Gilbert Arenas Won’t Vote

NBA / Oct 24, 2008 / 9:00 am

Gil-Zero Doesn’t Vote

With the election a few weeks away and voting in some states already taking place, it’s hard to avoid the subject of politics. With such a high profile race between Barack Obama and John McCain, it would be silly to think that the age old question of “Who are you voting for?” would not be asked in NBA locker rooms.

I talked with Corey Brewer a couple weeks ago about what he’s doing to get involved in the campaign, excited that he’ll be voting for the first time. And Andrew spoke with a bunch of the NBA rookies. They, along with guys like Chris Paul, LeBron James, Baron Davis, Etan Thomas, Charlie Bell, Derek Fisher, Chris Duhon, Chauncey Billups, Greg Oden, Jerryd Bayless and Channing Frye have all gotten involved in the movement one way or another, whether it be speaking at rallies or donating time and money.

Even Spencer Hawes, who will be voting in his first election as well, is getting involved – voting for McCain. Nonetheless, even in such a landmark election, some players just aren’t that excited about voting.

“People get sour-faced when you talk about politics and voting,” said Wizards guard Gilbert Arenas, adding that he doesn’t plan to vote.

Arenas, who is slated to earn $14.5 million this season after signing a six-year, $111 million contract this past summer to remain with the Wizards, said he is fearful that both candidates will raise his taxes.

“The first Bush said he wasn’t going to tax nobody,” Arenas said. “It doesn’t really matter who the president is. They say whatever they need to say to get in office.”

For a player as high profile and outspoken as Arenas, playing in our nation’s capital, is it wrong for him to publicly take that stance?

Source: Washington Post

Posted in NBA |

103 Responses to “Gilbert Arenas Won’t Vote”

October 24th, 2008 at 9:05 am

fallinup says:

God forbid his enormous paycheck gets taxed. Just for the record, McCain doesn’t plan on taxing you anymore, Gil…you may even see a bigger tax cut later on because of your high income. Obama will raise your tax rate from 36% to 39%, which is what it was under Clinton…you make over 250K a year.

Either way, your dumb for not voting. And your lamebrain excuse of thinking that both will raise your taxes is pitiful at best…considering your a gajillionaire.
October 24th, 2008 at 9:14 am

Notorious says:

So tired of all the stupid articles folling this vastly overrated, always injured and forever stupid moron. Agent 0, must stand for 0 brains, way to put your blatant stupidity on full display. Look forward to another year of more quotes then games played for Gilbert, what a complete douchebag.
October 24th, 2008 at 9:14 am

Sam I Am says:

This is land of the free, will and decision that is.

If he doesn’t want to vote that’s fine, HOWEVER he must not and can not speak his opinion after the dust settles and things go wrong, because of the fact he never voted for one side vs the other.

It’s kinda sad to be a public figure and not encourage people at least to vote for who or what they believe
October 24th, 2008 at 9:17 am

Patrick says:

Alright, I think I might get some backlash for this, so I will preface with the fact that I will probably vote for Obama because I think McCain is so old he will probably die during the term and it would be terrible to have president sarah palin. We don’t have good choices. Neither candidate has a good plan for the economy other than to further sink us in to debt. Our country is going to continue to waste money and resources regardless of the figure head. I just hope I can get in to the 250k+ bracket to be pissed about my voting decision by the end of the term.

Gil is the man on the court even if he is a bit crazy time off it.
October 24th, 2008 at 9:17 am

QQ says:

Props, fallinup. It Gil only opening his mouth only to spark discussions or is he really a bastard who could not grasp the concept of tax cuts?
October 24th, 2008 at 9:46 am

blah says:

@ #4:

Although i don’t completely agree, i’m glad someone said what i was basically thinking.

Most elections are like making someone choose “where you wanna get shot- head or gut?” Then saying it’s their fault they got shot if they didn’t choose one.
October 24th, 2008 at 9:47 am

blah says:

oh yeah, and #1 and #3 are idiots, clearly buying into this country’s lies.

Y’alls bball comments are usually on point tho.
October 24th, 2008 at 9:49 am

nick says:

in my opinion, how can anyone vote for mccain with the risk that palin would become president. however gil’s decision to not vote is an ignorant move. yes he will taxed probably more then before however, he is making over $15mil a yr. so instead of being taxed a million he gets taxed 2. is he honestly actually gonnna notice that million?
October 24th, 2008 at 9:49 am

deegee says:

Arenas is the most overrated player in the L.
October 24th, 2008 at 9:52 am

Sam I Am says:

@ blah

thank you good sir
October 24th, 2008 at 10:04 am

control says:

It says a lot about McCain when even rich people can’t bring themselves to vote for him. Obama is going to raise my taxes quite a bit, but even then I’d vote for him…if McCain hadn’t caved into the “base” of the republican party and turn his back on everything he did in his life to run this campaign, maybe it would be a different story. The guy has even sunk to picking an absolute idiot for VP just to cater to the extreme right bible beating jesus camp running fucktards.

If McCain does somehow win…it’s McCain 08, Palin 09. He’s one hard sneeze away from death.
October 24th, 2008 at 10:05 am

hustleharder says:

Yes, it is wrong for Arenas to say this. I understand it being a free country and all and him being able to voice his opinion but damn dawg! People, his people, died so that blacks could have the right to vote. And yeah I understand that he may not like either candidate but to not exercise this right, in my opinion, is just disrespectful to our ancestors. As ice cold as Arenas is in ball, he wouldn’t even have the opportunity he has if it wasn’t for our ancestors.
October 24th, 2008 at 10:20 am

YOUNGFED says:

@Control
GTFOH Obama ain’t raising your taxes fool. You only making’ 10-20 grand if that (lol). Mickey D’s pay checks are tax free anyway (lmao).

Naw but on a serious notE good point post#1 and @post#7 KILL YOUR SELF.
October 24th, 2008 at 10:34 am

control says:

YOUNGFED,

I paid more in taxes on the cars I bought this year than you made fool.
October 24th, 2008 at 10:57 am

YOUNGFED says:

Dang Never new a Nissan Altima cost that much. lmao

BTW GTFOH(x)2

@Control
You change your name to losing control. It’s juuuussst coooomedy.
October 24th, 2008 at 11:00 am

control says:

YOUNGFED,

Yea, you are a big time baller if you don’t even know how much a fucking Altima costs. Stick to the 1988 Kcars with spinner hub caps son.
October 24th, 2008 at 11:00 am

LaMont says:

Professional athletics is the new slavery system with college and high school serving as the Middle Passage of our era. Gilbert has clearly made it into the house. As house niggers used to say “we sick” when their master was sick, Gilbert took less money for the team. He’s not the only one out there and for him and those other black athletes who choose not to vote they are in essence saying “Whateva Nigga” to those before them that fought, suffered and died for them to not only have the right to vote but to have access to education and the opportunity to play in the professional arena. Think Jackie Robinson wouldn’t vote? Hit these sellouts where it hurts them, no more Arenas jerseys, boycott Wizard games (how ironic is it that he plays for a team called the Wizards in the nations capitol at that?). It is clear that Agent Zero stays tuned in to Channel Zero.
October 24th, 2008 at 11:04 am

Kudabeen says:

I wouldn’t say so…It’s not smart, but it’s not wrong. You vote when you feel you have a stake in the result. It is the job f the candidates to convince voters that they have a stake beyond the cliche qoutes of mis-placed patriotism and mis-represented historical references that suggest we have a responsibility to vote, because people died for that right…

For Gilbert, maybe he can’t get passed his money, which makes sense in a society, that is anti-family, anti-intelligence, and anti-justice. We live in a ‘Just Us’ socio-economical country. Money is the bottom line. If his taxes is all he cares about that is just as American as Apple Pie. Education, Health care, Energy, and War are not the issues of the wealthy. You can pay to get the best education and health care. You can afford all the energy resources you need. And you make enough to pay for a good seat to watch the absurdity of War.

Not a smart move and I’m not sure that he could really defend his stance if he was confronted. Yes people died for inclusion. That is true…People are still dying, but guess what they are nameless and faceless STILL…That doesn’t inspire hope in people. Obama can have 100 speeches, but that is not going to convince the routinely F’d over that they have a stake in National politics, when they are getting their asses handed to them locally.

The grassroot organizations have to touch those people first and the hope is Obama will give a stronger voice to such organizations seeing how his background is one of grassroot movement.

