This Guy Is Out of His Mind
G.O. (Mannion)A writer for the Sacramento Bee named Bill Bradley is saying that if given the choice, he’d take Spencer Hawes over Greg Oden:
You say I’m crazy? Stay with me. As much hoopla as there was over Oden as the No. 1 overall pick – and yes, he was injured all of last season – he seems to be a one-dimensional player. He is great inside, rebounding and blocking shots. Yet he doesn’t have the offensive impact like the big men to whom he was compared, Shaquille O’Neal and Karl Malone.
Hawes isn’t in that league, either. But what makes him attractive is his other dimensions: passing and outside shooting. Plus, Hawes has bulked up enough to compete with the wide bodies and he isn’t afraid to play inside this season.
His reasoning is weak at best. The fuel behind his article is one of two things: it’s either a ploy to grab some attention and traffic for his column (which, I guess, is a trap we’re falling right into) or he actually has a Kings’-colored purple Kool-Aid mustache and really thinks that Hawes could be game-changer down the road.
Me? I’m not sure I see it. I like Spencer’s game a lot - he can shoot the ball with range for a big man and he’s pretty athletic for a guy his size. But would I take him over Greg Oden? Hell no. You win the in the NBA with defense and rebounding, not pick-and-pop big men. I’ve criticized the Oden media hype plenty in the past, but he clearly has the tools to be a dominant NBA center. Can you say that about Hawes? No way. He might not even be the best big man on his team.
November 26th, 2008 at 1:34 pm
YOUNGFED says:
@Pat
Lots of guys have the tools but does he have the GAME…..As of now that answer is no.
November 26th, 2008 at 1:35 pm
flyp says:
Who’s comparing Oden to Shaq and Karl Malone? Isn’t he more in a Bill Russell mold - blocking/rebound machine?
November 26th, 2008 at 1:35 pm
Michorizo says:
Hawes is pretty good…looking better than Oden so far.
November 26th, 2008 at 1:39 pm
Tbeezy says:
I’m not sold one bit on Oden. And the best big on Sacramento is B Miller.
November 26th, 2008 at 1:40 pm
dagwaller says:
I can see that Pat is a potential over production guy…
November 26th, 2008 at 1:40 pm
Brown says:
Hawes has more than a handful of NBA games under his belt, Oden doesn’t. Give the dude a chance to get half a season under his belt first before you go on saying something crazy like you’d rather have Hawes than Oden. No matter what his skills are, there’s no way in hell Hawes could impact a game the way Oden can. I’d rather have a dominant player on one end of the floor than a decent player on both ends.
November 26th, 2008 at 1:40 pm
Dime Magazine says:
So that might make Hawes the 3rd best big on Sacramento.
November 26th, 2008 at 1:40 pm
Mikey says:
It is like saying you would rather have Brad Miller over Shaq in 1998. Brad Miller has more aspects to his game and puts up some decent stats, but, come on, it’s Shaq.
Same thing goes for Spencer Hawes vs. Greg Oden. Sure, Hawes may have more tools, but Greg Oden can be a game changer (assuming he reaches or even nears his potential).
November 26th, 2008 at 1:42 pm
Kudabeen says:
Hawes is a player you use to build around a player like Oden…
Tbeezy…The best big on Sacramento is Jason Thompson…He is just getting his bearings in the rookie campaign…
November 26th, 2008 at 1:51 pm
Amar says:
you can’t spell homer without Bill Bradley, apparently.
Oden is having a pretty crappy basketball life after getting drafted. But at least he’s doing something. Hawes is a poor man’s kosta koufos.
November 26th, 2008 at 1:52 pm
haslem says:
maybe we should agree that at the moment, neither are playing at an earth shattering level. At the moment neither are a huge deal, mostly becuase you can’t really argue either side becuas neither guy has really done anything yet, and may never do anything.
November 26th, 2008 at 1:55 pm
C4 says:
Atleast he got his name out there by writing that article.
