It happened four years ago tomorrow. How has the brawl changed the landscape of the NBA? How many careers were greatly affected because of what happened at The Palace?
(I still think Ben Wallace got off easy for his role in the whole thing. When was the last time you heard his name brought up in reference to the brawl? Yet Ron Artest and Stephen Jackson will always be associated with it.)
Related posts:
November 18th, 2008 at 3:55 pm
Caribballin says:
what happened to the ‘feel good’ stories of the nba?
November 18th, 2008 at 3:56 pm
GEE... Well Sa da Tay! says:
I also feel Ben Wallace should be held to more than he gets.
Oh well his game fell apart so karma perhaps if you look at things like that.
Meanwhile Ron was wanting by many teams despite being crazy.
November 18th, 2008 at 3:56 pm
Banga says:
That indiana team was stacked… If it wasn’t for that brawl decimating the team I was convinced they were going to the finals
November 18th, 2008 at 4:01 pm
Zach says:
I think they hit Wallace to hard. 6 games for a hard foul?
That’s all he did shoved a dude. Hell Shaq shoved damn near a whole team the other day and got fined. He didn’t incite the brawl, if the brawl hadn’t happened I bet he doesn’t even get kicked out of the game.
November 18th, 2008 at 4:02 pm
Kermit the Washington says:
All Ben Wallace did was react to Artest and tried to start a fight with HIM. That’s why he didn’t get held as accountable as the rest of them fools; he didn’t start the “Palace Brawl”, Artest did.
It’s like if Ben Wallace was responsible for causing a car accident with Ron Artest. But then Artest jumps back in his car and starts driving into random drivers who had nothing to do with the actual accident. Why would the cops hold Ben Wallace responsible at all for that? Wallace got the punishment for the first part, Jackson, Artest, O’Neal got the punishment for the rest.
November 18th, 2008 at 4:02 pm
Mamba says:
It is different seeing it now some years later,
Ben Wallace basically started the whole damn thing,
Jackson and Artest will always get remembered for going into the crowd right away,
Not to mention when Jermaine O’neal took that one jackass fan out who was on the court, that was epic
Classy showing by the Detroit fans as well
November 18th, 2008 at 4:10 pm
GEE... Well Sa da Tay! says:
Wow 6 games? That ain’t nuthin. Ben Wallace was the catalyst, the spark that started that fire.
First off the foul wasn’t that hard, for Wallace to be shovin dude all hard. I have seen many cats on the playground, including myself take way worst with intent to (which I don’t feel Ron had intent).
Third after the push, to which Ron didn’t try to come back (smart on his part) Ben keeps going towards Ron trying to keep it going and stuff.
5th Meanwhile Ron just went and cooled out on the scorers table, and a fan throws a cup and well you know the rest.
Now lets say Ben takes the foul like a man (mind you the foul was called right away too) and walks away. This probably doesn’t happen.
Even if Ben does the push but stops going forward to continuously try to fight Ron, again this probably doesn’t happen.
Again Ben started it all. I am not saying Ron wasn’t wrong for going in the stands (I ain’t saying he wasn’t right either). I am saying Ben should have had a minimum 30 days. I never liked Ben after this.
Detroit fans went nuts. I really want to know what Young thinks on all this lol.
It’s cool though like I said meanwhile Ron is a player teams want despite that incident and ain’t no one really even checkin for Ben now.
Shaq should have gotten more for what he did too. Two games in a row I think Shaq had physical contact that wasn’t necessary. He should have gotten some games too.
November 18th, 2008 at 4:15 pm
Sam says:
Detroit fans are also responsible for this. You can’t throw your drink to the player from the stands.
November 18th, 2008 at 4:16 pm
GEE... Well Sa da Tay! says:
This never even goes to the fans if Ben doesn’t overreact.
Course I know we could go to a lot of if’s still
I am here to praise Ron not to bury him.
November 18th, 2008 at 4:16 pm
Austin Burton says:
Let’s get it straight; Ben’s “push” was as close to a punch as you can get.
November 18th, 2008 at 4:17 pm
GEE... Well Sa da Tay! says:
And they need to stop sellin beer at these arenas lol. I can say that cause I don’t drink.
Before all you drinkers get your lil pannies in a wad, I was kidding.
November 18th, 2008 at 4:19 pm
Kermit the Washington says:
@ GEE
How is it possible that Wallace “started it all” Gee? I don’t get it…like, if I pick a fight with you while we’re playing basketball, and you snap all of a sudden and go punching people that are walking down the street watching us play, and then the cops arrest you for assault, do you really think I’m getting arrested with you for pushing you?? You went on a completely unrelated, unpredictable rampage and no one in their right mind would be like “Kermit started it”. No way.