I’m voting. I’m not rich. I know that Obama says he will cut my taxes, but that won’t make me successful. I’m voting because I don’t want idiots sending my family overseas to die to secure their future economic standing…Bush and Cheney (aka Beelzebub) literally are getting away with murder, but any order carried out with a Presidential seal of approval is protected by this ridiculous lie of Patriotism… I’m still figuring it all out, but I can’t call anyone wrong for voting Red or Blue. I can’t call anyone wrong for not voting…
October 24th, 2008 at 11:09 am

Kudabeen says:

@control

LOL…”A sneeze away…”

McCain does look really flaky to me. Like skin-peal, crept-keeper kind of flaky… I used to like the man and thought he was a guy that was beyond a lot of this non-sense, but I guess after Bush beat that @$$ when he ran before he decided if I can’t him then I’ll join him. He went and hired the same people that he despised for what they did to him in 2000/2004 to run his campaign in 2008…To quote Onyx, McCain Camp is “Shifty, Low-Down, Gritty, and Grimy”
October 24th, 2008 at 11:11 am

rangerjohn says:

well 99% of everyone here knows where i stand so no need to go there once again.

to all the “mccain is gonna be dead in a year” or the “mccain is to old so i cant vote for him”, you people are just idiots.

on the tax issue, there are more taxes then just income tax, the left (read obama) are planning to raise gas taxes as an example.

question, how many people here honestly believe that taxing business more (business tends to fall into the 250k+ category) is a good way to create new jobs or promote higher paying jobs?

see i own a construction company, we fall into that bracket, i will be taxed more, in turn i will have to turn that over to my customer (new home builders) along with the other 30 construction trades that work for them. now those home builders are supposed to eat that increase? or do they ad that onto the price of the home? now when they ad that onto the price of the home, increaseing the cost to the customer (you guys who need a new house) are you going to pay a higher price on a house that has a lower value? NO, so the home builder has to lowe r his inventory by not building new homes until one is sold, which means i loose the majority of my work, which means i have to lay people off, which means i dont make as much money, which means i will drop out of the higher tax bracket eventually, which means my taxes will come down. so thanks mr obama, i guess in the end i will get a tax break right!

but then his plan offers ABOUT $1000 per house hold making less then 250k or in other words, $83.33 per month, or $19.23 per week, or $2.74 per day. now i will be able to get that order of 2 tacos, and a large coke at jack in the box. which in turn means i will be that much closer to a heart attack, and will need that socialized health care he is offering. OH WAIT there is still that gas tax increase, which he has (in the past unless he has changed his mind AGAIN) in ABOUT $.05 per gallon. now i buy about 250 gallons per week, so thats about 12.50 per week EXTRA in taxes. in other words, i will only have about $6.73 per week left if he doesnt raise ANY other taxes. now thats $.96 per day so i guess i cant get that order of tacos or the coke unless i put my own money in because the food cost is likely to go up due to higher transport costs due to the fuel tax increase. besides .96 is not enough when the food plus the local tax here in houston is $1.07. but the bright side, i geuss i will not need that socialized health care because i will not be eating all that nasty grease. THANKS PRESIDENT OBAMA, YOU THE MAN!

NO FUCKING WAY
October 24th, 2008 at 11:11 am

control says:

LaMont,

I would in no way shape or form say that Gilbert took less money. The guy is making like 5 mil less over his contract…a contract that is still goin to cripple the Wizards and weigh them down so they can’t get better or sign anyone. It’s like an average Joe passing over a 25cent/hour raise when he already makes $25/hour.
October 24th, 2008 at 11:16 am

rangerjohn says:

AS FOR GILBERT NOT VOTING,

if you dont vote, you cant be wrong, RIGHT? WRONG! if you dont vote you can not complain about who ever does get ellected. if you dont take a stance, you have no room to speak.

you dont have to vote obama or mccain, there are other people running, libertarian, independent, what ever VOTE.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjo85WhbYqM&eurl=http://www.alltexasforums.com/showthread.php?t=1884
October 24th, 2008 at 11:17 am

LaMont says:

2 Control,

When I said he took less money it was to emphasis my point about how these athletes make it into masters house and associate themselves as one with the master (i.e – when master is sick the house nigger feels and says “we sick”). Gilbert leaving any amount on the table so “we can get better and be able to sign some more talent” (not quoting, paraphrasing) is making that association. He needs to check his history and remember how the Wizards gave Michael Jordan his “Nigger” wake up call and then evicted him from the house as well.
October 24th, 2008 at 11:24 am

control says:

ranjaboy,

McCain has the highest percentage chance of dying in office over any other candidate for POTUS ever in history. You may not like it, but it’s reality. Because of his catering to right wing christian extremists, he picked a VP who has shown herself to be an absolute joke. He has turned his back on everything he stood for in 2000.

The tax increases Obama is putting in is actually just him letting the Bush tax cuts expire. I don’t know how that will affect me because I wasn’t making good money back then. One thing I DO know, being an employer myself, tax breaks to companies aren’t the way to create jobs. I hire people because I can make more money from them than they cost me. When people who own businesses get a tax break, they don’t think “oh good, now I can hire some more people with this money!”, they think “oh good, I just made some more money!”. Tax breaks don’t “trickle” down, they stop where they are given, period.

Of course, I am against all taxes, mainly because the government is so incompetent that they will piss away any money put in…but if I have to pay, I would rather the small amount of money that does make it where it suppose to go, goes to help some people instead of going to unneeded wars.
October 24th, 2008 at 11:27 am

Rob says:

YOUNGFED you suck. PERIOD.

I think you should get back to cleaning windshields with your newspapers.

Ranger John you the man, b/c you always come correct with your info.

Control I’d bet a strong sneeze by Secret Service would put you right…

LOL Posers
October 24th, 2008 at 11:31 am

control says:

Rob,

Yeah, you are right, good thing I ain’t running for POTUS. I’m sure someone from the Secret Service could beat your ass too, what the fuck is your point?
October 24th, 2008 at 11:32 am

GEE...I got a bounty on George Karl. says:

Personal opinion. Yea he wrong. Based on what blacks and others went through alone he should vote for someone. There are to many different issues and things that each candidate has that I am sure he could align himself with one.
Also with the way kids and even young adults (who can vote) look up to him, he should be trying to vote. As simple as people are you know there are some young cats going “Yea man he is right, it don’t even matter, I ain’t voting either”.
He obviously either doesn’t know or care about the history behind certain people even being able to vote.
I lost a big measure for pimpin.
October 24th, 2008 at 11:35 am

Kudabeen says:

Lamont

I appreciate your style of writing, but I think your off base. This whole William Rhoden ’40 million dollar slave’ concept has merit, but we can’t blindly afix this moniker to every athlete. Voting is one of the biggest crocs in this country. Votes are stolen, casted aside, falsified, and a whole slew of trickery is done by “our” “public servants” and their supporters. I was watching the movie, I think it’s called Recount with Kevin Spacey, where they basically told the story behind the mess that went on in Florida in 2000. I have little faith in the process, but I’m participating, because it doesn’t take much.

Gilbert is a basketball player…Just like you do whatever it is you do…We don’t throw up quotes from Mr. Sanitation worker and use him as scapegoat to apply all blame of what’s wrong or how absurd people can be. Gilbert I believe does pay his taxes, does give back to the community, does take care of his family, and that to me is way more important than his vote. His money and profession and fame does not place him above the human condition…America is a system of lies, mismanagement, and corruption…

You serve your law and government and that’s cool. Some serve God and their family…It’s a choice. I respect the law ONLY, because I know I’m needed and I have a purpose. One that can’t be satisfied dead or behind bars. Gilbert is a ball player, father, soon to be husband, and all around productive citizen…Get of the house slave non-sense. It’s people that use that kind of rhetoric that keeps a people back more than those who embody the supposed characteristics. Call Ward Conneley out or someone else, not a Basketball player. Rhoden is right about athletes need to empower themselves and not be pawns, but many do that, we just are too judgemental and disconnected to recognize for every Pac-Man, there is two or three Grant Hills waiting doing their things at home and not just the court…

My opinion. I hate hearing people call someone else slave, especially in the context of defending a country that Supports (Present Tense!) Slavery…We financed Bush and his company’s dealings…We did…Get mad about that…
October 24th, 2008 at 11:35 am

Kudabeen says:

Apologize for the spelling, but I was a little lit…
October 24th, 2008 at 11:38 am

Rob says:

McCain in 2008 and he’ll repeat in 2012
October 24th, 2008 at 11:39 am

rangerjohn says:

control

obama has just as much chance of dieing as mccain, there is not “chance of death %” come on man realisticly, do you not think some knuckleheaded racist redneck is not going to shoot obama before the end of his 1st term? it will happen hell they have already tried.

as for taxes “trickling down” by employers, you are correct, tax breaks for employers do not directly increase jobs BUT (this is what you missed) tax INCREASES DO DIRECTLY EFFECT LAYOFFS. when a company has to pay extra for every employee or every $$$ or both it hurts the bottom line, so you have to turn the cost over the somoene or do you eat it? if you eat it then you are no business person, the cost has to go somewhere.