November 26th, 2008 at 2:09 pm
loganlight says:
I agree with you Pat.
If my big man does nothing but grab boards like a carpenter and swat shots like guys in Louisiana without bug repellent, I will be a very happy GM.
Say what you will, but you can find a ton of slashing guards and spot up shooters to surround a big who can suck in rebounds and live on putbacks. Plus the fact that so many PFs now have more athletic/outside games (ala LA)- you can definitely make a contender with GO as the centerpiece.
I’ve never been convinced that Oden was going to be the next Hakeem, but with steady work, he’s going to be a QUALITY big for some time to come. Spencer Hawes is lucky to be on a losing team where he can get by with his limited post play … and yes, I’m hating on him.
LL
November 26th, 2008 at 2:23 pm
dmitry of jersey says:
Greg Oden IS one-dimensional… his one dimension is defense, which is HALF the game of basketball. I can see him having a Mutombo-like career and average 18-14 with 3 blocks easy. That’s a silly argument that writer is making.
November 26th, 2008 at 2:30 pm
BEdger says:
let me preface this by saying that I am a black and red bleeding Blazer homer, but this was the part of the article that seemed downright stupid…”In two games against each other, Oden had a combined 10 points (4-of-9 shooting) and 14 rebounds in 38 minutes. Hawes had 30 points (12 of 26) and eight rebounds in 72 minutes.
You get what you get with Oden. It appears the best is to come for Hawes”
so a guy coming off of microfracture, who couldn’t work on his game for an entire year, and has now played a grand total of 9 career games is a finished product….but a guy who played most of his rookie year and has been relatively healthy since entering the league and has played in 87 career games, is just scrathing the surface of his potential
I call bullshit, who’s with me?
November 26th, 2008 at 2:51 pm
Scott says:
I’ve never seen Hawes play. But I’ve read his stat lines. I’ve seen Oden play. And the reality is that they will probably BOTH become game changers, I don’t know why its always one or the other.
Hawes seems like he’s Brad Miller V2.0, a bit bigger, a bit quicker, and eventually he’ll probably be better overall with regards to his career/stats/play/etc.
The stupid thing about this whole comparison is that a guy like Hawes would be ideal to play along side a guy like Oden.
November 26th, 2008 at 3:08 pm
weezy f says:
but oden is gonna be injured throughout his career so i think i would also pick hawes over oden
November 26th, 2008 at 3:17 pm
BEdger says:
@ weezy, since you know the future, would you mind giving me next week’s powerball numbers?
November 26th, 2008 at 4:00 pm
DJ Go Go Gomez says:
First lett me throw out this disclaimer. I am a Kings fan. But I am NOT dellusional. So here’s my take:
If I had to choose between the two for 1 game TONIGHT, I would go with Hawes. Here’s why.
1) Hawes has over 1 full year of NBA experience over Oden. And with younger players it’s more about experience than talent.
2) Hawes is in better game shape TODAY than Oden.
Now as far as comparisons go, Oden reminds me a lot of Mutombo. Great rebounder and shot blocker but not over skilled offensively. And if Oden has career numbers like Mutumbo I don’t think anyone in Portland will complain. Cuz they should conted with him for a long time. And let’s face he will NEVER put up huge offensive number as long as Roy and Aldridge are around cuz they’ll be the first two options as long as they’re there. Kinda like Bynum in L.A. Hey can average 20 but as long as Kobe and Pau are there he won’t get enough touches.
I can’t really think of a comparison for Hawes. Brad Miller is close but Hawes is WAY more aggressive and tougher. Hawes will put up offensive numbers similar to Brad but I think he’ll averge mor rebounds and blocks.
There
Happy Thanksgiving!!!!
November 26th, 2008 at 4:01 pm
karizmatic says:
right I’m not a big Oden fan, but I definitely wouldn’t take Spencer Hawes over him…that’s just disresepct.
