NBA / Dec 24, 2008 / 11:00 am

Who’s Better: Marcus Camby or Andrew Bynum?

We argue. You decide…

MARCUS CAMBY (by Austin Burton)
Late last month, while Marcus Camby was posting a typical 12-point, 12-rebound, 4-block stat line during an atypical L.A. Clippers victory, one of the team’s announcers said, “I never knew how good he was until I saw him every day.” As someone who has already watched more Clippers games this year than ever before (thanks to Zach Randolph and Eric Gordon), I’d have to agree.

As that same announcer later said about Camby, “He just wins your team possessions.” In other words, having Camby on the basketball court is like a football coach having Ed Reed. He’s a ball-hawk. Whether it’s defensive rebounds or blocks where he keeps the ball in play, Camby increases your time of possession automatically. Better yet, watch when he gets an offensive rebound. Whereas a lot of big guys (Sam Dalembert immediately comes to mind) will get an offensive board and 90 percent of the time go right back up for a shot, Camby will often kick it back to his point guard, allowing his team to start over with a fresh 24. That’s a veteran move, one fitting of a true team player. And it pretty much sums up why, at this point, I’d take 34-year-old Camby over a lot of centers in the League. Of course any GM would take a 21-year-old like Andrew Bynum for the long-term, but a vet like Camby helps you win today.

Marcus Camby(Photo. SI.com)

Camby has made the NBA’s All-Defensive first or second team each of the past four years, leading the League in blocks three years running. He’s been producing consistently for several years, not just several months. Through Monday’s schedule Camby ranked second in rebounding (12.3 rpg) and second in blocks (2.8 bpg). Offensively he won’t give you much more than, say, Tyson Chandler, but he’s not a liability in that he tries to do too much on that end (11.2 ppg, 51.7% FG’s). Camby knows his role and plays it well.

Critics will say Camby’s numbers in recent years have been inflated because of the teams he’s been on: He wasn’t battling anyone on the Nuggets for available rebounds, Denver gave up tons of penetration which made for increased blocked-shot opportunities, and at the end of the day, was their defense ever really that good with Camby? To an extent, that’s true. Also, it seems curious that Mike Dunleavy Sr. hardly utilizes Camby to guard the other team’s top big man.

Thing is, just like with superstar scorers, the most important thing is to keep a star defender like Camby on the court. Sticking Yao or Dwight Howard for long stretches inevitably leads to foul trouble no matter how good you are, so like the Celtics do with KG, you want to pick your spots when employing Camby to stop an All-Star big. In the meantime he’ll live off weak-side blocks and boards, because as long as he’s on the court, Camby will get you the ball. And that’s all you really want.

ANDREW BYNUM (by Andrew Katz)
Here’s a fun little challenge: try to articulate how Marcus Camby scores. Umm … Well, he can kinda shoot that molasses-slow, ugly, over-the-head flat-footed jumper from 15 feet. And, uh, I guess he’s also good for a couple put-backs a night.

Andrew BynumAndrew Bynum (photo. Jeff Forney)

But aside from those half-hearted compliments, Camby’s offensive game is anemic. The guy’s a gifted shot-blocker and a talented rebounder, but he needs more than two dimensions to be called a better basketball player than Andrew Bynum.

Even if Bynum’s numbers are about the same as Camby’s (12.4 ppg isn’t much more than MC’s 11.7 ppg), remember that he plays with Kobe and Pau. That means there are probably less than five plays in Phil Jackson‘s playbook that are run specifically for Bynum to get a bucket. Maybe if this Laker team were still developing, and a couple of years away from the Finals, they’d work on getting Bynum more touches where he can score. But as Kobe famously said in Patrick Cassidy’s Dime #39 cover story, “Well, they know they gotta come with it. You know it’s … this train’s gotta keep moving. You either gotta be on the train or get run over by the train. But the train’s gotta keep moving. We want to win a championship and we want to win one now.”

That being said, it’s obvious that Bynum currently has some semblance of comfort with his back to the basket. Through Monday’s schedule he ranked fourth in the League in dunks with 50 — that’s only five behind Dwight Howard, and a cool 30 ahead of Camby. Add in that Bynum’s baby hook will continue to improve, and it’s easy to see this guy posting closer to 18-and-10 instead of the 12-and-8 he’s putting up right now.

Maybe it’s just me, but I need a power component to my center’s game. That’s something that you can’t teach — and it’s the biggest reason that Bynum takes about a free throw more per game than Camby. With the right work in the weight room and with the right trainer, Bynum can improve his motor; which is the biggest reason that Camby puts up higher rebound numbers.

Who do you think is better?

