Defining Kobe Bryant’s place in Lakers history
Two things stood out to me when Jerry West was being interviewed on NBA TV last night. Fielding questions about Kobe Bryant, whom earlier in the evening had passed West as the L.A. Lakers’ all-time leading scorer, Mr. Clutch admitted, “I don’t have contact with [Kobe] anymore,” in a spot where guys will usually at least fake it and say, “We talk every now and then.”
The other time was when West said Kobe will ultimately go down in history as the greatest Laker of all-time — even if a lot of L.A. fans are “mad or disappointed” to hear that.
Therein lies the most complicated part of Kobe’s enduring legacy. As great as he is on the court, there are still a lot of people — some of them Lakers fans — who just don’t like Kobe. And no matter how many points he scores and championships he wins, they’d prefer a reality where Kobe sits a notch below the likes of Magic, Kareem, Jerry and Elgin.
But personal feelings aside, where does Kobe stand? Similar to Paul Pierce in Boston and Dirk Nowitzki in Dallas, Kobe benefits from having played his entire career with the Lakers, giving him greater opportunity to infiltrate the franchise’s record book, as compared to guys like Kareem or Shaq who spent time with other teams. Kobe also got started younger than the rest as a straight-from-high school guy, buying him even more time to pile up stats.
That said, the numbers certainly present a strong case for Kobe. He ranks No. 1 in total points and fourth in scoring average (25.3 ppg) among Lakers, third in field goals made, first in threes made, and second in free throws made. Kobe is third in total assists and 10th in rebounds, second in steals and seventh in blocks. He’s got four championships with the purple and gold (one less than Magic and Kareem) and one MVP.
But with Magic, Kareem, West, Baylor, Shaq, Wilt, George Mikan and Gail Goodrich, the competition is stiff.
Where does Kobe rank among the all-time great Lakers?
February 2nd, 2010 at 9:34 am
the_don_mega says:
tough question… i think it boils down to a choice between Magic or Kobe…
February 2nd, 2010 at 9:37 am
clay says:
magic, Kareem, Kobe, West, Wilt, Shaq, Baylor, Adam Morrison
February 2nd, 2010 at 9:41 am
Trey bing bay says:
It’s always hard comparing the greats of now to the greats of yesterday. Today’s game in my opinion is a lot tougher. So I’m going to have to go with Kobe as the greatest Laker. Love him or hate him you can’t deny what he’s done for LA and the success he’s had as an individual and the success of the team.
February 2nd, 2010 at 9:49 am
Big V says:
Magic, son. Magic.
February 2nd, 2010 at 9:49 am
Tbest says:
Depends on how many ‘chips he ends up with. If he gets more than Magic he is the best.
February 2nd, 2010 at 9:53 am
Prof. TX says:
I’d put Kareem, Magic, and Wilt ahead of Kobe.
February 2nd, 2010 at 9:56 am
AdvancedMind says:
LMAO
Magic Johnson is hands down the greatest Laker of all time, to me its not even an arguement. Magic battled in a era of basketball that was second to none, against a Celtics team that was second to none.. He could play all 5 postions on the court and always got everybody involved on the court. He basically made Worthy a H.O.F. Im not one for STATS because in certain cases numbers do lie, but Magic put up insane numbers. Second or third greatest basketball player of all time.
Waits for the angry taint riding Kobe fans to respond.
February 2nd, 2010 at 9:58 am
AdvancedMind says:
And yes this era of basketball is extremely watered down… Call it the “You cant touch anybody” era.
February 2nd, 2010 at 9:58 am
QQ says:
1. Magic
2. Jerry West
3. Elgin Baylor
4. Kobe
5. Kareem
February 2nd, 2010 at 10:04 am
DarthSickness says:
qq got it pretty much right. Kobe’s a great but not greater than those other four…..plus he’s a dick.
February 2nd, 2010 at 10:05 am
Heckler says:
depends on how much longer Kobe plays at what more he’s able to achieve.
Magic and Kareem had more MVPs. Magic even has a gold medal too.
Kobe could actually play up to six more seasons. And by that time, he’ll end up as a top-5 scorer on the all-time list. if he plays more than 3yrs, you could challenge (doubtful, but possible) Kareem’s all-time points total.
As of now, he’s still behind Kareem and def behind Magic.
