Should the Suns Run the Triangle?
The DieselIf you’re Mark Cuban and your offense is struggling, you pick up the phone and play “make a deal.” If you’re Donnie Walsh and your offense isn’t playing up to par, you trade away your best players.
Ben from Ben’s Suns Blog wants Steve Kerr and Terry Porter, whose offense hasn’t lived up its full potential, to consider implementing the Triangle Offense.
The triangle offense is predicated on the notion that a team has athletic players that can create mismatches for the other team. Much of the offense stems from a high post pick and/or cut. How does that help the Suns? With much of the defense on the perimeter, this will isolate players in the post. Shaq and Amare can then go to work 1 on 1 against hopefully a mismatch and can create fouls.
Shaq is still dominant but not quite as he used to be – thus, mismatches will help him. If there is a rush to double team, the rest of the Suns players will be strategically stationed around the perimeter for Shaq and Amare to dump off to. Both Amare and Shaq are excellent passers and with people cutting to the hoop, this will also create fouls and easy points. Amare will also be used more in the post with this offense and we can run this late in games when we want to draw some fouls.
Ben outlines about 15 other reasons to implement the triangle on top of this, all of which make sense.
But the interesting point about the triangle is not why the Suns should run it, but why don’t they already? In fact, why don’t more teams in the League do so? It makes a ton of sense, whether you have a dominant big (re: Shaq ’99-03) or a mediocre big (re: Luc Longley, Bill Cartwright).
There are certain squads who have developed personnel around a different vision. The Knicks, Magic, Raptors, Warriors are some teams that come to mind. But why wouldn’t a team like Milwaukee try the triangle? Andrew Bogut seems like he could figure out how to pass out of frequent double-teams. Maybe the Thunder aren’t well-suited because they don’t really have any big with basketball acumen, but I feel like they’re in the minority in that regard.
Should the Suns – and more teams in general – run the triangle offense?
Source: Ben’s Suns Blog
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January 28th, 2009 at 4:03 pm
izzy says:
Uhm no! The Triangle is the F@#ing triangle. Its not that easy to master. The reason it works for Phil is that he has had a great (or three) great one on one players when the triangle breaks down. And it certainly broke down many a time, but when u have MJ and Kobe to be the backup play, it works like a charm. The triangle demands precision and movement off the ball. The big man is a great initiator out of the double team, but he often isnt the beneficiary of it. So where does that leave the Suns big men? Oh yeah… amare bitching and whining about how no one fears him!
The suns point guard is also at his best when the ball is in his hand creating opportunites with his mixture of unorthodox shots and creative passing. The triangle wouldnt really maximize Nash’s talents.
January 28th, 2009 at 4:06 pm
karizmatic says:
The Suns have the personnel to run the triangle but they probably shouldn’t do it. The triangle is based on a lot of timing and precision. I doubt that Amare Stoudamire has the discipline or the inclination to really pick up the triangle. In fact, the only people on the Suns I could see picking up the triangle quickly, much less being halfway inclined to run it is Nash and Grant Hill. This is also the reason why most teams don’t run the triangle, it’s not an easy system to incorporate. Doug Collins ran it in Detroit with Grant Hill coincidentally and had some modicum of success, but it’s really a system that requires a lot of players with high basketball IQ and the discipline to run the system.
January 28th, 2009 at 4:09 pm
karizmatic says:
Izzy makes some good points as well. I would like to say as an aside though the Triangle would create a lot of space for Amare to do his thing out of the high post, but then at that point Amare would actually be short circuiting the triangle as opposed to running it.
January 28th, 2009 at 4:11 pm
CLUTCH says:
no the triangle is based upon uselfish and intelligent play, the suns have smart enough players for it, but they also have a couple of extremely selfish players (shack Amare) so its just going to collapse even farther.
Milwake and some other teams would be a good idea though
January 28th, 2009 at 4:14 pm
Kudabeen says:
Wouldn’t that kill Nash’s game a bit?