“Who’s better?” archives
12/19 — Deron Williams vs. Chauncey Billups
12/17 — Manu Ginobili vs. Tracy McGrady
12/12 — Amare Stoudemire vs. Al Jefferson
12/10 — Dirk Nowitzki vs. Chris Bosh
12/9 — Derrick Rose vs. O.J. Mayo
12/8 — Rasheed Wallace vs. Elton Brand
12/5 — Kevin Martin vs. Vince Carter
12/4 — Brandon Roy vs. Joe Johnson
12/3 — Dwight Howard vs. Yao Ming
12/2 — Paul Pierce vs. Carmelo Anthony

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  • Ric Hardwood

    Camby is better (assuming he’s healthy) offensively, he is probably the best complementary center in the league. He needs teammates who can score, Bynum on the other hand, can score on his own. Defensively, no question, Camby is better…

  • doc

    right now camby

  • Mikey F Baby

    Camby’s so good the Nuggets traded him for a Wal-Mart gift card and are now even better than last year.

    But seriously I was a Nugget fan last year (left with AI) and I do like Marcus. He can block shots and rebound with the best, but needs to stop taking that long, funny ass jumper from the top of the key. Give Bynum a few years, I don’t see why everyone is fawning over him. A big guy who goesn’t dribble the ball off his knee half time time that plays for LA, I get it.

  • Clay

    Any truth to the rumor regarding Jermaine O’neal smacking Superhead ass da day before the LA game? Seen a video on da web where she “Threw him under da bus” b/c she ain’t appreciate da ass smack

  • Kudabeen

    Camby a more consistent producer, but I’d take Bynum in a game where I need to match another team’s best paint presence. I have this Give-Take punishment ratio that I use to judge Bigs in the L…Camby is a very finess defensive center, but Bynum is not afraid of contact and though his stats aren’t as gaudy as Camby’s has been in these last years that he actually stayed healthy he is still a decent rebounding (which means minutes) from having a double double on a loaded Top West Conf contender…

    Camby has been cleaning up trash the last few years on sub par defensive teams…Bynum is “MANING” the paint and will only get better if Phil allows him to. He has shown the work ethic and shows glimpses of dominance. He has great hands and looks to punch it on whoever…I’d take that young Big over Camby today…

    The question is…You swap Camby for Bynum straight up, which team suffers the most?

    I’d say LA wouldn’t be any tougher to defeat a Celtics team or Spurs type team with Camby…Camby is a less offensive more opportunistic Gasol…Lakers need a physical Presence that will not shy away from Garnett, Powe, Perkins…

  • PALakerFan

    Camby this year. Bynum for the next 15.

  • http://dimemag.com iannyb

    Bynum a very good player and has the raw talent to develop into a household name.I suspect his concentration,drive and ain’t where it ought to be.I suppose with the right tutoring he’ll get there. Give like the rest of the season.
    Showing love from St Lucia

  • Sanpitch

    Camby

    Bynum is probably 75% hype.

    Camby wins this all day. Anyone saying Bynum is either 1) a Laker fan (which means they are oblivious to reality) or 2) caught up in the media hype that has crowned Bynum the next big thing.

    This isn’t even close.

    Kudabeen I am saying you are both 1 & 2.

  • Kudabeen

    Well clearly you don’t know me Sanpitch…

  • Sanpitch

    Hold up Dime:

    Even if Bynum’s numbers are about the same as Camby’s (12.4 ppg isn’t much more than MC’s 11.7 ppg), remember that he plays with Kobe and Pau. That means there are probably less than five plays in Phil Jackson’s playbook that are run specifically for Bynum to get a bucket.

    If you are going to use that argument for Bynum then you have to use it for Camby. Dude played with AI, Melo, and KMart. If you think you even get to touch the ball with those 3 you are a fool. This year he has Boom Dizzle, Ricky Davis, and Randolph. Not AS bad as the Denver trio but still not conducive to getting your shots.

    Weak-ass argument Dime.

  • s.bucketz

    Camby for sure..if phil jackson got 5 plays for bynum camby gets 0 from dunleavy nd ther still gettin about the same point production…and ive never ever seen these “flashes of dominance” outta bynum but camby can dominate a game from the defensive end…put it this way..
    bynum scores bout 12 points a night but hes holding the ball a lot more and takin more shots…slowing the game down nd takin shots away from his teamates…
    Camby scores about 12 points off hustle plays takin nothing away from his teamates besides givin them more possesion..
    and on top of that camby will slow down an opposing star big while bynum gets straight Debo’d

  • Sanpitch

    Clearly I don’t.

  • Prof. TX

    Bynum benefits from being a Laker. His stats are almost identical to Bogut but you won’t hear people calling for him to be an all-star or the missing piece of a championship or the next Shaq the way they do with Bynum. Bynum gets the residual Kobe love and Laker attention. If he put up these numbers for the Thunder or Bobcats then you’d hardly know his name.