February 2nd, 2010 at 10:06 am
Heckler says:
wow. my comment was all jacked up in #11….
DISREGARD….
February 2nd, 2010 at 10:09 am
Jah says:
1. Magic
2. Kobe
3. Kareem
4. Jerry
5. Shaq
February 2nd, 2010 at 10:13 am
adam morrison says:
dont forget about adam morrison
February 2nd, 2010 at 10:16 am
Chicagorilla says:
how many MVP’s? one…. hmmm, how many did Magic and Kareem have? um hmmm.
funny thing is, people are arguing is Kobe the greatest Laker, then turn around and have the nerve to ask is Kobe better than MJ. lol, it’s all about perspective i guess.
February 2nd, 2010 at 10:18 am
rlf says:
Austin Burton,
Jerry has ALWAYS said that he doesn’t speak to Kobe, because, he doesn’t think it’s “right” for him and Kobe to speak.
I’m sure he made sure to say that when you heard it. But don’t bring it up, just to be more dramatic. But what else is new with your magazine and its “writers”
Have you seen how Jerry talks about Kobe or Kobe about Jerry? Have you seen when they see each other, the love they show each other?
I just hope that people are smarter than the crap you guys write.
February 2nd, 2010 at 10:19 am
Rizwan says:
I didnt watch the game or anything because it was before my time but just hearing what Magic did in the finals game when he played at center was amazing. Thats the thing, 90% of the people who post on here didnt watch any of Magic’s performances but still say he is the best. I think I would only say that if I watched him play but I didnt.
I love that Magic could play all five positions without it having any effect on his game.
However, Kobe’s instinct and desire makes him sit very high on that list. I am a Suns fan yet still I love watching Kobe play. His desire to be the best separates him from anyone else. I heard the Sports Guy and J A Adande talking about it, and how LeBron wouldnt care about his numbers but more about his team. Thats great, but what if his team sucks? I would rather a player so desperate to win rather than a player who is the best teamamte. Eventually, the player who is desperate to win will drag his teammates up with him but I dont know if the best teammate will do that in the same way. Sure they would fight for him but what if he isnt fighting himself?
I want to see players with that ambition and as good as LeBron is, he will never have that ambition I think.
Sorry for going off topic but I would rank Kobe as in the top 2 but cant place at 1 because I wouldnt want to disparage Magic in any way. But gun to my head, I would take Kobe.
Also, sports guy said he’d take Dirk over Kobe for the last shot! Come on! I’m a big Dirk fan but no!
February 2nd, 2010 at 10:24 am
SJ says:
It is tough to compare players of different eras. Magic’s basketball IQ was unbelievable, and as AdvancedMind points out he could play all five positions. However I have to agree with Trey bing bay that today’s game is tougher. The NBA is much bigger and more popular. The youth development is much broader, and now many countries around the world have been developing talented players. More than 20% of the NBA is now foreign. So I have to go with Kobe – he is dominating a bigger, broader and stronger NBA.
February 2nd, 2010 at 10:28 am
ERIC says:
Honestly, its BS to keep calling Kobe a dick. All of the uber-competitive, type A superstars are dbags.
The difference is today, in the age of 24/7 coverage, blogs, NBATV, Real NBA, Mic’d up, Twitter, digital video cameras, there is more “inside access” to the real players.
Everyone idolized Jordan, then when he spoke out during his HOF speech, every said, wow, what a F’n bastard.
I’m sure all the great players were dicks in some way, its just that Kobe’s attitude is more in the spotlight bc of the media exposure of today.
February 2nd, 2010 at 10:36 am
creamio says:
Magic, Kareem, Shaq, Kobe…
Kobe has 4 rings to Shaq’s 3; but Shaq’s 3 are more impressive than Kobe’s 4 because he was the lead dog without question and got 3 finals mvps. He was also way more dominant than Kobe has ever been during those 3 years.
Kobe only has 1 ring as lead dog, and 1 finals MVP.
February 2nd, 2010 at 10:36 am
Trey bing bay says:
81…..I’m just saying
February 2nd, 2010 at 10:39 am
bsteezy3 says:
When his career is over, Kobe will probably be #1. That’s why it’s so hard to define his position now–he’s still playing! Wait til it’s all done…
February 2nd, 2010 at 10:47 am
ShowKase says:
He’s 6 freakin’ 9 AND played point guard! No one in the league now can do what Magic did, skill wise (including the Prince of Akron). Magic is the GREATEST LAKER OF ALL-TIME! Not only could he play every position and excel at all of them, he was also a great leader, played against a myriad of hall of famers, including the Celtic Dynasty, and he was an all-around fan favorite. Kobe is great, I respect his game and accomplishments, but he is glass ceiling as the greatest Laker is number 2.
