners’ is massive, hence the high wages in the first place. The ONLY criticism of these contracts can be that it inhibits the creation of a team and thus the product.
September 26th, 2008 at 4:30 pm
Coop says:
Mules, contracts are offered BY THE TEAM not by the player. Who, therefore, has responsibility for these things?
September 26th, 2008 at 4:42 pm
mules says:
I’m not saying the players should make good money. I’d just like it to be more of a reflection of their performance on the court…not their agent’s performance at the negotiating table. Coop, I would agree that bad contracts are the GM’s responsibility.
September 26th, 2008 at 4:42 pm
mules says:
shouldn’t
September 26th, 2008 at 4:45 pm
Prof. TX says:
The teams offer the contracts, but the player’s greed should bear alot of the blame. I can take some of the random things from my desk here and put them on ebay for $20. If I wait long enough, somebody will probably buy it. It doesn’t mean that it’s worth that much, just that it’s what somebody paid.
Add in the fact that teams are worried about falling behind (and coaches/gm’s are worried about their jobs) and people will buy up just about anything that’s put on the open market because they don’t want to get worse by standing still.
September 26th, 2008 at 4:49 pm
Tom Toronto says:
I think the rule should just be, if a player plays less than 5 games in the season, their contract doesn’t count against the cap.
They still have to pay the guy, a deal is a deal, but if the team wants to spend the money to rebuild and/or move on, they can have the chance.
It’s fair for New York, it’s fair for Portland in the current Darius “I’m not dead yet” Miles situation.
@Michorizo – Lol, for sure that should be the new MSG rule.
@Celts Fan – True story! I said that back in the Vince days. They should have said “Vince,if you want to be traded, start playing like you’re worth two cents.” Otherwise, why bother trading him? Better to let him rot on the bench and when the contract is up, he can go elsewhere and get the veteran’s minumum for being a washed up bum.
September 26th, 2008 at 4:49 pm
sans says:
No more guaranteed money. Go like the NFL–huge signing bonuses and 3 years of guaranteed cash. Call it the “Laura Hughes” rule. The Knicks, who cannot trade Steph, who have bought out innumerable gigantic contracts, are a horribly run organization, mainly because their owner is mentally incapable of thinking outside of his ass. The fans should demand the Dolan step down and have his father take over.
Steph isn’t a bad player, but he ditched his team amidst an internal mental breakdown. The simple fact that NO ONE on his team, from management to individual players, wants to give him a break speaks volumes to the headache that he has become.
Oh, and the NBA should increase its market sharing agreement amongst teams as well.
I agree with “me”.
September 26th, 2008 at 4:55 pm
Ashlov says:
I don’t know why people have the mentality that athletes should be treated any different than a working stiff. If I go to work at my $80,000/yr job and decide to dick around all day and get nothing done, or talk shit about my boss, I should be fired. These assholes get to slack off, do insane shit, and get away with all sorts of stupidity, and STILL get paid.
Fuck that, they need to earn their pay like anyone else. That should apply to every single sport.
September 26th, 2008 at 5:02 pm
wanabballer says:
I just hate it when players have a “contract” year and go mad crazy, then when they get inked they play crappy. Its so frustrating as a fan who goes just for that player to see that happen – great for the player though. Its just sad to see the love of the game and my piggy bank money being used as toilet paper to wipe their million $$ @ss..
September 26th, 2008 at 5:05 pm
George W Kush Sr says:
Not in this situation, he’s ready to go on the court, wants to be on the court, still has game left in him and he’s owed that money. That’s Thomas and Dolan’s fault. Buyouts exist, ask the Knicks about Steve Francis.
But situations like the Knicks, where management made their bed, there should be no Mortgage bailout.
Nobody forced them to sign JeromeJames for that money. No one forced them to trade away a pick that could have been Lamarcus Aldridge on Eddy Curry.
No one forced them to take on Q-Rich’s contract.
Thomas was just one big fucking idiot with a blackcard type of checkbook
September 26th, 2008 at 5:08 pm
wanabballer says:
@ sans
I agree…
September 26th, 2008 at 5:10 pm
Coop says:
Prof, there is a proverb in business that states ’something is worth what someone is willing to pay for it’.
Sans, how does no more guaranteed money help someone’s situation and is that help warranted?
September 26th, 2008 at 5:10 pm
Drink the Haterade (KB24 Chip 09) says:
Coop says:
Guaranteed contracts are there because of player-power. And fair play to them. The guys that own NBA teams aren’t poor. The amount of money these guys make for their ‘owners’ is massive, hence the high wages in the first place. The ONLY criticism of these contracts can be that it inhibits the creation of a team and thus the product.