  • Drink the Haterade (KB24 Chip 09)

    The other night AB had the ball on the wing and drove to the rack right, spun around to his left and finished with a dunk. Last big man I seen do that was probably Shawn Kemp back in his hey day!

  • Taj

    No argument… Camby hands down! Bynums showed me nothing!

  • Ric Hardwood

    Bynum is closer (but better) to a Kendrick Perkins…

  • Drink the Haterade (KB24 Chip 09)

    OK here’s the question, before last year, J Kidd one of the greatest PG’s ever was dangled in front of Mitch K for AB and he declined it. If J Kidd was to be dangled in front of Denver for MC and Denver had a healthy Nene, do you not think they would have made that trade?

    MC was traded for peanuts, AB is untouchable.

  • Kudabeen

    A center should have a physical presence…Camby gets teams that shoot a lot and play fast more possessions sure, but Do that translate into meaningful wins…Neither him or Bynum proved anything in the playoffs as of late. The difference is Camby has had chance after chance since 1999 to be a difference maker. Camby is a quality center, but he isn’t the presence Bynum is right now…

    Swap the players…Clippers sneak in playoffs and LA gets knocked out by the Spurs or Celtics…Hell Even Cavs would eat Camby alive…He can’t hold Big Z or get him foul trouble like Bynum or other physical centers…

    We all will know more as this season develops and Bynum gets more meaningful minutes…Minutes where getting rebounds are critical…4th Quarter.

    Presence vs Perception…

  • Chaos

    Igotta take Camby right now. the guy just happens to be wherever the ball is and does the intangibles…just better than anyone else and has some of the best help defense for a big man in the L. Bynum doesnt move up and down the floor and seems to have a lack of effort several times during the game.

  • Jayo

    I’m going w/ Bynum.
    2 be real. Camby is an okay man 2 man defender, but 1 reason why Denver’s defense is better w/o Camby. Is that he was horrible on screen & rolls. Sure he gets blocks & rebounds, but there’s more to defense than just stats. Bynum is better man 2 man, has comparable stats, & does more of the little things on defense that Camby doesn’t do, not to mention his better offensive potential.

  • Mista TKO

    When it comes to Defense I always go with one on one defenders over help defenders
    I want somebody that can stop his man from scoring or at least make the other man work for every little thing he does

    so If the other man is gonna take 15 shots he struggles to make 5 while being forced to miss the rest as opposed to getting about 10 easy shots and missing 5 harder ones)

    I like Marcus Camby a lot especially back in denver, he’s a great rebounder and he is a great weak side defender which is great in covering up other people’s mistakes, but who’s covering his mistakes when he can’t stop someone from posting?

    I would rather take Bynum who can frustrate his man defensively and trust in the other players to take care of their men too, if somebody else messes up, maybe Bynum can take care of it, maybe he doesn’t but there is only like a 1 or 2 bpg difference between them

    To me that means Camby might save 6 or 8 points a game from penetration while giving up 10 unnecessary pts (5 easy shots from his man because he couldn’t stop him from posting)

    THere is a good link right here that highlights his difficulties with Post Defense

    http://www.pickaxeandroll.com/2008/9/29/624213/video-scouting-report-marc

    When it comes to offense there is no comparison, neither one of them are the first options on their team but Camby has no Post offense at all compared to Bynum’s raw but potent post offense,
    Bynum has no perimeter offense but Neither does Camby, he is mainly limited to jump shooting and he’s not that good at that, unlike Bynum who is still young and has time to develop facets of his offensive game, Camby is on the downturn of his career, it’s not like he’s suddenly going to turn into a better shooter or develop a post game soon.

  • G

    Post 16 is what this argument should have been. Bynum or Perkins? And please put the celtics/lakers love/hate on hold for a second. Perkins is consistently underrated while Bynum is consistently overrated. Now I have to say that I do get to see Perk play a lot more than I get to see Bynum because I live in the area. But honestly without a bias (Im a sixers fan) Id take Perk. He may not quite have the Stats of Bynum but hes probably more physical, only slightly less effective on offense (seriously he does have the ability to get buckets). But more importantly plays with a much higher intensity level than Bynum.

  • Sanpitch

    Haterade your argument is dumb as hell. Camby is in the 13th season and is 34. Bynum is in his 4th season and is 21.

    Because of your hypothetical trade for J-Kidd, that means Bynum is better!?

    And Kudabeen you are smoking something good if you think the Clippers make the playoff with Bynum! That is ridiculous. And saying he isn’t the presence that Bynum is now is dumb as hell.

    Bynum is averaging 12.4 pts 8.4 rebs 1.9 blks
    Camby is averaging 11.2 pts 12.3 rebs 2.8 blks

    To me that is saying that Camby is more of a presence. He averages 4 more boards and 1 more block a game then Bynum. And Camby is past his prime.