February 2nd, 2010 at 11:02 am
Heckler says:
Magic Johnson played in…(get this)…9 NBA finals! Let me type that again so you all can read that again. NINE!
I dont care what anyone says, that is a damn DYNASTY. NINE finals appearances (won 5) in 13yrs!!!
..and made everyone around him (including coaches) better in the process. and had HIV not shortened his career; who knows…
February 2nd, 2010 at 11:05 am
Kermit The Washington says:
LOL…the only thing I gotta say is this, and I hope cats really take this to heart…
All those accomplishments from Magic, Kareem, etc…all the numbers you guys are posting on here, are numbers from the END OF THOSE GUYS’ CAREERS. The END.
Kobe Bryant is at or near the TOP of ALL THOSE CATEGORIES, and he’s only SLIGHTLY past the MIDDLE of his career. Think about it. He just turned 31, and he’s reaching the numbers them cats weren’t hitting until their late 30s early 40s. Does that make Kobe the greatest ever? Not yet. But unlike the others on the list, HE’S STILL PLAYING BALL FOR ANOTHER 5+ YEARS. Goodbye.
February 2nd, 2010 at 11:08 am
Tbest says:
Kobe’s been in 6 finals in the past ten years and has a real chance at playing in nine as well. This argument is pointless until his career is over. Is he the greatest laker? No. Will he be? It’s possible. It’s like people asking if Peyton Manning is the greatest QB of all time. Probably not right now, but could he be by the end of his career? absolutely.
If somehow Kobe ends up with 7 titles and 4 finals MVP’s are you really gonna say he’s not the greatest laker of all-time? I’m not saying it’s gonna happen, but with the team the Lakers have they will be competitive for the title for the next 5 years.
February 2nd, 2010 at 11:12 am
ProphetGK says:
Magic first, no doubt, after that argue all you want…
February 2nd, 2010 at 11:22 am
Chaos says:
1. Magic
2. Kareem
3. Kobe
4. Jerry West
5. Baylor
i dont wanna include shaq just like we cant include wilt in the conversation because hes played for 4 other teams and with kobe couldnt have one a championship. kareem played the majority of his career with the lakers so he is included.
Kobe like magic has cone some incredible things skill wise that we are all in awe about and will continue to be in awe about (81, nuff said). he has 4 rings, a gold medal, an mvp trophy, finals mvp, all star mvps and is a 12 time all star if im not mistaken. dude is in the top three easy as a laker and will eventually be number 1. i am not even a kobe fan like talkin about but i know greatness when i see it. if he piles on more accolades then he will be number 1
February 2nd, 2010 at 11:25 am
John says:
What Kobe did ?
1 Chip
1 MVP
6 or 7 great games
Thats it.
The rest is 10 plus seasons shotting 43% from the field playing with the MDE in the touching foul era ,,, ergh ,,,
Magic all day, that is not even a question.
February 2nd, 2010 at 11:29 am
Kermit The Washington says:
@ 25,000 points in only 6 or 7 great games? That’s awesome.
February 2nd, 2010 at 11:29 am
life-p says:
Impossible question to answer at this stage in his career. That’s like comparing D Wade to Alonzo Mourning. Let the man finish his career before you evaulate him against history.
February 2nd, 2010 at 11:31 am
LakeShow84 says:
How can we define this when hes only 30 and got WAY MORE TO GO??
But i will say if the man gets us 2-3 more rings there wont be any hating..
February 2nd, 2010 at 11:32 am
LakeShow84 says:
John is the perfect example of talking out of your ass..
February 2nd, 2010 at 11:36 am
karizmatic says:
Magic
Kobe
Kareem
West
Shaq
Wilt
Baylor
February 2nd, 2010 at 11:39 am
GABRIEL BROGDEN says:
I personally believe Magic is the greatest Laker of all time. Followed by West. ‘Tween Elgin, Kareem and Shaq, it’s a toughie. But I think Kobe will go down hands down with the crown.