November 18th, 2008 at 4:22 pm
N-Truh-Kit says:
has it really be four years? wow.
but i agree with Gee…Ben started it all. it’s not like he’s a small dude, he’s built. Artest didn’t foul him hard enough for him to react like that.
Ron was layin on the scorers table mindin his own business and Ben threw a towel @ him, then the fans thought it was ok or something and decided to help Ben out (wtf?).
it was all crazy. Bottom line is Ben should be held just as much accountable as Ron and S-Jack
November 18th, 2008 at 4:30 pm
dapro says:
Ben was the match that lit the fire
The fan throwing the cup was the gasoline that blew the palace up that night
Artest basically said “I’ll take Ben Wallace’s sh$% cause he’d kick my azz but I’d be damned if I let this 12oz cup punk me”
Stephen Jackson basically said “It’s Thursday, let kick some azz”
November 18th, 2008 at 4:31 pm
GEE... Well Sa da Tay! says:
Kermit the Washington says:
@ GEE
How is it possible that Wallace “started it all” Gee? I
Yes he “started it”! Again I say this is dealing with “if” now.
But with your example if you don’t start the fight with me because of your overreacting then I don’t have cause to go off to the side where someone who is a fan of yours hits me with a capri sun causing me to snap lol.
Yea you would have started it too. It’s like you are ignoring what Ben did and how he first over reacts in all this. He makes all those plays go into action. YOu can’t see that?
November 18th, 2008 at 4:32 pm
GEE... Well Sa da Tay! says:
Again Ben makes those plays all go into action based on what he did.
Now of course people have their own minds, but still this whole things begins (just like the tape shows) with Ben’s push-punch, then still trying to go at it, and goes from their.
It’s like Ben was the cig that had that lil light left that started the wildfire. Most def. Ben has to be looked at as the initiator and participant.
November 18th, 2008 at 4:33 pm
dapro says:
Kermit
Turthfully bruh I can’t see how this is debatable
Ben should have taken responsibility for his actions
November 18th, 2008 at 4:34 pm
it ain't easy being green says:
@ Austin - funny it’s you to post this. Who was it that had all that “D-bag” stuff to say about celtics fans. Na I’m playin. I can’t blame ronron. Hit me I’m the melon with a beer and watch what happens. Jermain oneill mollywopped that one dude.
November 18th, 2008 at 4:34 pm
Mikey F Baby says:
I still remember watching that game live, it was crazy.
I like how the only player to stay safely on his team’s bench was Compton native Tashaun Prince lmao.
Wonder how AI would have reacted if he were with DET 4 years ago.
November 18th, 2008 at 4:34 pm
control says:
I don’t know how people can be blaming Ben for that shit. The guy shoved Ron-Ron, that’s it. Was it right? No, but it was only a shove. I find it amusing that Ron decided to not do anything about it, because Ben would have crushed Ron. If that were someone like Mike Miller, you know Ron would have been throwing fists.
The guy who should hold full responsibility for the brawl is Ron Artest. A guy threw a cup of water on him, big deal…doesn’t give you the right to start beating up random people. SJack and Jermane are idiots for throwing down beats as well, it’s not like Ron-Ron was in trouble or anything. The guy was busy beating up some little kids.
The biggest douche bag in this whole thing is that idiot John Green. He’s the guy who threw the cup, and then when Artest ran up into the crowd, pointed him at those two little kids who started eating the beats. That guy has been interviewed by radio stations here, he’s pretty much a living piece of shit.
November 18th, 2008 at 4:35 pm
TO says:
@ Dapro
Stephen Jackson basically said “It’s Thursday, let kick some azz”
I dont know why but I actually laughed out loud HARD at that… Awesome comment.
2 strippers and 1 gunshot in the air for that one.
November 18th, 2008 at 4:35 pm
sans says:
Looking at it all, I now know why Detroit is such a ghetto ass city just by watching their fans. Sucker punching players from behind, throwing drink, chairs, knocking down old ladies…wow.
I met Tommy Munoz, the official that gets hit with a bottle, at a ref camp in PHX and it goes to show what can happen when you let little shit go all game, players get chippy, don’t like one another, take a foul personally (and Artest’s foul wasn’t even that hard on Ben) then things get out of control. He was talking in context to what happened between Ben and Ron Ron, everything after that goes squarely on the fans being trash.
That JO punchout was awesome though.