    I’d still take Camby and think I’ll let the numbers speak for themselves.

  • Kudabeen

    Next Shaq is ridiculous…This is about Camby…

    Again swap the two players and what is the result…Playoffs are a different game than the Regular season…

    Camby gave Denver 3ppts 23fg% 13rpg and 3blks…Great, but did he really affect the games?

    Lakers don’t need Bynum to Rebound or really block shots…His presence makes the difference…When you have a Gasol getting 9rebs 1 blk, Odom 6rebs 1blk, Kobe getting 5rebs, Ariza getting 5rebs, etc. Bynum doesn’t need to be much of a ball hawk…Clippers routinely get out rebounded with two double double guys on their team, why? They get out rebounded, because they aren’t tough enough to hold down the paint. Camby stats are great, but is he winning meaningful possessions and games…Nah…

    Camby is a big man on an island…He has ample opportunities to pad his stats…A nuggets team without another center and a clippers team without a center due to injuries don’t trick me…

    On everything I know…Bynum would turn Clippers to a playoff team that can do some things…He would enhance the play of a Baron, Thorton, Gordon, and Z-Bo…More possessions mean nothing if they are bad possessions…Playing inside out is winning BBall…Can’t do that with Camby…

    You all can have Camby, Biedrins, Chandler and Okafor…

    Give me Shaq, Perkins, Bynum, Horford and even Big Z…at this stage

    I need my center to punish and secure winning possessions, not padding stats on sub par teams…

    Al Jefferson gets a TBD and I’m not considering Tier 1 stars of This Season…

  • Drink the Haterade (KB24 Chip 09)

    OK well this is totally off the subject right now, but a few days ago some Portland fans said they weren’t worried about Oden and how it was a smart move to pick him over KD. I know Crazy talk! A few months ago the same Blazers fans were talkin some smack about how they’d take GO over AB.

    “Greg Oden, meanwhile, was invisible: Eight minutes, five fouls, zero points. The Blazers announcers are notorious homers, and the only good thing they could say about G.O. was that he stayed in the game mentally from the bench, standing and cheering as Joel Przybilla clocked 19 boards and 10 points …”

    GO has done absolutely nothing since he has been in the “L” except sit on the bench and collect some pay.

  • http://www.edthesportsfan.com SoulOnIce

    Kudabeen,

    You’re pretty accurate on everything you’re saying. The only problem is (well, one of them) is Bynum has gotten sooooo much hype, and has he really lived up to it??? I mean, he’s healthy right now, but his numbers still don’t justify the attention he gets. Plus, there are still games when we don’t know what we’ll get outta Bynum. I definitely wouldn’t say he’s “manning” the paint. I just don’t see him as a consistent presence right now. In the same amount of minutes, he gets as many rebounds as Kendrick Perkins, and by no means will I begin to call Perkins a dominant presence, so the same should (even though it doesn’t) apply to Bynum.

    With Camby, we know we’re getting double-digit points, rebounds, and three blocks. He’s been doing that for quite some time. That has to be taken into consideration. Right now, I say Camby.

  • http://GEE2.com GEE…Stop lying, you fa real???

    You got to go Camby. the thing here is over the years Camby is “Proven”. Like above you know what you are getting no question.

    To early and to soon for Bynum plus the kid really hasn’t made any specific mark for himself.

    Team wise he is a great addition but as an individual player comparison Camby has this one.

  • dagwaller

    No offense, AK, but right now, Bynum is pretty so-so. I just don’t see what all the hype is about. If it weren’t for that decent stretch last season, we wouldn’t even be talking about this. Camby for this season, maybe next, before he starts to decline in a serious way.

    Oh yea, and Bynum has to contend with Pau and Kobe for shots, while Camby has had to contend with AI and Melo (two of the biggest ballhogs in the league), JR Smith, Baron Davis (another d bag in that way), Ricky Davis (the biggest ballhog of them all – well maybe not, I mean we ARE talking about Baron Davis, JR Smith, AI, and Melo), Chris Kaman, Al Thornton, Eric Gordon, and Zach Randolph.

    Point being, Camby probably NEVER gets a play run for him. It’s a miracle he gets as many points as he does.

  • Ian

    camby underrated bynum overrated
    camby easy over bynum
    kudabeen clips playoffs????????

    this is article shoulda been bynum or bogut and hell give me bogut

    camby is perfect for any team just throw him in there hell get boards blocks and possesions and wont take anything away from the team i dont think he will complain if u sit him in the final 4 mns like bynum. whoever said bynum was better on d is outta his damn mind.

  • Sanpitch

    SoulOnlce

    Thanks for bringing some more sanity to this post. Bynum can’t fart without the media talking about his perfect form and how it had the “potential” to be the best fart of all time.