Actually a lot of these franchises run in the red or break even. It’s all the other investments the owners make that they have money like Donald Sterling own real estate and the Clips.
Also when Jordan played, he got like 3 mil from the Bulls and the rest came from endorsements so during 96-98 he got like 33 Mil a year. He deserved, He earned it. Last time I checked a lot of the cats didn’t earn anything. I’m in sales and if I don’t bring in money then I don’t get a raise. Same should be with these clowns (ALA Brian Cardinal, Bobby Simmons, Erick Dampier)
September 26th, 2008 at 5:45 pm
Celts Fan says:
@Wanabballer – that’s called a Tim Thomas.
September 26th, 2008 at 6:12 pm
ZACH says:
What about using the (I guess) Mike Finley Rule. Dallas still had to pay him his $55 million but he did count on the salary cap. Or how about structuring the contract differently so you get more money in the beginning of the contract and tapering off towards the end. instead of the last year or so being very big (Steph was a lot closer to a $21 mil/year player the year he signed the contract instead of this year) I also think this would help with the signing of free agents. You have superstar A for 3 years (of a 5 or 6 yr deal) and the bring in superstar B, superstar A’s salary would be going down so it would make for more flexibility
September 26th, 2008 at 6:23 pm
Coop says:
Decending contracts are a perfectly feasible route but players obviously prefer ascending. Hinrich, for example, has a decending value contract. It’s on the GMs.
September 26th, 2008 at 8:57 pm
weezy f says:
coop your a dick
September 27th, 2008 at 12:09 am
control says:
GMs have to wise up. Someone like Starburry would be a lot better to the knicks if he were to suffer some sort of “accident”.
The obvious answer is…create an “accident”. Sneak a box of Krispy Kremes into Starberry’s bag while he’s walking between Ecity and Fat Zach…oh snap, Startberry just got juiced.
Put starbarry onto his private jet…that somehow ends up off course and crashing in Greenland. Oops.
Accidentally assign stareberry’s to an NBA Cares program in OKC…on a secret redneck KKK compound, shit happens.
Bottomline is, GMs have to quite being pussies. Man up and bust a cap, create an accident or just straight choke a bitch.
September 27th, 2008 at 6:23 am
Coop says:
Thanks for your input, Mr F.
September 27th, 2008 at 7:31 am
Milk Lady says:
He’s a big star. I am his big fan. I saw him dating on a FREE & HOT dating site called ” ___~TALLLOVING.COM~___”. Seems he is hooking up with a hottie. The girl is from California. Very soft and sexy.
September 27th, 2008 at 11:46 am
Coop says:
Ash,
You don’t have a guaranteed contract, obviously. That’s unlucky. Don’t blame Marbury.
Milk Lady,
Fuck off you spambot piece of shit.
September 27th, 2008 at 4:03 pm
Mark says:
I agree with everybody that denounced the guaranteed money. But the solution really is pretty easy. Don’t want to pay that much money to the player, then don’t offer that much money. If the player goes elsewhere, then you didn’t offer him/her enough. Your commitment to signing equates to the desire to keep the player. Just check George Shinn.
If anything, the contract should have requirements. I always say that in baseball, if you have an error, you get docked money. I don’t know the contractual agreements between the two parties, but if there’s this many problems regarding the situation, then it’s something they need to revise.
September 27th, 2008 at 10:04 pm
edgy edgar ersuvius says:
I agree, something needs to be done. If it could be engineered so, a half-way deal would be preferrable in these situations. How do we do that? I don’t know; but then, I am not payed to know.
September 27th, 2008 at 10:06 pm
edgy edgar ersuvius says:
@control: his nickname never was either one of these: starberry, “‘berry, or stareberry/barry.
September 28th, 2008 at 1:30 am
Yucca Man says:
There’s probably no going back from the guaranteed contracts now, sadly enough. And the Knicks management deserves their share of blame for the mess. But let’s be honest, if any of us did the crap Marbury has done when we were at work, we’d be fired, we’d deserve to be fired, and nobody would cry for us.
Guaranteed contracts should have more contingency clauses, and if the player breaks them then forget it: things like insubordination, getting arrested, having sex in pickup trucks with front office interns, etc. Just a normal on-the-job conduct guidelines. If the player breaches them, and if the team can document it, then forget it. Tear up the contract and send the idiot on his way, penniless. I mean I could be fired for any of these things, why should an NBA player be exempt?
September 29th, 2008 at 9:23 am
Danny says:
Get that money Brooklyn!