They also wouldn’t have Tex Winters there making adjustments to the talent. Suns need to focus Heart more than the Triangle offense…
No way you have Shaq and Amare down low and you are giving up layups and getting out rebounded. That’s pretty bad…
January 28th, 2009 at 4:37 pm
Drink the Haterade (KB24 Chip 09) says:
The triangle requires a high bball IQ, its the reason Phil has not let go of Luke Walton… Also as Kubadeen points out, they don’t have Tex Winters who invented the offense… Not to mention, PJ and the coaching staff usually spend all summer teaching it.
January 28th, 2009 at 4:45 pm
control says:
The Triangle would be perfect for Clev if Mike Brown weren’t such an idiot. Big Z is a pretty solid passer and is big enough to pass out of any double teams. LeBron can just bull his way into the lane on any broken plays and Mo “Jesus Dog” is a pretty decent complement.
Anderson Valjero would have to be traded or something, but that would only improve the Cavs because he’s garbage.
January 28th, 2009 at 4:46 pm
karizmatic says:
On second thought though I think the triangle might actually lengthen Nash’s career. Think 2 years from now after he loses the rest of his quickness. He could be a good fit for the triangle, something like what Fisher does now with better handles.
January 28th, 2009 at 4:51 pm
AB_40 says:
It is a very hard offense to understand. that’s why it takes years to get it right. it isn’t like a flex or a reversse flex basic motion those type of things. It’s an offence with very little picks and a lot of player motion. you have to understand angles, nuances of defences and a whole lot of other stuff which I don’t want to get into because I ain’t no coach.
what I’m saying is
the triange offence is hard to learn especialy mid season with very limited practice time.
January 28th, 2009 at 5:04 pm
Ben York says:
Hey Guys,
The Suns don’t have to run Tex Winter’s version of the Triangle – as I stated in my post, that’s not the only version. There are hundreds, if not thousands, of variations that are simpler to run and can isolate Shaq/Amare (providing he’s still here).
Again, this will never happen but I think it would help our turnover issue.
January 28th, 2009 at 5:25 pm
SagJism says:
hey Clutch, didnt Shaq win 3 rings in the triangle? What are you talking about?
January 28th, 2009 at 5:46 pm
karizmatic says:
The Triangle could work for a team like the Cavs…particularly if Hickson were to develop into a more serviceable player. Even with Varejao it could work. It’s disappointing the Cavs have no offense whatsoever Even if they just stationed Lebron at the high post more the would be better off.
January 28th, 2009 at 7:01 pm
doc (i like kobe AND bron) says:
I heard it takes 2 years to learn.They dont have that kind of time.In May San An will be getting them the fuck outta here if they run the damn triangle, circle, or square offense.
January 28th, 2009 at 7:12 pm
Tex Winters says:
Go Ahead and try to run the offense . . . then I’ll get 4 more rings to complete the set!
January 28th, 2009 at 7:13 pm
the cynic says:
@ Doc
Pau picked up the triangle in less then a month; it just takes tunnel vision players like Amare 2 years to learn the triangle
January 28th, 2009 at 7:33 pm
added says:
bogut and the bucks should definitely run it….
January 28th, 2009 at 7:45 pm
Big Shot BOB says:
Nah when you have Steve frickin Nash on the team you definitely don’t use an offense that doesn’t require a true point guard. It would limit his skills. I say they run something similar to what Pat Riley ran in Miami old skool inside out basketball. Or run that Jerry Sloan offense. The Suns are best when Nash and Amare are running the pick and roll so I say in the mold of Stockton and Malone run it until you can’t no more.
January 28th, 2009 at 9:24 pm
Joaquin says:
no need to use the triangle, the suns need to defend their asses off the court!
January 29th, 2009 at 2:15 am
Bron42 aka Haters drink my bath water says:
steve nash’s skills have already hit the fan so might as well. his stats are droppin now that hes actually asked to do stuff in a real offense. no more 7 seconds or less and he looks human again…top 10 all time pg my ass
January 29th, 2009 at 4:50 pm
jerod says:
Shaq is a good player, but Steve Kerr doesn’t know what he’s doing. Mike D was a good coach, its stupid to fire him and bring in a rookie head coach.