as an example, lets use gilbert as a “business”, he is making 14.5 mil a year (good business yes?) now if he has to pay an additional 3% (obamas plan doesnt just let the bush breaks go, he is going to INCREASE AND let the bush plan go but we will just use the 3%) that is a tax INCREASE of $435,000 a year, so as a business man would you EAT the ADDITIONAL $435k? hell no! i know i cant do it! at 39% (obamas plan is taking him closer to 48% not the 39% you proposed) the agent zero busienss is paying $5,655,000 in taxes a year. in other words that 3% increase is actually about 8.5% of his total taxes.

you do not increase taxes on anyone in a time of bad economy. this is not the time for social programs, it is not the time for socialistic taxing the rich to give to the poor, it is the time to cut back on taxes AND spending.
October 24th, 2008 at 11:41 am

William Prince says:

This is one of the best questions posed on this page in a long time. Although it can easily get on your nerves. All this politics stuff especially this time around and with the massive media coverage.
I’m glad that he took that stance publicly. Of course you may crticize him although I don’t believe that his influence on potetional voters is too great. You can’t really knock him for his statement since he basically said the truth. Politicians will do anything to get in office whether they’re called McCain or Obama it doesn’t really matter.
I’d vote for Obama nevertheless since he’s the lesser evil in a dirty game called politics.
October 24th, 2008 at 11:49 am

control says:

ranger,

I agree on the part about new spending. Put a leash on the STUPID spending in the government right now and shit would be under control (does the country seriously need to spend money watching birds migrate?). One thing you are overlooking, and using Gilbert as a business model doesn’t capture it, is that taxes aren’t on GROSS, they are on PROFIT. Taxes don’t change Revenue or Expenses, but it will cut into the profit percentages of a company (assuming creative book keeping isn’t already being implemented). If your company spends 800k to make 1mil, then the additional 3% of taxes would come out of the 200k…yes it sucks, but it still doesn’t put you in position where you would HAVE to lay off people. Infact, you might lose more money BY laying off, assuming that the employees you have are profitable workers. Your business could be different than mine, but I have solid metrics in which I can see at any given time how profitable each employee is and go from there.

I would honestly be all for classic republicans. Reduce government intervention, spending and presence. Promote financial responsibility and accountability. Unfortunately, the current republican party doesn’t stand for those things…they are as much into socialism and hand outs as the dems.
October 24th, 2008 at 11:53 am

Kudabeen says:

Ranger John

I always read exactly what you write, because you seem to really believe it and not just write for reaction like I used to think you do…I rarely agree with you and don’t really agree now, but we can’t say that Gil has looked at all his options like a true involved citizen should, because clearly he is detached…

My question is about your tax rationale…If your business taxes are increased and you pass that cost on to the customer, then what’s your beef? Then that makes you an astute Business man that does what most business men do and will do no matter who is in office…If you were a fervent consumer advocate I can get with that rationale, but I don’t see that…Your competitors will probably do the same or if they are equally astute or better at doing business they will find ways to curb cost and even write off a number of expenses to save money, thereby keeping cost low enough to profit and compete for the customer’s business.

I know you are a McCain guy, but Obama is not going to hurt you. We all will hurt if the country’s leadership doesn’t reflect the kind of intelligence and diplomacy needed to re-establish and enhance our position in the Global economy as well as the global sentiment…

Just saying…
October 24th, 2008 at 11:56 am

David Brandon says:

this one is a little different b/c had anyone else said this, it wouldnt really be viewed as being “wrong”. but b/c its gilbert and he has such a large audience, its taken w/ a twist. on one hand, he has a right as any one of us to say whatever he feels as long as it doesnt infringe on someone else, up to and including voting. on the other hand, to somewhat echo what GEE said, given the history of african americans have had in the US, it puts him in a very negative light to say something like this. people need to vote regardless. it gives you a voice and for some, the price to obtain that voice came at someone else’s life. so i dont take it as that light of a topic. everyone knows gil says stuff like this all the time, but a line should be drawn somewhere. a lotta guys in here have said it: kids look up to these guys. it might not affect a lot, but others might be a bit more impressionable. and when youre playing in the nations capitol, it looks even crazier! and saying that whole thing about his taxes when he just got cashed the hell out is a no go. if steve novak says that, maybe…he’s not ballin like gilbert is. so for him to have that sound like the foundation on which he’s making that decision…wow.

the thing w/ celebrities tho, is that the more popular someone becomes, the more the public tends to feel like that person “belongs” to them. like they HAVE to fit that persona everyone has of them or else. maybe he felt it was his right to say what he wanted and didnt think about or didnt care about what everyone would think, but it just looks pretty bad man. esp given the ramifications that can follow from this election. its global. everyone’s not only watching how this plays out, but they’re also looking at society and how we’re all taking it in.

*steps down from his soapbox*

i’m out like josh howard’s turn in the hot seat…..
October 24th, 2008 at 12:01 pm

Kudabeen says:

“this is not the time for social programs”

Says the Sociopath

If a man has legitimately fallen or been kicked down, I’m one to help him up and get better…This money-sick mentality is what keeps us dying, killing, and stealing…We refuse to help those up and step over them, then act shocked if they start yanking those who turn their noses up at them down to their level. Wealth is you and your families health and happiness. It’s good to be financially secure, but being materialistic and selfish is not a winning hand to play
October 24th, 2008 at 12:03 pm

rangerjohn says:

control

gilbert as a company is exactly the point, he is in all actuality a business, his profit is 14.5 mil realisticly.

as another example, i own a construction company, we have consistently done about 12-14 mil a year in gross sales, i carry about a 15% profit margin, which gives us a 1.8-2.1 mil a year PROFIT. now with as you say ” creative book keeping” I might get that down to say 1.3 on average (to use numbers these are not exact) now that means i have to pay an additional 39k a year in taxes, thats ADDITIONAL. that 3% means i am now paying 507,000 in taxes. that 39k is more then i would realisticly bet the majoirty of the people on this site make in a year. so am i supposed to eat another persons salary a year? NO, again i would have to turn it over to my customer in the form a a per job price increase. now say i do 100 houses a year (to use an easy number) that means i have to turn over $3900 in price increases per job. me and the plumber, the framer, the electrician, the roofer, the ac company and so on. in the end that 3% will inturn be more along the lines of a 10-12% increase to the builder, so they have to turn that over to the home buyer, so lets see,

a $200,000 house has to go up by say 10% (again to use numbers) so that makes the new home cost $220,000 BUT the current market (over the last 2 yrs) has brought the value of that home DOWN to more in the $180,000 range (if not more). now who in tehir right mind would buy a $180,000 home for $220,000? NOBODY, so the home builder slows down, which means i have less work. if i have less work, then regardless of how “efficient” my employees are, i cant afford to pay the and i have to let someone go.

this again is a simplified version using simple numbers to get a point across.

taxes should not be raised on anyone to make the economy work. mark my words, if obama gets elected and implements his tax policies, things will not get better and we are looking at double digit unemployment.
October 24th, 2008 at 12:12 pm

rangerjohn says:

kudabeen
i think you have missed the point,

for the social programs, we already have many in place, i am not saying drop them all, i am saying we do not need new ones. work the ones we have out make them more effective sure but new ones? no way.

as for the “competition” doing as i would have to do to stay profitable, sure they will, we will all end up in the same boat, BUT the point is, when we all raise prices, then we turn it over, which does not hurt me, then the customer turns his price increase over to the consumer (those of you in teh market for a new house) now when the price of the hosue goes up, people cant afford them, so they will just go rent an apartment or buy a used house. this inturn limits the amount of work, which myself and my competition has to fight for. we either lower our prices (eat the higher taxes) or the builders cant afford to build new homes, they slow down or close down, and i have no work, i am out of business. raising taxes CAN AND WILL do this.

hell home builders are already hurting as it is, and i know of 3 off hand that have already close their doors i nteh last year. think what will happen if someone makes their COST GO UP even more?
October 24th, 2008 at 12:13 pm

YOUNGFED says:

@Rob
Suck it Easy punk. Get’cha paper up before you holla at me. I see my Mickey D’s count must have hurt someone’s feeling’s. “I suck”, what are you like ten years old. You can do better than that. And “Posers” what are you the Skate Kid. lmao
October 24th, 2008 at 12:14 pm

Jay26th says:

Are taxes the only issue he cares about? The War? The failing economy?
October 24th, 2008 at 12:14 pm

control says:

ranger,

I don’t disagree with what you are saying because my company isn’t in the building houses business. From what you are saying though, it seems it is the prices of houses falling that is hurting you more than anything. Also, using your numbers, assuming 12mil in sales at 200k, that’s 60 houses. Having an additional 39k taken away from your profit margin (reducing it from %15 to approx %14.5 assuming everything is the same) increasing the price on 60 houses by 20k is kind of unrealistic. That is an increase of 1.2million to compensate for the 39k. Like I said, I’m not in the home building business (though I have built my own house) so I might be missing something.
October 24th, 2008 at 12:21 pm

rangerjohn says:

control,
as i said the numbers i presented where for ease of arguement, i could go into much much more detail but it would be a waste here really.