Some people dislike Kobe so they discount his place in Laker’s history and in the game of ball. Some of his personality quirks and behaviors may be the reasons.
The reasons are:
1.MJ imitator.
2.Rapist (to a lesser extent, Dry Snitch)
3.Gunner (to a larger extent, Anti-Team Player)
4.Cocky A** M****F*** or Arrogant Behind Motherlover
And that’s why you get the complications!
Like anyone who happens to be a human…you’ll go through ups n downs, ’cause the ups n downs of a human being is collectively called “life.” However his life has always been under the magnifying glass (ie He went to the prom with Brandy) So we’ve seen the good, bad (remember he thought he was a rapper?), ugly (threw young Bynum under the bus) and indifferent (wholeheartedly acted as if he didn’t hear the whole city of Philadelphia BOO his a** at AllStar weekend). And like someone said, we are privy to ‘inside access’ like never before due to an extensive presence of media outlets.
Take a teenager who is an extremely good basketball player. Take this teen and help him polish his skills and reach his potential. Then follow the teen’s talent to success. That’s how you get a Kobe, who probably will go down as the GREATEST L.O.A.T.
He’ll go down as number 1 after all the stats are added up ’cause Numbers Don’t Lie.
Kobe is the ultimate company dude. He started extra early – probably had only 3 pubes – and continuously builds on his performances day in and day out, year in and year out. With that formula, you know he’s gettin’ the number 1 spot.
February 2nd, 2010 at 11:47 am
Ian says:
magic is one no debatable imo
kareem 2
kobe 3
west wasnt as clutch as people make him out to be how many finals did he lose?
wilt and shaq are better than kobe but since they played for every team in the league i cant put them ahead of mr bryant for laker supremacy.
February 2nd, 2010 at 11:51 am
Ian says:
tbest
yes hes been on 6 fiaals the past 10 years but guess how many laker greats had three straight years of first round exits and missed playoffs??? or that kobe was the second best player on the first three trips or that kobe is 1-2 in the finals as the man?? that has to count also. the man is great and is a top three laker right now but everything has been awesomeness he can still be 2nd imo 1st place will be kinda hard to get doable for him but still.
February 2nd, 2010 at 12:12 pm
Patrick Cassidy says:
It’s easy to automatically put the greats like Magic, West and others ahead of Kobe, but you really have to give Kobe a long look for being the best Laker ever. I’m not saying that it’s clear cut by any stretch, but his ability to dominate both sides of the ball is something that Magic definitely couldn’t do…
February 2nd, 2010 at 12:27 pm
Nancy says:
1) I LOVE KB! 2) Magic #1 Laker 3) KB has been unbelievable during season/western playoffs but when all the marbles are on the table, i.e. Championship, Magic has done what KB hasn’t (yet). In Philly, as a rookie playing center in place of a hurt Kareem scoring 42/16 winning the series. Going into the lions den (heated Boston garden) beating the best frontline assembled & 1 of the most competitive guys (bird) ever with a baby skyhook. Not that i don’t think KB can’t do the same, but until he does Magic remains #1.
February 2nd, 2010 at 12:32 pm
Me says:
i don’t consider shaq a laker. never have.
I don’t care for the lakers, but the number one laker has to be Magic. if there were no magic, the lakers would just be another team. like jordan with the bulls. olajuwon with the rockets. drexler with the blazers. when you think of the franchise in a historical sense, these are people you think of even when you’re not trying to think of any person.
After that, i’m more impressed with west than kobe. I mean, the logo? the only finals MVP from a losing team? Imagine what someone has to do to the be finals mvp when they didn’t even win.
For some reason I don’t really consider kareem a laker either, even though i feel he is moreso than shaq, i just don’t think he qualifies for some reason.
February 2nd, 2010 at 12:35 pm
Celts Fan says:
@Ian – exactly how I feel.