    Give me a break. Throw Bynum on any team not named LA or NY and none of us even know who he is.

    The better argument would be Bynum and Bogut or Bynum and Perkins. Don’t disrespect 12 and a half years in the league with “potential”.

    Camby hands down. Case closed.

    All the hypothetical talk needs to end about if Bynum were on the Clippers they would make the playoffs or they wouldn’t trade J Kidd for him. Dumb as hell. Give me what he has/is accomplishing and leave it at that. All that hypothetical ‘ish is just opinion and your opinion is wrong. Argue about what they are/have been doing and debate that.

    Right now Camby’s numbers are better proving he is more of a presence, proving he is better. All the talk of well he plays on a crap team means nothing. He goes up against the same people night in and night out.

    Case closed.

    LA fans get your head out your ass and realize that there are 29 other teams. And all your players aren’t the best. You got Kobe, leave it at that.

  • jayslay

    put it this way…if u want a center with experience rite now take camby…no matter how good or bad u think he is this guy has still been to a NBA finals and been the defensive anchor…but if you are going on potential then its without question bynum….as of right now these guys are pretty even….camby is not great but niether is bynum.. camby…no is declining and bynum is rising…i personally think bynum is good enough to a really good player…i think if he were on a team with no other post man he could be a 20-10 guy…

    and anybody who says he’s all hype hasn’t seen this kid play some elite players…

  • Kudabeen

    Dumb is looking at numbers and not reality Sanpitch…

    Do you watch basketball? Do you understand what “presence” mean? I know Kobe and Phil Jackson does…I know they think presence and toughness is key to getting that Chip…

    Also if you watched BBall, you would know inside out is winning BBall…you can have CP3, AI, Melo, Baron, and all these quick guys that put up quick shots, but if the paint isn’t being held down on both ends of the floor you aren’t winning jack…Camby 1999 had a much better argument than Camby 2008/09…

    Bynum’s presence would bring some semblance of order to the Clippers…The Best Clippers team was the one with paint presence…You guard the paint and keep the opposing defense sunk in on the offensive end you tend to win…

    Just what it is…

    The only Dumb thing I do Sanpitch is argue with cats like you…

  • QQ

    Bynum.

    Last year, the Cambster was better, but if we’re talkin bout this year, it’s all Bynum.

    And we’re not talkin bout the overall performance.I know Bynum’s verging on mediocrity right now, with all the expectations so high for him. But this article is about two players, who’s the better one. Clearly, the Laker kid is the better one.

  • Sanpitch

    Kudabeen

    This is my last post and then I am out for the day. Merry Christmas y’all.

    I have played ball probably longer than you have been out of diapers. Ideally and traditionally you want the inside/out game. But look at Golden State 2 years ago. They proved that method wrong.

    I realize that I am talking to a brick wall, but are you basing your judgment of Bynum on “potential” or what the cat is doing on the court. That is probably where we disagree.

    On the court Bynum has done NOTHING to make me jump on his bandwagon like so many are doing. I have watched a lot of his games and I see the “potential” but I don’t see him there yet. I can think of a handful of other cats that I would rather have than Bynum and Camby is one of them. I would even take Bogut.

    Bynum is overhyped!

  • Ian

    kudabeen comon 99 camby is no argument with bynum

    i think (sorry yankee fans) that bynum is the new jeter of basketball if he played for the kings no one would know him people started noticing him because of the kobe trade his ass video , imagine jeter in kansas city same shit.

  • ¢

    camby plays better d and way more athletic than bynum. bynum will develope some better traits as time goes on though, hes only like 20 right?

  • Celts Fan

    Camby right now WITHOUT QUESTION, but obviously, if you say Bynum where he will be vs. Camby, it’d be him. but if you told me I could have a guy for JUST THIS YEAR, it’s Camby easily.

    and to dude saying the Nuggets gave him away so how good could he be, they were literally just trading him to save $$$ (about $10M in salary PLUS ANOTHER $10M in luxury tax, as a fan it stinks, but I get it from the business side of things since they weren’t winning anything anyway!) and to let Nene get his minutes (which has actually worked out alright.)

  • Celts Fan

    @Ian – Derek Jeter is damn good. He’s ripped our hearts out sooooo many times it’s not even funny. The #s aren’t always great (and he doesn’t deserve any of the Gold Gloves, that’s BS) but there’s NO ONE IN ALL OF BASEBALL I’d fear more at the plate with the game on the line (ask the 3 DBacks fans in Arizona.) If they can say that about you, you’re not over-rated.

  • Kudabeen

    People bringing Bynum’s “hype” into this is boarder line hating…

    Who cares about the media…We are talking reality…

    Are we saying that Camby’s whole career guys took shots away from him? Are we saying Camby is tougher in the paint to handle than Bynum? Are we really in this post saying today that Camby is a better match-up against the best centers in the league than Bynum?