point is, i am not the only person having to do this, i am not the only contractor effected, if i turn over 3900, and so do the other 10-20 contractors, what does that turn the price of the house over to? if 10 of the subs have to turn over the same number as me, thats 39k in additional cost to the homes price, not to mention the builder themselves haveing to pay higher taxes ontop of our price increases.

the value of homes is a portion of the issue (a whole nother conversation i have against the democrats as well) but it is only one variable in the whole picture.

this is also only taking into acount for INCOME TAX, and not counting other tax increases proposed by the obama plans.
October 24th, 2008 at 12:22 pm

weezy f says:

you guys write to fuckin much…obama all the way!!
October 24th, 2008 at 12:22 pm

rangerjohn says:

also control, you say you agree the govt needs to cut spending, yet obama has proposed to INCREASE spending, amounting to 1.4 trillion in additional spending before the end of his 1st term. how does he propose to pay for that spending? by taxing me and you and gilbert? doesnt add up. i think GHW bush said it best, VOODOO economics?
October 24th, 2008 at 12:23 pm

Kudabeen says:

I can’t miss a point that isn’t clarified. I shouldn’t have to tie logic to your argument, But I do understand you and better realaize how you see things through your lenses.

Obama’s plans IS to cut programs that are not “value-added” and filter those dollars into more effient and effective social programs.

I haven’t secured a position in Obama’s cabinet and I would never be apart of McCains, so I’m not going to go back in forth about things these candidates SAY they are going to do. Obama is a thinker and is smart enough to have the appropriate people advised him…McCain is a good man and a hero, but he is not a decision maker.

Sense you are familiar with business and are looking at this from that perspective (Today). Would you hire McCain to run your business? Really?

He doesn’t have the education or proven ability think his way through…I don’t care how much strength he exhibited in enduring torture after crashing his plane 40 years ago…It doesn’t make him Executive material…
October 24th, 2008 at 12:27 pm

Illmatic says:

I just want to pose a question to rangerjohn:

You say that right now is not the time for socialist programs. Right now is the worst economic crisis since the Great Depression.

Wasn’t it (excluding WWII) due to FDR’s “socialist” programs that eventually pulled us OUT of the Great Depression?
October 24th, 2008 at 12:29 pm

control says:

ranger

I never said I liked Obama, like someone posted earlier voting for either of the two is like asking which part of the body you want to be shot in. The reason he is the best candidate (not including independents, those are unrealistic) is because he probably won’t get ANYTHING done in his term. With how bad shit is fucked up, I don’t really believe there is anyone who would be able to clean up this mess…but I sure know McCain would make it worse. After this current administration, doing nothing would be a breath of fresh air.

Like you mentioned earlier, make spending more EFFICIENT and most of the problems are resolved. With government involved though, that isn’t going to happen.

One thing misquoted by you on his spending plan: you aren’t taking into account the money he is reducing. I think the official increase in spending was something like 400billion, not 1.4trillion.

You are also not taking into account that the current administration has expanded government to historic levels…republicans are suppose to be for SMALLER government, not bigger. McCain definately will follow the same agenda.
October 24th, 2008 at 12:32 pm

Kudabeen says:

Also Ranger:

Just because you have shared so much…

Have your business benefited from a boost under Bush economic policies? What about McCain’s policy helps you? Do you pay your employee’s healthcare?

I don’t want to know more about your business, because it’s a bball blog and it’s YOUR business, but Gil feels that no matter what he will not be better off financially and that’s his issue. If someone takes more taxes and improve the country’s standing globally isn’t it worth it? Does McCain/Palin really represent who you are and the America you protect?

Under-educated, fanatical, unenlightened self-servers…$150k to look sexy is a political move…They are using high school presidential tactics to run for President of the United States…We don’t deserve that…You and Me both…We deserve better. McCain and especially Palin, just isn’t it…
October 24th, 2008 at 12:33 pm

rangerjohn says:

kudabeen,
honestly i would not higher either to run my business. they both have shown poor judgement, IMO mccains has not been as bad. look at the people obama has by his side, he is surrounded by people who caused freddy and fannie to fail, his rev wright link, his william ayres link, his links to accorn (imo the worst of them all is accorn who admited 30% of their “new voters” where fraudulent)

obama has not shown and strenght, no decisionmaking abilities, all he has is a silver tounge, hell apparently monica has a silver tounge too but i would not let her suck me off. what did obama do with the russia georgia situation? he said lets wait and see, then said georgia should show restraint, GEORGIA WAS THE ONE WHO GOT ATTACKED!, obama voted 4 times to prosecute a man in chicago who shot an intruder in his own house who was armed, and wearing a mask.

obama has voted 6 times in support of partial birth abortions (thats when a baby HAS A CHANCE TO LIVE but they give it drugs to kill it anyway)

i could go on and on. mccain is not the greatest chance we have but he gives us a better chance then obama imo
October 24th, 2008 at 12:41 pm

Austin Burton says:

Tyson Chandler recently said that he’s not concerned with his taxes being raised. He’s worried about his family and friends who aren’t rich, about their taxes being raised. I figured most NBA players would think like that.
October 24th, 2008 at 12:41 pm

Rob says:

@ YOUNGFED

That’s why I’ve always questioned what you do or how you pose as an adult you mini me can’t reach over the counter fruit loop.

I still think you are a poser and punk. Maybe its cuz you and Tyrone share the same bunk bed like in Step Brothers

bruh !
October 24th, 2008 at 12:42 pm

rangerjohn says:

llmatic, socialistic govt has failed in EVERY COUNTRY in history, what makes you think it will work this time? every country that has ever tried socialism has fail horribly.

kudabeen,
i do cover my employees health care (50/50) and both have offered to help me with that. until this year my business has been booming, under bush, my business (and my fathers for whom i worked for 10yrs before opening my own) has been booming. the demecratic congress has ruined this economy, this is why the demecrats have a 18% approval rating (bush is around 30%). now people want to make change, congress is who needs to be changed. you want to put a dem in office and in congress is a BAD idea. the govt historically has worked best when they are mixed. (ie the clinton years) the current situation is not a bush issue anymore then it is a congress issue and it has not been like this until the dems gained power. pelosi should be shot imo.

control, the 400b you speak of IS PER YEAR and is a low side figure. 4 yrs at 400b is 1.2 trillion.
October 24th, 2008 at 12:46 pm

rangerjohn says:

austin,

the thing is, under both candidates, those family members would not be taxed more, they would get a break, BUT under obama, the bush tax cuts would end which inturn would increase those family members taxes by 3%. mccain wants to cut EVERYBODIES taxes.

obama says 95% of america will get a tax break, but 40% dont pay taxes, how do you reduce 0? the govt will be cutting checks to people who dont pay taxes, doesnt it already do that?

so tyson wants to pay more in taxes (its patriotic remember) but he wants the taxes to go down for his family, he should vote republican and have his and his families go down.
October 24th, 2008 at 12:50 pm

rangerjohn says:

here is a breakdown of how the tax plans effect YOU on income tax

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/story/2008/06/09/ST2008060900950.html
October 24th, 2008 at 12:55 pm

Lauri says:

Sadly big paycheck and intelligence aren’t the same
October 24th, 2008 at 12:57 pm

Illmatic says:

You’re telling me that all these countries in Western Europe, who have higher per capita incomes, better healthcare systems, and pretty much better standards of living (for everyone), are failures?

I never said that we need to turn completely socialist, but I think you may be confusing “socialist” and “communist”.

If that’s the case then I agree, no truly COMMUNIST country has ever really succeeded.
October 24th, 2008 at 12:59 pm

Kudabeen says:

You are using Ayers, Wright and ACORN to judge Obama, but McCains association with the Keating five, his part in the Walter Reed situation, his infidelity, his wife’s addictions, Palins’ fanatics and her husband’s separatist group, her abuse of power and abuse of tax money to fly her family all over on “official business”…All that is cool…I’m done. Rev Wright, Ayers, and ACORN…That’s it? Really?

I tip my cap to you and all those who blindly accept the spin. Ignorance is bliss, so I can’t knock your pursuit of happiness…It is America right…?
October 24th, 2008 at 1:00 pm

fallinup says:

What I see rangerjohn (from that Wapo link), is John McCain dropping taxes across the board. With two wars, and economy thats in the shitter, job loss at an all time high, and wages decreasing…how is he gonna pay for these tax cuts??? Should we be thanking China for the loan now?

