Jass should have won that game!

Carmelo can be counted on when he needs to, Joe can’t.
It’ll be interesting what sort of money he gets this offseason…..hmmm

@lord pancake….so you’re saying that melo is on the same level as kobe, lebron etc. or that joe johnson is level No. 3 and Melo is level No. 2. with kobe, lebron and duncan sitting at level No. 1…’cause that is what i think.

@hballer32

I know Duncan’s declining but you really think Dwight who after all those years still has NOT A SINGLE post move is better than Tim Duncan?

WOW!

What,did Wade get suspended?

@ 9
what are you talkin about?

nice/appropriate title for smack and the paul/deron match-up

@hballer32 — everyone’s entitled to an opinion pimpin.
So I’m not gonna criticize your list although I disagree with some placements.

But remember, what makes an elite player is more than just numbers.

Joe is not elite. I think we all knew that when Atlanta OVER-paid him and the Suns FAIR-MARKET VALUED him.

Joe is very, very good though. And his sub-eliteness is only magnified because Marvin Williams isn’t panning out to be the OFFENSIVE threat we all thought he could be.

He was supposed to be the number 2 scorer on the squad, at least gettin’ 20 points a night.

We knew Josh had hops comin’ out of high school, and we knew he’d smack alot of balls out of the sky. We knew that much. Any offense that he ended up providing would be like icing on the cake. Then he won the dunk contest. Instant league-wide recognition.

But Marvin was brought in, drafted actually, because of his potential to be an offensive dynamo.

Hasn’t happened, he’s just an average or slightly above average wing.

Now Atlanta’s top two scorers happened to be their 1st and 2nd 2-guards…really not a good situation in the long run.

Think of it like this, if Marvin was ballin’ out, we wouldn’t really be concerned when Joe was off his game or didn’t show up. I know for a fact ATL execs was thinkin’ a lesser, very lesser version of Scottie and Mike but they aint gettin it.

Amen QQ,
Durant is most certainly on at least the same level as Carmelo or Dirk and his numbers are actually pretty comparable to Lebrons or Wade’s (his assists are quite a bit lower but his percentages are actually better than Wade’s). If he was playing in anywhere other than Oklahoma City he’d be considered a super-star in anyone’s book.

Some of you guys r crazzzzy… Elite: Duncan, Wade,Kobe,lebron,Dwight,cp3, melo. These are the franchise changing guys who you build around and can eventually take over the game by themselves.

Superstars: Nash, Deron, kg, Dirk, bradon Roy, kd, (kg is borderline elite since his stats only drop since he’s not the focal point. The rest are nice players but kinda one dimensional (Dirk, kd) or just havnt been doing it long enough or on the big stage.

Sub superstars: bosh, rose, Joe Johnson, hedo,iggy, Gerald Wallace, boozer, etcc. These are the pippens. Nice guys who can propably keep a team afloat for a while but not ready to be “the man” but you put them in the gasol number 2 role where teams can’t just focus on them and they will thrive. Kinda like rasheed when he became a piston.

Now I missed some cuz I’m not goin through the whole roster but you get the idea.

“These are the pippens. Nice guys who can propably keep a team afloat for a while but not ready to be “the man” but you put them in the gasol number 2 role where teams can’t just focus on them and they will thrive. Kinda like rasheed when he became a piston.”

Like Pippen?WTF Pippen by himself…without Jordan there in 94-95(most of 95 at least) was putting in MVP work. MVP!!! Go check the stats and the # of wins (50+) the bulls had that 94′ season. 20+pts, 8reb, 5asst, nearly 3 stls, good FG/3pt%, the primary ballhandler and best defender on a team that would have been in the lottery had he not been there.(Ho. Grant, BJ Armstrong, Toni Kukoc, Pete Myers, Steve Kerr, Will Perdue, and a host of other back-ups) yest they won 50 games and almost knocked the Eastern Conference champs (NY Knicks) out of the playoffs had it not been for a phantom foul on that Hubert Davis/Pippen play.
Just because he got pissed the one time Phil didn’t go to him at the end of a game, doesn’t mean he was a “Sub superstar”. If you actually watched him play, he was damn near the best player in the L and was EASILY the best ALL-AROUND player in the league that year. No one will ever say that about the Sub-superstars you have listed.
Sure he looked good next to MJ, but he stood alone for an entire season and a half. Once MJ came back, Scottie battle foot, knee, and back problems from 1996 til the end of his career that robbed him of some of his speed and quickness. Notice how when he was in houston and portland you never see highlights of him dunking on people. Check the 94 or 95 season… Patrick Ewing will let you know his knee was just fine.

Also, Rasheed Wallace scoring 14ppg is not him “being able to flourish”. He actually held his game back when he came to detroit and he only declined during his time there. He focused more on defense because he’s a team player and thats what they asked him to do. Had he actually took over the team like he should have and been agressive in the post, he would have had 1 or 2 more chips in Detroit.

can the blazers fans stop crying? and can they stop acting like they’re oh so resilient winning with all of their injuries? god.

two words: houston rockets.

love for the rockets

im too lazy to come up with these lists, but i dont see how you can’t put nash on the elite class.. take away the robert horry hip check and he’ll have a chip and no one would even second guess it.
and i hate the suns.

another random thought, if you put joe johnson or bosh on the third tier, then you have to put granger there too right?

And people need to stop with the Nash excuses… You don’t see people goin ” o if horry didn’t hit that shot webber would have a chip” etc.. Point is one foul by horry and flop by Nash doesn’t make a series plus that was one year. Dude has never been to the finals his whole career. So to say if that one play didn’t happen he would have a chip is premature like his team would of just walked away easy other then that. He’s always been a exciting player and a GREAT floor leader but never one to carry a team alone which is why no one barely knew his name as a masv and he stunk when porter tried to make him play defense outside of d’antonis system. And no granger isn’t there yet. Johnson does more and his team improved.

right now cp3 is more of a game changer than nash a) because he actually plays defense while nash can’t guard half the dime staff memebers b)hes more of a basketball icon at this point (yes it count, which is why lebron is who he is without winning a ring), C)both of them have the ability to take over games that nash really doesnt for the most part. nash takin over the game is him running down and pulling 3s. D) both of them took crap ass teams and built them up….nash has been surrounded by allstars his whole career and has been to what, one conference final? he hasnt even been to a final, so thats the hump i’m talking about. E) since people keep doin the what if…if you put either cp3 or melo in nash’s system, their numbers would double. Cp3 already puts up better numbers with a bunch of bums and 7 seconds or less just pumps peoples stats. Hell look at how suddenly david lee is a allstar level stat guy when you put up a million shots and rebounds. Nash is like the kurt warner of the nba. people let a few good years with the suns, where he still never went to the finals, and wanna call him a top 5 pg all time.