The ratings (counting only their years in yellow and purple)
1. Magic (he only trails MJ in any list to me. Versatility personified… except on D.)
2. Kobe (ugh)
3. Kareem/West
5. I don’t know, let’s go with Eddie Jones…
February 2nd, 2010 at 12:37 pm
Celts Fan says:
instead of screwing around, probably shoulda jsut put Shaq as #5…
February 2nd, 2010 at 12:44 pm
Jay says:
I dont know a single person who is a Laker fan and isn’t sickeningly in love with Kobe…
February 2nd, 2010 at 12:45 pm
LakeShow84 says:
@ Ian
Your not letting those 1st round exits go are you?? Its comedy how you act like we were SUPPOSED to do something in those playoffs.. ESPECIALLY when the West was stacked like it was.. Dude do you realize that was a REBUILDING team?? Tell me what Laker great COULD have done something.. and let me say this NO SUPERSTAR could do any better.. Ill even raise you and say TIM DUNCAN COULDNT HAVE DONE ANY BETTER.. Sub Duncan for Kobe and the Suns still run that ass out the building..
@ Missing the playoffs in 05
once again listen to this.. KOBE MISSED 15+ games when we missed the playoffs that year.. that team was UGLY.. Atkins, Butlers, Odom and F’in Brian Grant?? oh yeah Chris Mihm who never played after us.. and that was our squad?? shit even add Kobe to this and its fugly.. Oh yeah and our Coach quit half way through the year.. but aye Kobe shouldve pulled it together right??
i mean get real people.. get real..
February 2nd, 2010 at 12:53 pm
Jayo says:
1. Magic
2. Jerry West
After that you can argue for Kobe, Wilt, Kareem, & Shaq for spots 3-6. Jerry is the logo. Nuff said. Magic is simply put, one of the 10 greatest players ever. Period. Magic dominated in the best era of NBA basketball ever. Take a look at the names on those All-Star teams from the 80s & 90s. Kobe played in an All-Star game w/ freakin Chris Gatling. That’s the difference in eras. Kobe is great but w/o Shaq what is his legacy? Magic turned those Laker teams from good to great. Kobe has yet to take a good team & make it great. Last time he had a simply good team, ended up begging to be traded from the Lakers. Plus his team lost BY 40 POINTS!!! at home during the Finals. No way that happens to a Magic or a West team.
February 2nd, 2010 at 12:55 pm
BiG ShoT BoB says:
If Kobe wins two more chips before it’s said and done – Best Laker of Alltime…
February 2nd, 2010 at 12:57 pm
Celts Fan says:
@LakeShow – all I’m saying is you guys use that SAME reasoning you just ripped to trash KG. Pick a side
February 2nd, 2010 at 1:04 pm
Tbest says:
@44
And magic played in an all star game with Lonnie Shelton. What’s your point?
February 2nd, 2010 at 1:19 pm
Jayo says:
@ 48
If I’m correct Shelton started for the NBA champions that year. There were 3 Sonics that made the All-Star game that year. Oh he was also on the NBA All-Defensive team in that year. That’s why he was an All-Star! Now explain to me when the hell Gatling was ever an All-Star. I was using him to show the talent discrepancy that Magic & Kobe played against. Take a look at the 1988 All-Rosters & then fast forward 15yrs & look at 2003 All-Star rosters & compare the players.
February 2nd, 2010 at 1:24 pm
Ian says:
celts fan
these laker fans are blind
they trash kg tmac even iverson for doing the same shit kobe did with crap and we are supposed to judge them differently.
yes lakeshow duncan in his prime and 4 chairs can beat the suns gtfoh remember the 03 title how many allstars played with td that season?? you have to go back to 95 to find another team that one with only one allstar. you want us to give kobe all the praise for all the great things kobe has done and i you want to only count the good??? didnt you get my post didnt i rank him third?? how did magic do as a rookie in the finals without his center??? didnt he beat better teams in the finals than the damn magic?? wtf is wrong with you. if you think im the only one go read an article adande wrote about kobe those seasons. hell he quit on his team on the 7th game vs the suns and sucked in the finals vs boston did i mentioned that to take away anything from him? no but you prob have excuses for that also.
PICK A SIDE EITHER KG AND TMAC ARE ON KOBES LEVEL OR LOSING WITH SCRUBS COUNT.
you were one of the people bashing pierce when he made his comments about best player in the world and used his boston 1st round exits and missed playoff as an example but forgot to mention he even had a worst team than kobe and like kobe carried them to the first round. didnt the man take a team with antoine walker to the conference finals?? why didnt you praise that one?? your bias doesnt let you see that kobe on a bad team had done the same as kg , pierce , tmac
February 2nd, 2010 at 1:31 pm
Tbest says:
obviously you figured out i meant 45.
I’m not saying the rosters weren’t better in 88. I’m just saying pointing out someone who made an all star team one random season doesn’t define a person’s legacy or define an era.