What I see with Obama is him dropping that tax cut that McCain once called irresponsible…to pay for the tax cuts for the lower incomes…along with ending this war in Iraq so there’s another 10 billion a month.

Correct me if I’m wrong because I’m not a tax expert…but McCain’s plan seems more irresponsible considering it’s almost exactly the same as Bush’s plan and that hasn’t really done America too swell in the past 8 years.
October 24th, 2008 at 1:03 pm

The Advisor says:

Gil–you’re setting the WRONG example for kids. This is not a responsible stance to take as a public figure. Voting is a civic duty–its not about being enjoyable or pleasant–its a duty as a citizen of the United States. Maybe you’re not familiar with the political issues involved in this election, but, at the very least, you, as a young black man, ought to recognize and appreciate the historic importance of possibly having the first African-American president of the United States. Not that it should be the only reason you would support the man, but surely you can see the importance of picking the right person to lead our nation in such a critical time in our history. Your attitude–or your apathy–is quite disturbing for a man of your stature in the Washington, D.C. community. Why don’t you give this more thought.
October 24th, 2008 at 1:12 pm

Kudabeen says:

Austin:

The operative part of what you said is “think like that”

I did see that Tyson Chandler interview. I thought he was on point. What Gilbert says isn’t so different…He says no matter what he is going to take a financial hit, so vote for what? If people really wanted his vote, they would get his attention, but obviously McCains and Obama’s rhetoric hasn’t caught his attention…

@Lauri:

Intelligence has nothing to do with voting. If that’s what you are saying. It is a matter of what is your stake…

Did you previously think that rich people were rich because they are smarter? i hope you think that is a silly question to pose. I feel like McCain in the camp that thinks to be wealthy places you above others in importance socially… If a man that only makes 40k is taxed 40%, why in the hell should someone making 40 million only be taxed 36%? that is crazy…
October 24th, 2008 at 1:13 pm

Vinny says:

@Rob
If you think rangerjohn is always correct than your an Idiot! He might as well be fox news regurgitating republican talking points!
@ rj. why is you ‘conservative’s’ are so mis-informed- you can read right?
October 24th, 2008 at 1:14 pm

rangerjohn says:

Illmatic

and which of these countries ARE actually socialist? 85% of the economies in the world are actually capitolistic. who exactly is socialist?

hmmm kudabeen, keading 5? you mean the political scandle inwhich mccain was completely cleared? infront of a senate ethics commitee?

all of congress is a part of walter reed (i was in walter reed at one time and it was not so bad but then it was damn 20 yrs ago almost) his wifes addiction? how about obamas admited drug abuse? (we can go there right?) palins fanatics? how about wright? (nuf said there since its all over youtube) abuse of power? hasnt been proven to this point but who knows. flying her family around? hmm i seam to remember her selling the expensive govt plane. and by the way, isnt obama flying his family around too? i would find it more desterbing is she DIDNT take her kids with her. all that money the dems say she had spent on cloths? hmm have you seen the room service bill from mrs obama? 400 on lobter, cheap champagne and iranian caviar (i thought we didnt want to send iran any money?)

we can both go back and forth on this stuff but it would waste both our times.

fallinup, why would you want to tax the people who make the jobs?
and obama is going to give a tax break on income tax, but then take it away (which all of the obama suporters are agreeing to) when he drops the bush tax cuts, so isnt that the same thing as leaving things the way they are now? let me do the math here, if you have $100, and i give you 50 to post on this board, you have $150, then i say ok now i am going to charge you $50 to be on this board, that puts you abck at $100.

in the end, when you tax the rich, what do they want to do? leave and go some place where they are not going to be taxed.
October 24th, 2008 at 1:14 pm

Kudabeen says:

@ Advisor, you should post that in Capital letters in Gilbert’s blog or his website where he can see it…
October 24th, 2008 at 1:15 pm

Mark says:

If you’re influenced by celebrities or athletes into voting (or lack thereof), then you’re heavily misplacing your priorities.

And don’t say that crap about ‘But Gil! You’re setting a bad example for the kids!’ You can’t vote if you’re not an adult, and by that age you should’ve already grown a pair and taken up some responsiblities, civil responsibilities notwithstanding.

Good for Gil to not care. Last time I checked, he was a basketball player.
October 24th, 2008 at 1:15 pm

rangerjohn says:

here let me make this a little easier

Bar Stool Economics

Suppose that every day, ten men go out for beer and the bill for all ten
comes to $100. If they paid their bill the way we pay our taxes, it would
go something like this:

The first four men (the poorest) would pay nothing.
The fifth would pay $1.
The sixth would pay $3.
The seventh would pay $7.
The eighth would pay $12.
The ninth would pay $18.
The tenth man (the richest) would pay $59.

So, that’s what they decided to do. The ten men drank in the bar every day
and seemed quite happy with the arrangement, until one day, the owner threw
them a curve. ‘Since you are all such good customers, he said, ‘I’m going
to reduce the cost of your daily beer by $20. Drinks for the ten now cost
just $80.

The group still wanted to pay their bill the way we pay our taxes so the
first four men were unaffected. They would still drink for free. But what
about the other six men – the paying customers? How could they divide the
$20 windfall so that everyone would get his ‘fair share?’ They realized
that $20 divided by six is $3.33. But if they subtracted that from
everybody’s share, then the fifth man and the sixth man would each end up
being paid to drink his beer. So, the bar owner suggested that it would be
fair to reduce each man’s bill by roughly the same amount, and he proceeded
to work out the amounts each should pay.

And so:

The fifth man, like the first four, now paid nothing (100% savings).
The sixth now paid $2 instead of $3 (33%savings).
The seventh now paid $5 instead of $7 (28%savings).
The eighth now paid $9 instead of $12 (25% savings).
The ninth now paid $14 instead of $18 (22% savings).
The tenth now paid $49 instead of $59 (16% savings).

Each of the six was better off than before. And the first four continued to
drink for free. But once outside the restaurant, the men began to compare
their savings.

‘I only got a dollar out of the $20′, declared the sixth man. He pointed to
the tenth man,’ but he got $10!’
‘Yeah, that’s right’, exclaimed the fifth man. ‘I only saved a dollar, too.

It’s unfair that he got ten times more than I!’

‘That’s true!!’ shouted the seventh man. ‘Why should he get $10 back when
I got only two?
The wealthy get all the breaks!’

‘Wait a minute,’ yelled the first four men in unison.
‘We didn’t get anything at all. The system exploits the poor!’

The nine men surrounded the tenth and beat him up.

The next night the tenth man didn’t show up for drinks, so the nine sat
down and had beers without him. But when it came time to pay the bill, they
discovered something important. They didn’t have enough money between all
of them for even half of the bill!

And that, boys and girls, journalists and college professors, is how our
tax system works. The people who pay the highest taxes get the most benefit
from a tax reduction. Tax them too much, attack them for being wealthy, and
they just may not show up anymore. In fact, they might start drinking
overseas where the atmosphere is somewhat friendlier.
October 24th, 2008 at 1:17 pm

Kudabeen says:

Right Ranger!

If you are going to associate Obama with indiviuals and organizations that he has no stake in why can’t I associate McCain with a scandal that he was involved in. Cleared or not in your Republican mind it makes him guilty by association right?

If McCain was a democrat you would be throwing Keating 5 around instead of the Rev Wright Ayers nonsense
October 24th, 2008 at 1:25 pm

rangerjohn says:

kudabeen, the difference, keating 5 didnt blow buildings up, all tehy did was try to make some money the wrong way. the keating five doesnt and never have spewed things like “the bible says the united states is the devil”. the keating five had remourse afterwords (maybe from getting caught who knows) but they have remourse none the less. ayers has REPEATEDLY said things to the tune of “i am proud of what i did”, and rev wright has spent more time then ever spewing his anti white, anti american filth.

how about acorn? how about all those false signups? how about acorn trying to swing the election. 1.3 million new voters (some 90% dem) and 30% are faulty? have some problem, not real, or dead even? thats 390,000 faulty registrations, DAMN THATS A LOT. how about some counties having more registered voters then people living in the counties, all by acorn? how come the dems dont bring up anything of that nature? because it is in their favor.
October 24th, 2008 at 1:25 pm

rangerjohn says:

well time to get to a jobsite so i can collect some money to pay those taxes! i will be back though
October 24th, 2008 at 1:39 pm

Kudabeen says:

“All they did was try to make some money the wrong way”

Word?