    Where is the facts to back it up…Numbers mean very little…Cats always get less numbers on winning teams…Celtic may very well send 4 guys to the All-Star team and stats wise they don’t deserve it…But is you know Basketball you know exactly why 4 Cs get the nod…

    Camby is a career 46% shooter…and he isn’t shooting 3s people…He’s played on ONE team that has gotten out of the 1st round…If his gaudy stats meant so much how can that happen? Dwight leading the league in Blocks and rebounds looks a lot different than Camby’s, but I guess we aren’t look at that. Camby isn’t a proven anything, but help defender and opportunistic rebounder…

    John Thompson would say “tough rebounds” “tough baskets” “Tough Defense” are the measure of a quality big man…Is that Camby or does that sound more like Bynum…

    As Bynum gets the minutes he will be better. He is on a loaded team people…What numbers do you expect to see from him?!?! 20 and 10? 40 and 20? calm down…Camby is a non-contact center. This works to keep him on the court for more than 50 games a year…He is as soft as they come (on the court)…Give me a Bynum who has a chance to intimidate guys from even coming into the lane and attempting shots to be blocked and altered…

    And yes I stand by it…If Bynum was on the Clippers they would be much better and a more competitive team…

    I love the +/- stats because it is probably one of the best indicators of who is making the most winning contributions…Bynum in top 25 Camby not in the top 50…

    Presence vs Perception…

  • jones

    This is not category theory. MC by a wide mile!

  • jones

    Maybe I should clarify…

    If you’re in the West and prefer a D’antoni type of game then perhaps AB offers more as a C. However, if you believe in the philosophy of Popovich and Riley, like I do, then you take MC 99 times out of 100.

  • K Dizzle

    Later haters out in force lol. Sorry I’m late. We did this a few months ago with AB vs Oden and that’s been a blowout, so then Horford had a big game and it was AB or Horford. Readin these posts today, it’s obvious that some dudes are so stuck on the word on the street, they forget to actually watch games. AB is not overrated, he gave a glimpse last season and so now Laker fan or not, more is expected. First of all, just cuz i didn’t see this in any of the 30+ posts, I was watchin the raps game couple nights ago and Marcus Camby was nowhere to be seen. Dude is always hurt, and not a AB come down on a foot and miss games, but just always dinged up. Camby’s defense is overrated. he rebounds and blocks shots, but that’s because he’s a good helpside defender. He rarely ever puts weight on his primary assignment. AB does. He weighs more, he’s stronger and he’s nowhere near his prime. Camby got no more surprises, it’s all goin downhill from here. What you see is what you get, but like Haterade said, when AB gets the ball and pulls out some fancy footwork and finishes with a dunk or a hook, heads either hate it or love it, but you can’t deny it. Lemme know the next time Chandler or Perkins???? pulls a move in the high post or post…
    And to the basketball geniuses sayin Perk over AB, tell me again who Perk got watchin his back when he gets beat, only the DPOY. Hate on KG if you want, but anytime Perkins gets beat, Kg’s there to clean it up. Put AB with KG and it wouldn’t even be a discussion. KG can pass just as well as Gasol so the hi-lo play would be sick plus the defense isn’t even comparable.
    The stupidest argument I hear is “If AB played for (insert random small market team here), nobody would know who he was” Really? Yet the same people would rather have Bogut, Okafor, Biedrins, Chandler, Jefferson…..It’s the nba and it’s 2000- damn near-9. If AB was in Milwaukee or Minny, you would know the name. Stop hatin.
    Personally my team already got AB and I wouldn’t want Camby cuz at multiple points during the season, he’ll be right where he is now, on the bench….in a suit.
    AB vs Oden …AB
    AB vs Horford….AB
    AB vs Camby, Perkins, Chandler, Bogut?….please

  • jones

    AB is better than Oden, but that is only because Oden is yet to mature even a bit. Based on potential alone it should be clear that Oden should be better than both AB and D12.

    You see, I’ve watched enough Laker games this season to know that AB is SOFT. Soft centers aren’t worth much.

  • srb

    Dime, please post more today. I am stuck at work.

    Also to me these are just two decent players, not on the caliber of the previous matchups you’ve had, so who cares who is better.

  • Mr. A

    I can’t believe this is even a question.

    Camby hands down.

    Dude would excel on a contender, and he’s the rare type of player that makes good teams great and great teams phenomenal, all by doing the little things.

    Bynum is an over-hyped Center in a city that’s still secretly smarting over choosing to keep Kobe over Shaq.

    Sure, Kobe puts on a show every night, while Shaq is heading into the twilight of his career, but if you’ve been paying attention at all this season it’s blatantly obvious that Kobe will be entering that stage A LOT sooner than most would have imagined. Meanwhile, Shaq’s already won a post-Lakers championship, while, in my opinion, the Lakersare not good enough to overcome the obstacles in their way the next few seasons (namely, Boston, Cleveland, and San Antonio).

