Comments on: Highs and Lows: San Antonio Spurs

By: Ian

Ian — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 20:42:35 +0000

dagwaller good point
control u were hating fully when u said manu is a debatable top 15 sg now u say hes 6-10 and your last post suggests that u have him at 3 so keep it up man.

did u really mention numbers to break down players
did u know manu was the second best sg using per (25mns per game minimun so u dont bring up scrubs) like dag mentioned manu did everything vince did playing less minutes and again when u play on a bad team your numbers are better than what u really are.

i can take antoine walker one on one also but thats not really sayin much

By: dagwaller

dagwaller — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 19:18:09 +0000

control, if you’re going to quote me, that’s fine. I can see that you’re already buying into my point about Manu being the third best SG in the NBA.

By: control

control — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 18:43:43 +0000

dagwaller,

I hate trying to defend Vince, but put him beside TP and TD. Guy would be B-A-N-A-N-A-S. If Vince wasn’t the focus of every team’s defense, if he had a big player to play off of…that would be some brutal shit.

Also, like you have said, you are taking into account what HAPPENED, not what COULD have happened. Don’t be breaking your own guidelines now, otherwise Gilbert, for example, would have probably have knocked Manu off the All-NBA Third team.

By: dagwaller

dagwaller — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 18:33:20 +0000

control, in 7 less minutes a game, VC averaged less than 2 points more per game. Not impressive. Rebounds and assists, VC had 1.2 and .6 more, respectively. Again, in 7 less minutes a game. Is it unreasonable to think that if Manu played in 7 more minutes of a game, he could get one more FG, one more rebound, and one more assist? I think not. He also averaged the same amount of blocks and MORE steals.

Statistically speaking, I would give the edge to Manu – and that’s not even taking into account the huge win total disparity. Tim Duncan and TP blah blah blah Jason Kidd and Richard Jefferson blah blah blah.

By: control

control — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 18:26:23 +0000

dagwaller,

All a matter of perception. Breaking down stats, Vince averaged more points, boards, assists, less turnovers and was the focus of the other team’s defense almost the entire year. Funny thing is I kinda just want to knock him out of the top 5.

Guess we will have to see how Manu does when he gets back. At the end of the season there will hopefully be a “Did Manu live up to expectations” thread on Dime. If he improves, then he sure showed me. If he declines, I’m sure I will still be called a hater.

By: dagwaller

dagwaller — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 18:16:10 +0000

Ha, control, I hear you on that Antoine Walker thing.

I don’t know. I like to look at results. COULD Kwame Brown be an all-star? Probably. But he’s not, and he hasn’t been. COULD Dwyane Wade have been a top 5 SG last year? Probably. But he wasn’t. Neither was Vince Carter. Paul Pierce isn’t a shooting guard. So that puts the MVP and a former scoring champ ahead of Manu in the SG pecking order. Not bad.

This year? Looks like Manu’s gonna be injured for the first, what, fifth of the season? Not to mention he’s coming off of a long string of games dating back to whenever he joined the NBA. He’s probably due for a drop.

But currently, he’s the third best shooting guard in the NBA. I don’t like it, but how can you really argue with the All-NBA team and all the titles that he’s won? And when you put up the kind of stats that he does in the time that he does, it’s not really as surprising.

By: control

control — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 18:03:35 +0000

Ian,

Yeah, hatinonmanu is really the support I need. Last Manu hatefest there was, I believe there were like 4-5 people who were pilling on him.

Like I just posted, believe what you will. Thinking the guy is top 100 in the NBA is no way hating, he’s making more money than I am, and he’s playing at a higher level than I could ever dream…but then so are most of the 12th guys on the bench on any team in the NBA (though, I know I could beat Smush Parker or Antione Walker 1on1 on my worst day).

Looking at the SGs in the league, I could probably give Manu 6-10th, but no way top 5.

Kobe
Wade
Tmac
Pierce
Vince

Can you really dispute those 5? MAYBE Vince, but lazy or not, clutch or not, the guy can ball.

By: dagwaller

dagwaller — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 17:55:07 +0000

Hahaha, his “fan base” in the NBA front office supports him plenty.

By: dagwaller

dagwaller — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 17:53:52 +0000

control, “sorry”, “son”, but while you’re right that it doesn’t prove who’s in the top 20, it DOES show that the NBA as an organization (as in, the top level of basketball in the world) thinks that he’s better than all but 5 guards. I’m a huge Gilbert Arenas fan, but you know what? He wasn’t that good last year (when he played). I hate Vince Carter, and you know what? HE wasn’t as good as Manu last year. How many games did Elton Brand play last year? What did Melo do last year outside of scoring a bunch of points?

I can’t believe I’m defending the Spurs, but seriously, there’s some blind hatred going on here.

By: control

control — Fri, 10 Oct 2008 17:51:38 +0000

Thaisito,

I dislike Manu’s style of play. I am not denying that he has some skills, but I think his fan base over hypes the hell out of him. Root for who you will, I doubt you will ever see Manu for what he truly is, and no amount of typing will change that.

I don’t think I’m a hater, but compared to most of his fans who build alters to him and pray 3 times daily…I guess I am.