November 26th, 2008 at 4:05 pm
Hugo says:
That’s not even a discussion … They are in different leagues. Oden can be one of the great big men to play the game if he realizes his potential, Hawes can be a good starter in the league for many years. You can build a dinasty around Oden if he stays health. He is averaging 9 pts / 7 boards / 1.68 blocks on just 19.6 minutes in a really, really good team, with a lot of good players and all. Hawes is averaging 12 / 7 / 1.8 in 29 minutes. Oh yeah, and he is not a rookie. Oden played only 9 games in his carrer. If Oden stays health he is going to be fantastic for many years. Give him 1 or 2 years to develop an inside offense game and polish his defensive play and even this idiot will be hoping to get the next Greg Oden.
November 26th, 2008 at 4:11 pm
the rocket cat says:
Oden isn’t playing a ton of minutes, but he has played enough that we know his per-minute numbers aren’t a fluke. Ignoring guys who have seen about 10 seconds of burn, he has the best per-minute numbers of any rookie. There are obviously guys who score more, but they’re not getting the blocks and rebounds.
IF Greg Oden can stop racking up fouls and get healthy enough to play significant minutes, he’ll be the best rookie this year. That doesn’t mean he’ll get rookie of the year, since that will go to someone who scores a lot of points on a shitty team, but in terms of actually contributing, he’ll be the best rookie (if he finds a way to stay on the floor, which is a big IF).
November 26th, 2008 at 4:31 pm
Jay says:
“Having the tools to be a dominant NBA center” doesn’t mean anything in this league. Kwame Brown has those same tools, as do Okafor, Nene, and Ben Wallace. Just because Oden is athletic and has the body to be great, it doesn’t mean he will be. The fact that he still doesn’t have any offensive game speaks volumes about his ceiling. I don’t see Oden becoming anything more than a glorified Sam Dalembeart.
But true, I’d still rather him than Hawes though.
November 26th, 2008 at 4:43 pm
BEdger says:
Jay, none of the players you listed have 1/10 of the size/speed/power combo that Oden possesses. What exactly was Shaq’s offensive game his sophomore year at LSU?
the fact that people are trying to call this guy a bust after 9 games is completely idiotic. Oden won’t even get his athleticism back until NEXT year.
3 years from now Oden will be a game changer on both ends of the court and the people who are bashing him now will convieniently forget they ever doubted the guy
November 26th, 2008 at 4:56 pm
Chaos says:
Hawes and Oden are going to different ways as far as their careers.
Hawes is Brad Miller V2.5 because he has a more aggressive attitude and more athletic and to me is a better scorer. he has a year under his belt and more confidence but Thompson has more potential. Hawes potential has a tremendously lower cieling. his best season maybe 18pts/9rb/3ast/1.5blk, which aint bad by no means. but in the long run he wont be as good
Oden is not being given a fair shake. let him get a full season then get back to me. with his 19min a game he is extremely efficient. He is extremely athletic, runs the floor well and aggressively defensively and when rebounding. he is gonna get alot of fouls this year because he is an aggressive defender and rebounder and its the same way with all high motor big men(bynum, howard, etc). his game will be dunks and garbage around the rim until he develops a post game (shaq needed time to get a soft touch and so does howard). once he gets into game shape and actually learns the game, he will be dominant. at worst he will be Mutumbo, at best bill russell-esque
so Bill Bradley, do us all a favor…
SHUT THE F*** UP!
November 26th, 2008 at 5:43 pm
JCARR says:
Hawes is like a Lafrentz (Rafael) when he had that quick stint of being a good player. Hawes obviously has more potential but is playing in a team where his job is secure
November 26th, 2008 at 6:07 pm
SayItAintSo says:
Being a Husky, I’ve watched Hawes game very closely. Shit, I’ve even dominated Hawes on the virtual hardwoon by way of 2k7 when him and Phil Nelson roomed with my best friend. Needless to say, I’m a Hawes fan and a big one at that. He has a solid jumper for an center. He pulls enough rebounds down and blocks enough shots for someone his size…just enough to where you’re not embarrassed for him. He has a good arsenal of offensive moves as well.