    So, in short, L.A. is still regretting not keeping Shaq, who has won a championship elsewhere while they conceivably won’t win a championship anytime soon, so they are overhyping a completely unproven Center who could conceivably be a bust in this league.

  • jones

    @SF position. LeBron vs Kobe – Who’s better?

    Kobe by a lot.

  • K Dizzle

    “AB is better than Oden, but that is only because Oden is yet to mature even a bit. Based on potential alone it should be clear that Oden should be better than both AB and D12″

    What does this even mean? Oden went to college for a year and AB came outta high school and they’re both 21…
    Gert facts before you post….and I assume by soft, you mean gettin dunked on by Shaq as an 18 yr old and then comin back down and dunkin on the most feared big man in the game…sounds real soft…once again, solid basketball argument

  • Kudabeen

    Also if you are still here Sanpitch…If you haven’t been play ball longer then I’ve been out of diapers you should be ashamed of yourself for analyzing BBall like a fantasy player and not a Ball player…What did the Warriors of 2007 prove? That the Mavs were soft and Dirk was able to be intimidated…Last I checked no fast pace team has one a Chip…

    Camby is great for two things, but Bynum can do everything you need him to do…On a loaded team he is doing what is required…He is coming of the bench. Camby is starting…

    For those who love match up stats…

    November 5th
    Camby 15mins 4 fouls 2pts 1-4fgs 7rebs 4blk
    Kaman 30mins 6 fouls 6pts 3-4fgs 11rebs 1 blk
    vs
    Bynum 33mins 3fouls 9pts 4-9fgs 17rebs 4blks
    For insult to injury
    Gasol gets 11rebs and Odom gets 9rebs

    Clippers are out rebounded by 10…Camby/Kaman have no effect on the game. Yeah Clippers had more shots/possessions, but they mean nothing if you can’t establish an inside presence…

    Padding stats on a poor team…

    You all that go for Camby can be happy being the Geniuses of the Special Ed class…

  • P_Dizzle

    You are going to DISRESPECT 12 1/2 years:
    Defensive MVP
    Led the NBA in blocked shots in 1997-98, 2005-06, 2006-07 and 2007-08
    Voted to the NBA All-Defensive 2nd Team in 2004-05 and 2005-06.
    Named to the NBA All-Defensive 1st Team in 2006-07 and 2007-08
    Set an NCAA tournament record with 43 blocks in 11 games

    with THIS:
    Selected to the NBA Rookie All-Star Game in 2007

    PLEASE!!

  • jones

    KDizzle…it means AB has more NBA experience. That is the only FACT that matters.

    AB is soft. He had the blood rush to his head once against Shaq, but that’s not toughness. Toughness is having the mentality, desire and will to do it all the time.

    See Shaq in his prime going after a rebound or on offense. See Zo going up for a block and you will see what toughness is.

    AB has none of that in him. He’s almost all hype, talk and definitely all SOFT.

    Those are the real FACTS!

  • jones

    ..also don’t get me wrong. AB is a good player, but he doesn’t have that desire to dominate the game either offensively or defensively. In fact, he doesn’t even have the makeup to do that.

    Camby has at least dominated defensively several times and his various individual accolades will attest to this.

    Oden has the build to dominate defensively. Only time will tell if that can materialize, but AB has had time and he’s proven himself to be SOFT.

  • Drink the Haterade (KB24 Chip 09)

    I guess the beauty of the Lakers players is that it brings out All the Haters!

  • Kudabeen

    Shame on you Jones…

    you bring Poppvich and Riley into this discussion where Camby has played defense under George Karl and Mike Dung-leavy… Coack Pop and Riles would have Camby coming off the bench if he was contantly getting worked over by the better front courts in the L…

    If all you do is two things…you should get stats in those areas…Camby doesn’t set good picks and he doesn’t defend the pick and roll well. Camby doesn’t command a double team…Camby doesn’t rebound in traffic…Camby rarely gets strong-side blocks, because he is to busy getting off the ground running back to defend his man after getting bumped on the other side of the rim…

    I’m not even a Bynum fan, so I’m done…

    I tried to drop knowledge in a Special Ed class, but no one really got it…imagine that…

    Professor Out!

  • jones

    …Or perhaps to fanatics of a ball club, reality is hatred.

    Kobe + AB = playoff failure due to softness.
    Kobe + MC = toughness to overcome Celtics.

  • jones

    Kudabeen…you may be right in saying that Camby may come off the bench for both Pop and Riles, but so will AB and AB will be third after Camby. He’s just too soft. I believe that was the point…a comparison of the two players, right?