November 18th, 2008 at 4:36 pm
YGB (Obama 08) says:
@ Gee i feel you. (no homo) I lost all respect for Ben after this brawl. And it’s funny no 1 mentioned Rick Mahorn’s fat ass. He’s such a peacemaker right? Lol!
November 18th, 2008 at 4:38 pm
Bondzai says:
You know looking back at this I’m suprised Tinsley didn’t pull out his piece and start street sweeping.
November 18th, 2008 at 4:38 pm
fallinup says:
Indy was kickin’ that ass that night and the game was all but a wash. These were the best teams in the east and a heated rivalry already. This was the year that Indy was expected to surpass Detroit in the east and the record proved it up until then. You could attribute a lot of things that happened that lead to the Brawl.
In the end, Indy is still feeling the after effects.
November 18th, 2008 at 4:41 pm
Kermit the Washington says:
Nah, I feel you Gee on the fact that Ben set the stage. I’m not saying he was innocent at all, I’m just like surprised that so many people thing Wallace is just as responsible as the rest. He got suspended for a punch/shove thing and the towel thing. But you can easily go back to when Artest first hit Wallace in the face - you KNOW that was on purpose, and he actually fooled a couple of you into thinking he “didn’t foul him hard enough for him to react like that”. Knowing Artest, he had been getting under Wallace’s skin the entire game and that one just set him off. So Wallace punches him. And a fan throws a cup out there and Artest and sJack go swinging through the crowd?! Cmon, why would the league even think of going after Wallace for the same punishment? I’m really trying to understand this…I think 6 games was the perfect punishment.
November 18th, 2008 at 4:42 pm
sans says:
so I’d say, and this is coming from a ref, that the officials allowed that game to get out of control in some way. Too physical in the final minutes of a blowout. That did ruin the Pacers stacked squad, Reggie, SJack, Ron Ron, JO before the injuries, I feel like I’m forgetting somebody, was Brad Miller on that team too back then? I even forgot Jonathan Bender existed…
November 18th, 2008 at 4:43 pm
FluffyG says:
I’d say it was the piston fans who started the real show. Wouldn’t you be pissed if someone threw a drink on your head? I would, but im not crazy so i wouldn’t run up into the stands. I think Artest already was a little fired up and really pissed off and he tried to cool off, but when he was trying someone tossed gasoline at his fire.
November 18th, 2008 at 4:48 pm
fallinup says:
When they went to John Saunders…he said it best…and this was right after it happened.
“I’m here to tell you that the Pistons’ fans, based on what I saw, are a bunch of punks. It’s easy to throw beer on top of somebody who’s already down. It’s easy to throw a punch at somebody when you’re behind them,” Saunders said. “Show us that you’re not a sissy. Just do it right. It just makes me mad. It’s ridiculous. It’s the worst thing I’ve ever seen.”
November 18th, 2008 at 4:48 pm
control says:
post 14…LOL
November 18th, 2008 at 4:49 pm
K_Digital says:
I still remember exactly where I was and what I was doing when this went down (kinda like how old people will tell you where they were when they found out Kennedy was shot).
November 18th, 2008 at 4:52 pm
dapro says:
I saw Sjax in person before(pre brawl) and the first thing I thought about was clutching my purse lol
That dude brings out the b*$%# in people
November 18th, 2008 at 4:55 pm
GEE... Well Sa da Tay! says:
Kerm I probably woulnd’t even be all on Ben if I hadn’t seen and played with dudes who have done and do stuff (with and without intent) that are much more horrid that the lil foul Artest gave.
I feel like A.I. “Seriously a foul? A little foul? You gonna push a dude that hard and and keep coming on that little foul?”
I do think it might have been more stuff possibly leading to that point, but Ben still took it to far.
Ron could have even tried to go back at Ben after a while, cause you know how it be when you know a bunch of dudes be in the middle and you know they ain’t gonna let you fight. So you always have that one dude who talks all loud and even harder cause he know cats in the middle.
Ron could have took that way, but fa real to be shoved that hard, and to just go lay down, or not even talk and yell. Got to give Ron props till he goes in the stands.
Yea refs and coaches should have done more to get everyone cool.
You know the same thing could have happened from Matt Barnes, that dummy.
November 18th, 2008 at 5:00 pm
Damon says:
I barely can watch this. nov 19 2004 will always be a sad day for me. it took away the championship for reggie.
the team went into the champs arena and destroyed them.
finals wouöd have been veeery possible.
the year after that, reggie wasn’t there to lead, so the team fell apart…
but as a pacers fan: wallace may have started it, but the blame just goes on artest AND jackson(he “helped” him; ever heard of holding him back? fool)
dont understand why jack is leader now…
i still hate(but really respect) detroit, but you cant blame ben wallace for that.