With all that being said, should Oden not have a completely injury plagued career and continue just a little bit along the path of development that he is on now…there is NO EFFIN WAY Hawes can compete with him.
Just look at the two from back in the day when they went head to head. Oden ate Hawes for breakfast. Also, their games aren’t comparable since Hawes is value is overwhelmingly found on the offensive side and Oden’s is overwhelmingly found on the deffensive.
November 26th, 2008 at 7:18 pm
Hugo says:
Jay, the fact that a player with “No offensive game at all” and that plays only 19 min a game is averaging almost 10 points, speaks for itself.
I remember that we had those kinds of doubts about Dwight Howard. He came into the league without an offensive move and averaged 32 minutes and 12 points on his first season. And now, with some time to polish his skills, he is what he is. That monster. Also, Oden plays better defense than Howard played as a rookie. If Oden was healthy and in a creepy team, he could be averaging much more points, boards and blocks. Also, we must remember that he had a really serious surgery and that takes some time to the body be ok again. We all remember that Amare had took almost a season to get back to his old form. Oden will be a monster.
November 26th, 2008 at 7:28 pm
I Hustle says:
who da hell compared Greg Oden to Karl Malone. Bill Bradley eat a dick.
November 27th, 2008 at 2:41 am
J says:
Lets put this simple. Watch the blazers preseason game against sacramento at the rose garden. Hawes tried to dunk on oden and oden powerfully denied him. Not enough?
oden drew 9 fouls that game because every time he got the ball down low the kings rapped him up because they were scared of the power.
i like hawes but nobody employed by the league would take him over oden
November 27th, 2008 at 5:01 am
Jay says:
@BEdger- I never called the guy a bust, but I just don’t see him becoming the franchise big man that so many people seem willing to label him with already. And Shaq was a BEAST in college. What was his offensive game his sophomore year? 28 ppg on 64% shooting. Shaq tore up the league his first year in the NBA and actually had post moves to get him easy dunks. Oden’s main chance of scoring right now is either off rebounds or waiting for a pass around the basket when Steve Blake or Brandon Roy penetrate. Asserting that Oden will be a game changer in the near future is every bit as ridiculous as labeling him a bust after 9 games.
@Hugo- Oden gets the ball handed to him about 3 feet from the basket to get his 8.5 ppg right now. And until Oden gets a 35+ vert and shoulders as broad as billboard, he won’t be Dwight. Again, all you Oden fanboys are saying when this, when that, if this, if that… give me a break. Say it as it is: as of this moment, Oden is simply a marginal player and even Spencer freaking Hawes contributes to his team more.
Tired of people making EVERY prospect out like they are destined for greatness. That shit is earned, stop handing it to guys then hope and expect them to deserve it later.
November 27th, 2008 at 5:44 am
Jay says:
It’s not delusional. Hawes is pretty talented in his own right and Oden’s looked encumbered and mechanical. Oden’s not guaranteed for success. Draft busts do happen. Aside from the defense, I never understood the hoopla around him, even before he got injured. From the moment I saw him play in a televised high school game against Tyler Hansbrough, I was a bit underwhelmed. He runs awkwardly, he’s pigeon-toed and his post movements are very mechanical. The guy he’s compared to Bill Russell moved nothing like him. He was graceful, smooth, he was an athlete ahead of his time and Oden isn’t blessed with the same natural ability to move.
Right now, Pryzbilla and Oden play almost identical style games except Pryzbilla is better right now. They’re like twins out on the court but Pryzilla bests him. Their main job is defense but Pryzbilla does a better job of contesting and not fouling and contesting to force a miss shot. They both score most of their points off dunking back offensive boards or dunking after being set up right under the rim. But where Pryzbilla beats Oden offensively is that he doesn’t get post up opportunities so he doesn’t get a chance to miss as many shots or turnover the ball like Oden has.