79-80 all star: John Drew 19pt, .453fg, 5.9reb, 1.3ast
Gatling’s all star season: 19pt, .525fg, 7.9reb, .6ast
February 2nd, 2010 at 1:41 pm
Derrick says:
81 points thats all i have to say 81 points.
kobe is numero uno!!!!!
February 2nd, 2010 at 1:42 pm
king says:
top two magic then Kobe
February 2nd, 2010 at 1:42 pm
life-p says:
@31 You are so right! Thank you for enlighting us!
February 2nd, 2010 at 1:43 pm
life-p says:
@ 54
You’re right. He hit it right on the head.
February 2nd, 2010 at 1:55 pm
POPPI GEE says:
In realizing that this is all opinion as there can be no clear cut winner for so many reasons.
Kobe is not yet done, different era, positions played and other things would really make it difficult to choose a clear cut greatest player for the Lakers.
Yet personally as of right now I would say Magic. People already know his body of work so no need to go there. Yet as time goes if Kobe can maintain his health and still garner the accolades and achievements then he will no doubt easily be the greatest Laker.
Still because we don’t know what the future holds that can’t be said with 100% surety. If things were to end right now with total bodies of work and accolades and triumphs along with so much else, I have to go with Magic as being the best Laker ever.
February 2nd, 2010 at 2:02 pm
Austin Burton says:
I feel like Shaq isn’t being given enough credit. He was The Man on a three-peat L.A. squad and during his time with L.A., reached his peak as the most dominant player in the game. I’d at least put him above West and Baylor and maybe Kobe.
February 2nd, 2010 at 2:10 pm
Chicagorilla says:
oh i hate to type this…but I agree 100% with Ian….oh i’m sick to my stomach.
Lakeshow, no one is saying Kobe sucks, or Kobe isn’t great. Those argument points you are presenting are for arguing that Kobe is the best in the NBA currently or something to that matter, but those points hold no water when arguing about him as the greatest laker ever. IMO it’s not even close with him and Magic or Kareem. Not yet at least.
As for what he will do in the next 5 yrs… have you guys not been paying attention. Kobe is breaking down. Those aren’t normal injuries. Though he’s only 31, look at the other guys who entered the L at 17-18yrs old… KG(injruy prone now)Class of 95′, T-Mac (injury Prone)Class of 97′, Jermaine O’Neal (broken down for 3yrs now) Class of 96′(or 97′),
Its not about your age, it’s about games played. And Tim Duncan may be the only player who played more games than Kobe since 97′.
IMO Kobe has 2-3 good years left. Hell you guys better hope he stays around after this season. Europe could give him $50mil
February 2nd, 2010 at 2:12 pm
Mike Lopez says:
I am a Laker fan. But I have to go with Magic as the all-time great. Magic could take any team to a championship game. Look at what he did in ‘91. Who was on that team? An older James Worthy, Byron Scott, and a rookie named Vlade. Kobe is great. But he does not make his teammates better. Magic did that. Matter of fact, Magic won the championship without Kareem. Kobe has always needed someone else to help him finish. Last year Gasol was the MVP of the finals. Kobe is great, but Magic is better.
February 2nd, 2010 at 2:13 pm
Chicagorilla says:
@Austin,
I agree about Shaq. Everyone will remember him from his LA days. 3 finals MVPs, Reg MVP, and the greatest force in NBA history (including Wilt/MJ).
February 2nd, 2010 at 2:17 pm
Ian says:
chicagorilla comon it wasnt that bad typing that lol
February 2nd, 2010 at 2:18 pm
Ian says:
austin/chicago
if we add shaq dont we need to toss in wilt also??
magic
jabbar
shaq
wilt
kobe
instead of magic jabbar kobe?
February 2nd, 2010 at 2:20 pm
LakeShow84 says:
@ AB
Fluck Shaq.. i appreciate the rings and the dominance but thats one man i dont regret getting rid of.. Ego was bigger than the man.. which is impossible but he figured it out..
@ Ian
Tmac had Yao Ming and a SLEW of good competent role players in HOUSTON.. i never agreed with everyone jumping on him for Orlando years because Hill was FOREVER injured but the Houston years there were NO EXCUSES, shit the man said it himself.. So listen to that and keep that in mind when referring to Tmac.. He HAD TALENT IN HOUSTON BUT STILL NEVER MADE IT OUT..