  • Drink the Haterade (KB24 Chip 09)

    Just a question but who is Camby going to guard? He can’t guard Garnett and he’s not strong enough to guard Perk.

  • Kudabeen

    Jones:

    Is the D12 your talking about Dwight Howard??

    Oden “potentially” is going to be better than Dwight…Word??

    Special Ed indeed…

    Please stop using words like Desire, Tough, and such when describing Camby…There wasn’t a sever disease or illness that he was suffering from all those years he has missed…

    Camby’s success came in direct corellation to him joining horrible teams that had no concept of defense…

    Mentality should be as a Big…I get the rebound or my team

    Camby’s mentality…I get the rebound or the other team does…

  • Nora

    Camby and it is not close. Bynum has yet to do anything that sign ificant really.

  • Nora

    Drink, Bynum can’t gaurd either of them either.

  • Drink the Haterade (KB24 Chip 09)

    AB can guard Perk!

  • jones

    Kudabeen…I probably overstretched my Oden “potential” a bit… :)

    However the words Mentality, Desire and Tough weren’t used to describe Camby. Careful reading on your part will obviate my needing to point this out.

    Anyways, let us all wait for Lakers-Celts match up and get back to the discussion of AB’s softness.

    Merry Christmas. Out.

  • K Dizzle

    @ post 49 Who’s better RIGHT NOW?
    College awards? c’mon, playa, everybody knows the rules on this now. A center for your team right now otherwise I’d take Camby from 2000-2007 instead of AB right now…

    @ post 59 AB can’t guard Bynum? Really? Where did you get this info cuz I’ve never even seen them play…Please post the numbers from that game…

    @ Jones, you instantly lost credibility when you compared Oden and Bynum to Dwight Howard

    you call Bynum soft like you played him before and worked him and keep talkin “builds” like dude isn’t 7 ft, 285 just like Oden. opinions are good but throwin out some facts would help your argument…

  • Kudabeen

    I’m out, but I have to say I’m not hating on Camby…

    Camby is a quality Big, but we can’t stare at stats and declare him to be this beast.

    His numbers scream Dwight, Mourning, Dikembe, Garnett, but he has no post presence…no offense. His offense peaked his rookie year for a lottery team…Iverson Jammed on his neck…That is not respectful…

  • jones
  • Ross

    Healthy Camby

  • RonnaBonBon

    dime,
    should have saved bynum after christmas
    so EVERYONE could see how he plays in a big game
    a chandler and camby argument would be closer

  • http://www.myspace.com/beenobrown BROGDEN

    As of today, if I we was on the blacktop and I was a captain. I’ma pick Camby, the shot-alterator (that works, right?) ‘Cause when we’re going up n down the court you be can’t be winded man! At the end? With the game on the line?? You giving up freebies inside? You panting? You couldn’t get that rebound? Hellooooooo, we’re all down here. It’s 4 on 5. Come onnnn. DAMN! I knew I shoulda picked Camby.

    Granted Bynum can be a great big one day, surpassing even Camby.

  • vinny

    man i’m sorry i just read this,but what camby are u guys talking about-someone said not the camby in 98-he would be better than Andrew.-Not true!! Man he was always getting hurt!! thats why the knicks traded his ass- he doesnt provide a post presence!! PRESENCE-Bynum at 21 has more post presence then him. And @BROGDEN-on the blacktop Andrew would destory camby and his soft ass!!

  • http://www.nba.com Jay

    This is perhaps the most ridiculous “Who’s Better” feature you guys have put out. Bynum is probably one of the most overrated guys in the league. The guy hasn’t done ANYTHING but string together a dozen or so good games and half of LA is about ready to hand him the keys to the franchise.

  • JCARR “K1N6″

    CAMBY!!!!!!… DPOY!!!

    Bynum aint nothing yet…

  • http://www.alltexasforums.com rangerjohn

    lmao dime must have been board today cause this is a NC camby.

  • Skywalker

    right now not even close – Cambyman easily

    having Bynum back was supposed to make LA unbeatable but that hasn’t been the case. winning tomorrow against BOS would be a huge step tho.

    since Camby started playing C with no Kaman the Clips have been a far better team than the one that started the season. should have been the starting C from the start instead of PF.

  • jerod

    Camby is by far better right now.

    Bynum is an underachieving kid that got way overpaid by a franchise that is deseperate to find a Shaq replacement. Face it, if the dude is still inconsistant in his 4th yr, still gets 5 fouls in 11 mins & finishes with 3 pts, how good of a player can he really be? Bynum even has a 1 on 1 tutor named Kareem. He gets to know all the moves and tricks direct while other young players have to figure it out themselves. How many players are there that gets a $14.5 mil/yr extension averaging below 10 pts or 10 rebs in career and in the season (at the point they gave him the extension).