November 18th, 2008 at 5:01 pm
TomGfromCanada says:
J.O. with the K.O.
November 18th, 2008 at 5:11 pm
heckler...formerly 'yallallreadyknow' says:
Jermaine O’Neal was still voted into the allstar game that year by the coaches
November 18th, 2008 at 5:14 pm
control says:
Gee
Come on bro, Ron Ron didn’t go lay down because he was showing good judgment. He was laying down because he didn’t want his ass beat. Did you see how FAR Ron got pushed? Big Ben is one of the strongest guys in the NBA, he would have killed Ron Ron if he threw a punch instead of a shove. Ron was laying down trying not to piss his pants.
November 18th, 2008 at 5:27 pm
Ross says:
I agree. I thought Ben Wallace both started, and instigated the incident.
November 18th, 2008 at 5:32 pm
GEE... Well Sa da Tay! says:
control even if you wanna look at it that way, which is cool with me. I have no problem saying Ron might have been scared, he still went and LAID DOWN.
Even cats really afraid can throw and run…:see Carmelo
Still I choose to look at it as good judgement cause even in being afraid I have seen dudes yell while backing up and Ron was just like “man whatever”.
I don’t think Ron was afraid myself. I now wish Ron “had” went back at him, then perhaps the rest of that wouldn’t have happened fan wise.
November 18th, 2008 at 5:46 pm
control says:
Gee
Your defending Ronnyboy a little bit too much, and all probably because he’s on Houston now. Here is a play by play of what Ron was thinking throughout this event, read it out loud while watching the video:
Committing foul - “I’m going to get this fucker good, rub it in his face we are winning and back up all the shit I have been talking tonight. bwhaha!”
Stare down - “I’m a bad ass. This guy ain’t that big.”
Being pushed - “Holy shit, where am I? How’d I get to the sidelines? What happened? Am I DEAD!?!?”
Walking to scorer’s table dazed - “I think I’m still alive. I need to lay down somewhere. Maybe they will have a replay of what happened to me at the scorer’s table.”
Getting hit with cup of water - “I must still be alive! What the fuck is this shit? WATER?!?! HOW DARE HE WASTE WATER! ARRRRRGGGG!”
Punching random fans - “By your powers combined, I am Captain Planet!!! ARRRGGGGGGG!!!”
Rest of the night - “Hmmmm….MAYBE I overreacted a bit…nah!”
November 18th, 2008 at 6:00 pm
GEE... Well Sa da Tay! says:
Now control you do come off funny at times, but you was stale there pimpin.
Yo material is usually stronger fa real, I’m shocked
You should have saved that one.
Outside of, this ain’t got nothing to do with me being a Houston fan (although I knoowww it comes off like that), I can’t even comment on the rest.
Fa real if he was on Sac, I would have defended him like this on this brawl aspect. I always said Ben caused it all.
And speaking of defending a little to much,…you kinda tryna make Ben like he can’t be beat and I don’t think you a Chi or Detroit fan right?
Still don’t think Ron was scared though
November 18th, 2008 at 6:01 pm
GEE... Well Sa da Tay! says:
LOL I have said my say on this.
Control you got that last word pimpin.
I’m out!
November 18th, 2008 at 6:32 pm
Dennis Castro says:
Could you imagine if this happened with Philly fans? Holy sh!t, ESPN might devote a 24/7 news station outlining every single transgression we Philly fans have had at a sporting event.
November 18th, 2008 at 7:18 pm
JCARR says:
@Dime
It says video is no longer available. what happened? Did you suddenly change your mind about showing the video after 40 posts? I’m JK.
Yea not the greatest spotlight for the NBA, and it was on national television. I remember that it was great (to see and not be part of). I was sitting in my couch watching with one eye open. Then suddenly mayhem broke out there and in my house cuz i was screaming after each blow.
November 18th, 2008 at 7:53 pm
barons beard says:
J.O. with the slobberknocker on that punk ‘fan’ was classic!!
November 19th, 2008 at 5:14 am
phillyboy says:
Man, that this detroyed a Pacers team that could’ve won the chip that year.
November 19th, 2008 at 8:37 am
Tuimur says:
Ben Wallace? Well, he didn’t climb in the stands and beat up fans.
http://www.scribd.com/doc/2332929/Ben-Wallace-Block-or-How-to-Increase-Vertical-Jump