@ CeltsFan
KG came out as a basic #1 overrall draft pick and NEVER made it out the first round.. and we talking what 5-8 YEARS of said exits?? And honestly i never bashed him for his years in Minnesota as far as not making it out the first round because they could never get the talent around him.. I bash him and bring up Minnesota because he HAS NO HUMILITY FOR THOSE LOSING YEARS.. dude was on TV crying about losing then starts winning and got the nerve to spit in A LOT OF PEOPLES FACES.. if u been on both sides ACT like you been on both sides.. thats why i bring up Minnesota in reference to KG.. please dont get it twisted.. shit the one year they gave him talent he went to the Conference Finals.. i know this.. i dont have a selective memory like others..
@ Ian
And please put Kobe on the Nuggets when AI was there.. u think thats a first round exit?? how about putting Kobe on those Sixers teams?? when the lower seeds in the East were under .500 – YEAH RIGHT..
February 2nd, 2010 at 2:22 pm
LakeShow84 says:
And all that being said Magic is still in the # 1 spot..
February 2nd, 2010 at 2:27 pm
LakeShow84 says:
Let me say this aloud too..
Tracy McGrady and Kevin Garnett had 1st round exits a good 10 times between the BOTH OF THEM and that aint even counting no playoff appearances..
Kobe Bryant has had TWO.. COUNT IT, TWO..
How is there really a comparison??
February 2nd, 2010 at 2:29 pm
Ian says:
lakeshow
i dont play the what if game judge everyone in the situation they are in but judge them the same is what im sayin. does your crystal ball say that kobe makes the finals with the 01 sixers ??? maybe who knows but if he does only to lose to iversons lakers.
February 2nd, 2010 at 2:31 pm
Ian says:
lakeshow
lol because it was the only two times kobe played with kg and tmac talent around him. you think he makes it out with 8 straight seasons of smush and kwame??
February 2nd, 2010 at 3:27 pm
Alex says:
Bear in mind that Phil Jackson was a little miffed at Bryant on his historic night, too. Jackson told the team at halftime, when Bryant had 23 of the Lakers’ 50 points, that Bryant was “forcing the action.” Jackson also said in the halftime locker room, alluding to the 29 points Bryant needed in the game to pass Jerry West: “Let’s get him over the hump, so we can play team ball again.”
That’s just the kind of player Kobe is. Sure he wants to win, sure he wants to succeed, but that only comes 2nd to ‘getting his’.
He’s attempted more shots this season than any other player, and yet he’s got Pau, and Bynum – 2 7-footers who shoot above 50% from the field.
The Lakers by far, have the strongest team on paper, and the best coach ever. And yet they’re not dominating like they should. Its a tough act for Phil Jackson – winning and keeping Kobe happy, when really the latter should be the result of the former.
February 2nd, 2010 at 4:51 pm
str8ganksta says:
Ervin
The stilt
Alcindor
Shaq-fu
The Logo
…Mamba
February 2nd, 2010 at 5:14 pm
LakeShow84 says:
@ Ian
So what are you saying??
You know i think ur in a state of denial.. I bet when the Lakers came apart and EVERYONE jumped ship you thought to yourself “Kobe will NEVER get it done again.. I bet hes just like KG..” and then when the first 3 years passed you automatically stuffed the man in that box.. But like i said how does 2 first round exits (lets not even MENTION getting to the Finals the VERY next year) compare to CAREERS of falling short?? thats why u always refer to Gasol trade as a saving grace BUT like i said we were already turning the corner that year.. You never acknowledge these things because they DONT back ur arguement up.. all you can TRY to imply is Kobe couldnt get it done without Gasol and/or Shaq..
But the bottom line is we had ONE losing season (under .500) and TWO playoff exits.. After that?? 2 Finals in a row AND counting.. Call me crazy but Orlando had losing seasonS, Minnesota had losing seasonS..
Like i said.. there is no comparison.. There arent too many players in the league who can ask for the talent to win a chip, get the talent and then turn around and actually win it all.. Tmac got the talent and didnt come up period.. Garnett needed 2 other HOF’s and some young good talent (Rondo, Perkins and Powe) to step up..
So do you hear this or are those 3 years you keep referring to so quickly just the defining years of Kobe’s career??