I guess to you America is God and Republicans are angels who can do no wrong…I’m done. You are one of them…I can’t trade wits with fanatic…you believe despite the truth…Psychosis is the condition of you believers in a Bush/McCain kind of America. Obama is a corny dude to me. I think he is intelligent and I think his moral compass will point us in the right direction…McCain only cares to speak to ‘certain’ types of Americans…This says a lot, but only to those conscious and sensitive to issues of injustice in this counrty…

Live your life homie…Have a great day making money…I hope it really does get you to where you want to be in life and the after-life…
October 24th, 2008 at 1:41 pm

Aron says:

I love this!
October 24th, 2008 at 1:45 pm

Drink the Haterade (KB24 Chip 09) says:

I think this depression we are seeing started way back with Reagan and D regulation of bank loans. Also the war in Iraq didn’t start with out current president Bush it started in 88.

Also here is an example of how Obama’s plan works for those who make over 250K

Now this is a good way to look at reality from our perspective:

Here is a creative approach to redistribution of wealth as offered by a
reader of the Eagle Tribune newspaper.

Today on my way to lunch I passed a homeless guy with a sign that read “Vote Obama, I need the money.” I laughed.

Once in the restaurant my server had on a “Obama 08″ tie, again I laughed — just imagine the coincidence.

When the bill came I decided not to tip the server and explained to him that I was exploring the Obama redistribution of wealth concept. He stood there in disbelief while I told him that I was going to redistribute his tip to someone whom I deemed more in need — the homeless guy outside. The server angrily stormed from my sight.

I went outside, gave the homeless guy $10 and told him to thank the server inside as I decided he could use the money m ore. The homeless guy was grateful.

At the end of my rather unscientific redistribution experiment, I realized the homeless guy was grateful for the money he did not earn, but the waiter was pretty angry that I gave away the money he did earn, even though the actual recipient deserved money more.

I guess redistribution of wealth is an easier thing to swallow in concept
than in practical application. Or is it – REDISTRIBUTION OF SOMEONE ELSE’S WEALTH IS A GREAT IDEA – or just a fools political game!
October 24th, 2008 at 1:48 pm

Drink the Haterade (KB24 Chip 09) says:

So back to my question from yesterday, does anyone know of some good places to ball in Huntsville AL
October 24th, 2008 at 1:48 pm

fallinup says:

C’mon rangerjohn…I thought we were having a pretty damn good discussion until you went the Ayers, Wright, Acorn route…all of those claims are straight unimportant, futile and exhausted. No one cares and no one believes the right wing spin other than the right wingers….11 days away and this is all you guys got???? really???

From factcheck…..

Destroying Democracy?

The McCain ad accuses ACORN of “massive voter fraud.” In the final presidential debate, John McCain added that ACORN “is now on the verge of maybe perpetrating one of the greatest frauds in voter history in this country, maybe destroying the fabric of democracy.” Sounds scary, but is it true?

There’s no evidence of any such democracy-destroying fraud. Here’s what is true: In recent years, ACORN employees have been investigated multiple times for voter registration fraud. ACORN workers have been convicted of submitting false voter registration forms in Colorado Springs in 2005, Kansas City, Mo., in 2006 and King County, Wash., in 2007. ACORN’s Las Vegas office was raided by a state criminal investigator on Oct. 7, 2008. ACORN workers are also the subjects of ongoing investigations in Wisconsin, Missouri, Ohio, Pennsylvania and Indiana. The Indiana investigation started in early October and may involve thousands of fraudulent registration forms.

On Oct. 16 The Associated Press quoted two “senior law enforcement” officials as saying that the FBI is investigating ACORN seeking “any evidence of a coordinated national scam.” The following day the Obama campaign’s lawyer, Robert Bauer, sent a seven-page letter to the attorney general claiming that federal law enforcement officials were being improperly used to help McCain by suppressing the vote through “unsupported, spurious allegations of vote fraud.” He asked that the investigation be transferred to the special prosecutor investigating the U.S. attorney firing scandal. The McCain campaign issued a statement in which spokesman Ben Porritt called Bauer’s letter “outrageous” and “absurd” and a “heavy handed tactic of attempting to criminalize political discourse.”

But ACORN itself has not been officially charged with any fraud. Aside from the heated charges and counter-charges, no evidence has yet surfaced to show that the ACORN employees who submitted fraudulent registration forms intended to pave the way for illegal voting. Rather, they were trying to get paid by ACORN for doing no work. Dan Satterberg, the Republican prosecuting attorney in King County, Wash., where the largest ACORN case to date was prosecuted, said that the indicted ACORN employees were shirking responsibility, not plotting election fraud.

Satterberg: [A] joint federal and state investigation has determined that this scheme was not intended to permit illegal voting.

Instead, the defendants cheated their employer, the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now (or ACORN), to get paid for work they did not actually perform. ACORN’s lax oversight of their own voter registration drive permitted this to happen. … It was hardly a sophisticated plan: The defendants simply realized that making up names was easier than actually canvassing the streets looking for unregistered voters. …

[It] appears that the employees of ACORN were not performing the work that they were being paid for, and to some extent, ACORN is a victim of employee theft.

The $8-an-hour employees were charged with providing false information on voter registration forms, and in one case with making a false statement to a public official. Five of the seven who were charged pleaded guilty. ACORN was fined for exercising insufficient oversight, but it was not charged with masterminding any kind of deliberate fraud.

ACORN pays canvassers by the hour, not by the form, but it does ask them to meet certain registration goals. In ACORN’s Las Vegas office, one employee who admitted to submitting fraudulent registrations said that she did so because she found ACORN’s requirement of 20 registrations per day to be too steep to meet, according to an affidavit by a Nevada state criminal investigator. Local news reports at the time also said that some of the ACORN offices under investigation paid bonuses for each registration, or a higher hourly rate to those who brought in more applications. ACORN’s deputy political director, Kevin Whelan, denies that this is ACORN policy.
October 24th, 2008 at 1:55 pm

control says:

Hateraid

I guess you would feel more comfortable if everyone just mailed their tips to Wall Street instead? I would rather give my money to a homeless guy than to a wall street executive.
October 24th, 2008 at 2:09 pm

Andrew says:

My first thought is that Abraham Lincoln was a good President. Abraham Lincoln had roughly the same experience and qualifications as Sen Obama.

Second, I’m a registered republican. But I can’t vote for John McCain. He’s a terrible candidate running a flawed campaign. His judgement is terrible and his positions are fluid, vague and hard to endorse.

Third, in terms of who John McCain is, well, he’s a guy who was involved in the Keating Five; is an unapologetically close friend of Gordon Liddy, a convicted criminal; and he absolutely does not reflect the needs of the “common American”. He’s flip-flopped constantly on positions, and will say or do ANYTHING to be elected. This is not the kind of guy you’d hire for a job.

He is an elitist who lucked into his military post because of genealogy, graduating at the bottom of his class; he held up under duress in a prison 40 years ago, but bravery in youth in no way qualifies for leadership in dotage; when it’s convenient, he stands up for troops and their families, and I say that because I’ve watched countless performances, such as those in this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-CazKanlYDg? He just berates Vietnam veterans’ families and doesn’t listen. That’s his strategy — berate and don’t listen. No, thanks. I mean, really — THIS is a man who served in our military??

But that’s the point — he never held a job outside of government; he married into incredible wealth and owns eleven houses and thirteen cars; he’s a rich guy who has voted 90% of the time for tax breaks for other rich guys — how could he possibly know what I go through every day or what these people are going through with concerns rooted in REALITY?

If his policies and bridge-building skills are so good, why did McCain — who wrapped up the republican nomination far earlier than Obama — need months to describe a tax plan? Let me remind you, his chief economist called the American middle-class “whiners”. SURE, he saw the recession coming…. NO CHANCE! And when he flew to Washington to deliver the bailout, he FAILED to deliver REPUBLICAN voters. The Democrats fell shy of their “target” votes by 2 votes; the republicans fell shy of their “target” votes by 40%! This is a guy who can’t motivate REPUBLICANS to act in a time of crisis. This is not a consensus-builder, and he has no expertise over the economic conditions we face. He was a deregulator when Americans needed guidance. He’s not a maverick on any issue that matters to common people.

Further, McCain is a 72-yr old with skin cancer and health problems and a 1-in-6 chance of not making it through his first term. He selected Sarah Palin, who’s been a governor for less than two years and is a horror show. You think Obama is going to change things? Wait ’till Sarah Barracuda gets Maverick-y on the USA. You’re talking about a lasting, damaging change — including her extremist positions on things like climate change, creationism, religion, free speech, civil rights and transparency. I mean, look at her experience, and her record, and her obfuscations in regards to all that’s come before.

But that’s the McCain side. On the Obama side, here’s a guy raised by a single mother in a working-class household; he worked his way through school; he had held “real” jobs at a community level; he lost his mother in part because of our healthcare system’s inability to provide care; his kids are wonderful; his wife is brilliant and active. Joe Biden is a single-dad who overcame tremendous hardship and has more experience than McCain in the Senate.