February 2nd, 2010 at 6:00 pm
ERIC says:
1. maggic………5 RINGZ
2. kobe………..4 RINGZ
3. kareem………5 RINGZ
4. west………..1 RINGZ
5. chamberlin…..DNT COUNT ONLY 8 TEMS BACK THEN
KOBE WILL PASS MAGGIC IF HE TIES HIM IN RINGZ…
KOBE ALSO DOES IT ON THE DEFENSIVE SIDE
February 2nd, 2010 at 7:25 pm
Drewskeelove says:
It’s funny that the only way you clowns on here can put Kobe down is using a biased double standard.
The man will go down as not only the best Laker, but the best player ever as well.
And when that happens, I hope none of you start losing sleep. It’s sad how hard some of you hate.
February 2nd, 2010 at 7:28 pm
Drewskeelove says:
And if finals mvps, mvps, etc are the reason magic is better than Kobe, that makes Kareem better than Jordan.
February 4th, 2010 at 12:52 am
Fertsy says:
Come on when did Kobe even come into consideration as the best player in the league? Only the Last 4-5 years (1 Stern sanctioned Ring) before that Shaq / Timmy were the leagues best players (3 & 4 rings each when they were the main man for the season)… Kobe wasn’t even the best on his team for most of his career, so how does that make him better then Magic who was the best Laker through the 80’s championships.
February 4th, 2010 at 1:12 am
Jason says:
The debate is eternal when two talented players play in different times. There is always the die hard support for both. Unfortunately statistics do not always have the answer to the talent in each. Personally I loved Magic and Kobe is doing a great job today. The game is richer for having had two such talented players.
February 4th, 2010 at 2:04 am
Jason says:
74 comments and counting – This post is spreading like fire
Just Digged and Stumbled it
February 5th, 2010 at 8:29 am
mytiman says:
Why shouldn’t he be the greatest Laker of all-time?
If he surpasses, or atleast ties, Magic Johnson’s 5 rings, he should be considered as the number 1 Laker ever.
Forget about the rape case and the Trade Me now scenarios, Kobe just want to win. And he did that with a couple of wackos (Pau not included) and brought them to the top of the mountain.
Magic had Kareem and able to produce just 5 (Meanwhile, Jordan had only Pippen and surpassed that).
If, the Mamba ties Magic Johnson, a debate should be made between who’s better.
If he gets 6, Kobe’s better than Magic, but not against Air Jordan.
If he gets 7, the title “Greatest basketball player” is given to Kobe Jellybean Bryant.
February 5th, 2010 at 1:11 pm
kowtz says:
Magic had Kareem? Magic had Kareem, Worthy, Scott, Cooper, Cambell… Cmon…
Jordan had Pippen Only? Maybe you people forgot how heavy was Rodman, Ron Harper, Kukoc was… Harper was like MJ of the clips…
Kobe made it to the playoffs twice with a line up of Mihm, Kwame, Odom, Devean George, and Smush…
If that still ain’t enough… 81 baby… 81!
February 7th, 2010 at 4:00 am
mytiman says:
Hey kowtz,
When you said Kobe made it to the playoffs with a Mihm and Kwame, that was the same point that I have in my post.
Kobe is the Number 1 Laker for me because of the given reasons above.
February 7th, 2010 at 10:30 am
Jade says:
I think the thing most ppl are disregarding is that Magic had real intensity for winning the game just as Kobe does; the only difference was that he knew early on that it take 5 guys with the same mindset to win. Not one mid blowing player taking on the opposing team. If that was ever a successful strat then Jordan would have 11 championships !!!
Kobe’s a natural scorer; Magic was a natural facilitator…the difference comes in that Magic could score with the best of them whenever he needed to (42 pts playing center when Kareem was injured)…you guys actually think Kobe can pass the rock at the right place at the right time CONSISTENTLY :S I think thats a little unfair to Magic…and very charitable to Kobe.
As for Jordan vs Kobe…thats not even a contest…Jordan won without ever having a dominant big man !!! Enough said !!! As for 81 points; I’ll take 63 points in a playoff game against three HOF defenders over a 100 points in a regular season game any day !!! Its not the number of points; its the time and place for me !!!
BTW: First NBA game I ever watched 87 Finals Celtics vs Lakers. First NCAA game I ever saw Tar Heels vs Blue Devils
Been lucky I guess !!!