The Obama/Biden tax plan provides a tax break only to Americans making less than many of my friends, but I’m STILL voting for him because I believe the country needs:
Energy Policy that is NOT centered around “big oil” as solution
Job Creation — the only way to get this is to invest in people with new ideas, preferably in a green industry, since that is transforming the way the world does business.
A plan for the Middle East — not even Petraeus supports McCain’s plan for Afghanistan
Healthcare reform
Tax reform
Leadership with a COOL head
Someone who exhibits the ability to be tough but calm
Someone measured in their response to crisis
Someone with youth & vigor
Someone who gets the facts before they act
Someone who understands how to use a computer or communicate in the 20th Century. This sounds minor, but it’s a huge point — how can you create jobs in a “new” economy when you don’t understand how billions of dollars came to be vital to our economy in the past fifteen years?
Someone who is not out of touch with the common people, those who need to work to get by.
Someone with a message of personal responsibility — that we must be accountable for this mess as much as “wall street”.
McCain’s just preaching divisiveness, while Obama is pushing for people to stand up and be accountable for their decisions.

I would be wary about the lies / misinformation about Obama — he’s not a muslim, and if he was, that doesn’t mean he is a terrorist. That’s silly. Every buddhist isn’t fat and cheerful, so why would every Muslim be throwing bombs? And basis your belief in the American Dream that Obama represents, I don’t see how you could pick the rich kid who’s never had a job to “that guy.” Besides, McCain’s church affiliations are terrifying in their own right. Have you seen what some of these guys on the other side of the aisle like to spout off about? They’re downright dangerous, and unlike Obama with Rev Wright, McCain is NOT denouncing these endorsements, he is courting them! In terms of concrete examples, I would simply read the two platforms — on every point, I found Obama’s platform to be far less vague than McCain and he seems to have both a grasp and an actual plan for what’s coming. Don’t believe the hype — read the data. Perhaps you’ll find — as I did — that McCain is primarily reactive and speaks in generalities when confronted with specifics. Now, don’t get me wrong — the republicans have run a much tougher campaign and they’re populated by closers. They want the job and they can motivate an electorate. But that does not make a good candidate! I DO believe Obama is a better candidate RIGHT NOW.

To contrast the two:
Independent auditors have said Obama will net you 3x the tax relief that McCain’s plan will provide.
McCain’s plan will “save” you on healthcare in the first three / four years, but then — after deregulation — good luck. It’s open-season and a real hellhole for all concerned. Obama’s plan will streamline the whole process.
If you’re pro-life, I think you lose with both candidates. But you win with Sarah Palin.
If you’re for free-speech, you win with both candidates. But you lose with Sarah Palin, who has a 1-in-6 shot at succession.
I don’t think McCain being a senator for 26 years is any more of a qualification than Obama. I mean, what did you know about McCain prior to the 2000s? Just the Keating scandal and a failed Campaign-Finance reform bill, or were you — like me — angry that he’s the guy who closed the Hanoi Hilton without bringing home the soldiers’ remains?
McCain called to nationalize the banks; he wants the government to own the mortgages that were written by the banks; and he believes that big government is the way out of this mess, after calling for deregulation for years — that’s a turn to real socialism. Or is he protecting the interests of his rich friends, those who kept him in office for decades? Meanwhile, when I listen to Obama, he’s telling folks they have to take responsibility and that it’ll be hard work to pull out of this mess. That’s realistic.
Obama wants to provide programs for young people — similar to the Peace Corps and JFK. What / where in McCain’s platform does he say ANYTHING about young people?
McCain talks about education reform, and then calls for a spending freeze. Which is it? At least Obama has owned up to the fact that things cost money.
The party of “Pay as you go” v. the party of deficit spending. Americans pay their bills. ’nuff said, and Obama wins there, too.
Energy policy — McCain hasn’t enunciated a clear energy policy beyond, “drill baby, drill” and nuclear plants. Good luck building more refineries or nuclear plants in either candidate’s first four years. And anything you drill is YEARS away from reaching the market as refined product. Therefore, Obama has a plan that reflects reality. Beyond this, his plan will stimulate the economy by investing in new technologies. I can’t vote for a candidate who wants to do less for our future and thinks our present situation is sustainable.
October 24th, 2008 at 2:10 pm

Drink the Haterade (KB24 Chip 09) says:

The Ant & the Grasshopper

> Two Different Versions!
> Two Different Morals!
>
> OLD VERSION:
>
> The ant works hard in the withering heat all summer long,
> building his house and laying up supplies for the winter.
>
> The grasshopper thinks the ant is a fool and laughs and
> dances and plays the summer away. Come winter, the ant is
> warm and well fed.The grasshopper has no food or shelter,
> so he dies out in the cold.
>
> MORAL OF THE STORY:
> Be responsible for yourself!
>
> —————
>
> MODERN VERSION: The Ant and the Grasshopper in 2008
>
> The ant works hard in the withering heat all summer long,
> build ing his house and laying up supplies for the winter.
>
> The grasshopper thinks the ant is a fool and laughs and
> dances and plays the summer away.
>
> Come winter, the shivering grasshopper calls a press
> conference and demands to know why the ant should be
> allowed to be warm and well fed while others are cold and
> starving.
>
> CBS, NBC, PBS, CNN, and ABC show up to provide pictures of
> the shivering grasshopper next to a video of the ant in his comfortable
> home with a table filled with food. America is stunned by the sharp
> contrast.
>
> How can this be, that in a country of such wealth, this
> poor grasshopper is allowed to suffer so?
>
> Kermit the Frog appears on Oprah with the grasshopper, and
> everybody cries when they sing, ‘It’s Not Easy Being
> Green.’
>
> Jesse Jackson stages a demonstration in front of the
> ant’s house where the news stations film the group
> singing, ‘We shall overcome.’ Jesse then has the
> group kneel down to pray to God for the grasshopper’s
> sake.
>
> Nancy Pel osi & John Kerry exclaim in an interview with
> Larry King that the ant has gotten rich off the back of the grasshopper,
> and both call for an immediate tax hike on the ant to make him pay his
fair
> share.
>
> Hillary and Barack go on national television agreeing that
> the plight of the grasshopper is the fault of George Bush.
>
> Finally, the EEOC drafts the Economic Equity &
> Anti-Grasshopper Act retroactive to the beginning of the
> summer.
>
> The ant is fined for failing to hire a proportionate number of green
> bugs and, having nothing left to pay his
> retroactive taxes, his home is confiscated by the
> government.
>
> Obama gets his old law firm to represent the grasshopper in a defamation
> suit against the ant, and the case is tried before a panel of federal
> judges that Bill Clinton
> appointed from a list of single-parent welfare recipients.
>
> The ant loses the case.
>
> The story ends as we see the grasshopper finishing up the
> last bits of the ant’s food while the government house
> he is in, which just happens to be the ant’s old house,
> crumbles around him because he doesn’t maintain it.
>
> The ant has disappeared in the snow.
>
> The grasshopper is found dead in a drug related incident
> and the house, now abandoned, is taken over by a gang of
> spiders who terrorize the once peaceful neighborhood.
>
> MORAL OF THE STORY:
> Be very careful how you vote in 2008
October 24th, 2008 at 2:12 pm

Drink the Haterade (KB24 Chip 09) says:

why doesn’t it surprise that the Acorn office in Vegas was raided. We are more corrupt than people want to believe.
October 24th, 2008 at 2:15 pm

fallinup says:

There’s no more discussion needed. This race is over, sadly. The campaign worker that was “attacked by a black guy that noticed her McCain sticker on her car and beat her up, then carved a B on her cheek saying “you now follow Barack”. Admitted that she friggin lied.

This is sad for America that someone would stoop so low and race bait. It’s sad for the McCain campaign because they will no doubt take heat for something they had nothing to do with.

http://kdka.com/local/attack.McCain.Bloomfield.2.847628.html
October 24th, 2008 at 2:21 pm

Drink the Haterade (KB24 Chip 09) says:

I gotta say that I think we are gonna be screwed either way… It’s just a matter of who’s going to screw us more? Obama scares me and I think Pailin was a bad choice. So which is the lesser of two evils?
October 24th, 2008 at 2:22 pm

Drink the Haterade (KB24 Chip 09) says:

@ Fallin up good lookin out
October 24th, 2008 at 2:24 pm

fallinup says:

I’m an Obama supporter through and through…but I wanna smack that bitch that made that shit up. You know exactly why she made that shit up…and now its all gonna back fire on the ones she wanted to help at all costs.
October 24th, 2008 at 2:31 pm

Illmatic says:

@rangerjohn

you’re right I should clarify my statement. I didn’t mean socialist governments per se. I meant countries like Norway, Switzerland, Denmark, Iceland, etc., that take the best parts from Capitalist and Socialist government models.

Maybe the common denominator there is the fact that these countries spend more time and resources bettering the lives of THEIR citizens, instead of the lives of citizens from a country thousands of miles away (the true motives, however, are debatable).

Billions of dollars a month that could be used to improve healthcare, education, infrastructure, etc., are instead being spent on shipping young men and women with bright futures to die in a shithole like Iraq just so people like Bush and Cheney can line their pockets just a little bit more. Or so your boy McCain can own 8 or 9 houses, while your average citizen struggles to KEEP the 1 house that they own.
October 24th, 2008 at 2:33 pm

fallinup says:

Don’t forget illmatic…some of that money we are sending over to Iraq and Afghanistan is for, get this….

Dun dun duh….

Universal Healthcare
October 24th, 2008 at 2:38 pm

Illmatic says:

Oh and that plane that she “sold” on ebay? What a crock of shit.

Read this:

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/the-trail/2008/09/05/plane_not_sold_on_ebay.html
October 24th, 2008 at 2:38 pm

jeremy says:

a lot of people are turned off by politics. gil still gives thousands and thousands of dollars to the needy every year.
October 24th, 2008 at 2:42 pm

Drink the Haterade (KB24 Chip 09) says:

I’m a vet and I gotta say that when America spends more money on “helping other countries” It really gets to me, why are we fighting for someone else, OK so I realize we need to help other who can’t fight for themselves, but how about the politicians all of them taking care of America first and foremost.

Also, for those that don’t know it takes the congress and the president to approve going to war and all the other things that have gone wrong in this country.

It’s not like it was before where we could just go in and blow MFR’s up like we used to.

We better get our crap together soon because with the way the economy is and the way we don’t flex our muscles anymore, we are gonna eventually be in big trouble. China has the most people and over 3 million in their army alone, Kinda scary.
October 24th, 2008 at 3:03 pm

fallinup says:

newsflash:

USA has been in a shit burger for quite sometime now. If you are just seeing it now…you probably voted Bush in 04.
October 24th, 2008 at 3:34 pm

Drink the Haterade (KB24 Chip 09) says:

Actually I saw it along time ago
October 24th, 2008 at 3:47 pm

rangerjohn says:

im back (for now)

http://abcnews.go.com/TheLaw/Vote2008/story?id=6025106&page=1

now there are to many posts sincei had to go to respond to everything or even read every line.

i only bring up men like ayers and wright because some of you say obama has “good moral judgment”. so befriending thee men is “good moral judgement?” obama says “i hardly know ayers? yet ayers held a political party FOR OBAMA at his personal house? that is someone you “hardly know?” i call bullshit on that. “i have never heard sermens like those from rev wright” i call bullshit, you dont go to a church for 20+ yrs and never hear the sermin. hell maybe you do i dont know.

there is a huge difference between shady business deals and bombing public buildings, huge difference between shady business deals and screaming at the top of your lungs how god hates america and how the white man is the devil and so on.

kudabeen, while you think i am “drinking the koolaid” of the gop, you my friend have drank the same koolaid from the dnc. it goes both ways, none of us are changing anyone minds, it has been a good debate, good points brought up but in the end, i know i am right, you know you are right, and in the end hell maybe we are both wrong. only time will tell.

that being said, VOTE REPUBLICAN! what was it the dems say, vote early and vote OFTEN (damn bunch of frauds LMAO)
October 24th, 2008 at 4:11 pm

Rob says:

I vote Republican b/c I stand for John McCain
October 24th, 2008 at 4:11 pm

Rob says:

Those who I KNOW are gonna say something…

Those who vote for Obama can stand on these
October 24th, 2008 at 4:26 pm

Illmatic says:

@rangerjohn

“it goes both ways, none of us are changing anyone minds, it has been a good debate, good points brought up but in the end, i know i am right, you know you are right, and in the end hell maybe we are both wrong. only time will tell.”

You are absolutely correct. Haha looks like there’s at least something we CAN agree on. Well.. that and our love for the game of basketball.
October 24th, 2008 at 4:32 pm

GEE...I got a bounty on George Karl. says:

Wait ’till Sarah Barracuda gets Maverick-y on the USA. You’re talking about a lasting, damaging change

Hilarious!

Obama for yo mama!
October 24th, 2008 at 4:56 pm

fallinup says:

NBA is back in a few days…and in 11 days, we’ll have a new president elect. So things will be back to the norm here….aaaaahhhhhhhh….

I miss the days when we could make fun of rangerjohn and his undying love of the Spurs…not the RNC. LOL

Either way…have a good weekend fellas!

http://buzzcuts.uproxx.com/comedy/4645

I’m voting Terry Tate!!!!
October 24th, 2008 at 6:26 pm

rangerjohn says:

fallinup!!!!!!!

the spurs are the shiiiiittttt!!!!!!! get on the good side, vote mccain and go spurs go!!!!!!!!!
October 24th, 2008 at 6:28 pm

BKS says:

Yea McCain is gonna die soon cause he’s old.
Never mind the hundreds of pages of medical history he released, while The Messiah released one page that contained little information.
I wouldn’t feel too good about a 47 year old chain smoker making it through the next 4 years.
And those silly ass speeches he is so good at giving won’t be sounding as good when he has to use a mechanical voicebox.
October 24th, 2008 at 9:10 pm

Andy says:

Politics is just who is the better used car salesman
It’s all about photo ops, Public relations, and marketing.
I loose all respect for a candidate when they appear on WWE and use wrestling puns to sell their line.
October 24th, 2008 at 11:30 pm

Russ says:

..actually there is debate among economists whether FDR’s policies actually prolonged the Great Depression. but anyways.

…second, despite what everyone might gather from every newspaper you read and every tv you watch..there are actually other people running for president besides the 2 main clowns everyone talks about. don’t be too lazy to educate yourself.

…one way or the other…both of them WILL raise SOME taxes.

…it is a free country, so gil is more than welcome to exercise his right not to vote. he does have some valid comments. they will all say what they want us to hear to get elected. and really, it’s just one person, don’t expect much. still has the congress and the house to deal with(all currupotion included asa bonus gift). all the whole ‘disrespect to ancestors’ is a bit high and mighty. i think the state of the country at present our ancestors may feel more disrespected by than someone seeing it for what it is and acting on how he feels about it, regardless of what backlash they recieve.
October 25th, 2008 at 4:29 pm

MOVEZ says:

Empirical evidence suggests that an electorally significant constituency votes for reasons relating to “moral values,” or the moral character of the candidates independent of their job performance. Political liberals, following Rawls, reject this basis for voting as falling short of the citizen’s duty of civility because it lacks a justification in terms of public reasons. I reject this assessment, arguing that if private reasons matter more to citizens, they should vote for those reasons. This is a criticism of one application of Rawlsian public reason, but it is not a criticism of the underlying theory. From within the principles that generate a demand for public reason, we can find an explanation for why public reasons are not always morally necessary in political activity. In a roundabout way, then, my position will be a defense of the normativity of publicity conditions on reasons offered by citizens in making collective decisions. Public reason, properly specified, will not demand that citizens give up what they care most about, although it will sometimes demand that they relinquish some of their political goals. In particular, citizens ought not vote for private reasons with the intention to effect a coercive legislative agenda. Where no coercion is intended, private reasons may also be civically laudable reasons. While not all private reasons for supporting a candidate are morally acceptable, character based reasons are. Character issues are morally implicated in the political process because political relationships—like that of voter to candidate—can also be moral relationships. They matter as relationships, and everyone thinks about (or should think about) the character of those to whom they stand in morally sensitive associations. The “moral values” voter deserves a moral defense from liberalism.
_-ALL ACADEMIC RESEARCH
October 25th, 2008 at 7:43 pm

eyeused2b says:

No, it is not wrong for him to publicly take that stance. He doesn’t have to vote b/c someone else wants him to vote. It is well within his rights to pass on voting, and it is also well within his rights to announce his stance publicly. So what if people don’t like his choice. If any of you are still living to make people that don’t know you happy, then good luck with your misery.
October 26th, 2008 at 6:09 am

Borgs says:

I would hate to think that somebody with the intellectual werewithal of Gilbert Arenas could determine who is going to run the most powerful country on the planet.
October 26th, 2008 at 7:15 pm

Soul Brova 1 says:

Professional athletics is the new slavery, physically and mentally.

Check out http://www.stepintodacipher.blogspot.com
November 6th, 2008 at 12:07 pm

Dro says:

Too bad Gil wasn’t born 50 yrs ago – then he wouldn’t have to worry about voting (unless he wanted to get lynched or have his house burned down)or being taxed on 14.5 mil. Then he might be one of the ones who died or fought for ungrateful people such as himself! What a shame; what a waste! How can someone go to college & still be so ignorant & uneducated? Hey Gil: ever heard of MLK?????????