The bright side of Vince Carter’s slump
Vince Carter, Dime #21
If you didn’t watch the standings or check the box scores, you’d think the Orlando Magic were actually struggling.
Halfway through the season, you can pick a negative story line surrounding the defending Eastern Conference champs and somebody, somewhere has already run with it: Dwight not getting the ball enough; Rashard‘s game falling off like he really needs PED’s; missing Hedo and/or Rafer more than they thought; Jameer dealing with more injuries; overpaying Gortat; under-playing Brandon Bass; team meetings regarding Stan Van Gundy‘s infectious negativity … You could even throw celebrity Magic fan Tiger Woods and his status collapse onto a pile that should be screaming “NBA Finals hangover.”
Little would you know, the Magic are still sitting in first place in the Southeast Division, and second place in the East. At 32-16, they’re five and a half games behind the Cavs and boast one of the League’s best home records at 18-4. Last week, the Magic knocked off the Celtics, then destroyed the Hawks for the third time this year.
There’s one more issue that could have you believing the Magic are in trouble. Vince Carter has been, to put it eloquently, playing like ass.
Maybe it shouldn’t come as a surprise, considering VC is 33 years old and dealing with nagging injuries to his shoulder and ankle. But if his current scoring average of 15.6 ppg holds up, it would be a career-low for the future Hall of Famer. In the month of January, Vince scored 8.7 ppg — last night’s two-point effort (1-8 FG) against Detroit being the 10th time in the last 13 games he’s failed to crack double digits.
Neither Van Gundy nor Carter seem too worried, most likely because the team has gone 6-2 over the last two weeks. But if this slump extends to the All-Star break — and then the vacation doesn’t provide an easy remedy — it will become an area of concern as the playoffs approach. For now, though, they’re approaching it like a minor bump in the road. From the Orlando Sentinel:
“I feel OK,” Carter said. “I can’t complain. I wish I could get to Toys ‘R’ Us or something and get me a new shoulder, but whatever. No, I’m good. I feel good.”
Carter has done anything but mope the last few weeks. In fact, he continues to encourage his younger teammates, including power forward Ryan Anderson and center Dwight Howard.
“Vince, he’s been in the league a long time,” Howard said. “With him, he just wants me to be aggressive. He wants me to be dominant. My goal for our team and my goal for myself is to be a leader … and Vince, he just pushes me to do that.”
Van Gundy has said that Carter is most effective when Carter is aggressive and drives to the hoop. Carter did that on occasion against the Hawks (on Saturday), but just didn’t have much success. On the game’s opening possession, he drove along the baseline and missed a reverse layup.
Carter said he is just trying to take what opportunities defenses provide.
“I’m trying to get to the basket and suck some guys in,” Carter said. “Our guys were shooting well, so I’ll find them if they’re open.”
If you missed that, it sounds like Vince Carter — a.k.a. “Vince Cancer” to some of his harshest critics — has become the positive veteran presence people thought he never could be. It sounds like he’s become a leader and a good locker-room guy, even when his game has been off. It sounds like he’s playing through injuries after all those years of being labeled soft. And I know it’s more than “sounds like,” because Vince was doing the same things in New Jersey, he just didn’t get any credit.
Will this end up being the biggest reward of the Carter trade for Orlando? So much was made about the explosive scoring potential and crunch-time credentials, we forgot Vince would join the Magic as one of its most experienced vets. Once upon a time he might have thrown a fit or two by now, and his sulking could threaten to envelop the entire team. (Seriously, he’s getting benched for J.J. Redick in the fourth quarter.) But Vince knows what’s at stake here: For the first time in his career he has a legit shot at a championship, and his years are running out.
Honestly, while they’re beating good teams now, I don’t think Orlando can get past the second round of the playoffs if Vince isn’t playing like at least a borderline All-Star in the postseason. And if you ask me, I think he’ll come out of this funk soon enough. But even if it never happens, at least you can’t blame Vince’s attitude for whatever goes wrong.
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February 1st, 2010 at 9:31 am
DTA4Life says:
Good article Dime, but is Vince Carter really HOF material?
February 1st, 2010 at 9:31 am
Jay says:
No, blame his cousin – blame Tracy McGrady instead.
February 1st, 2010 at 9:35 am
KnicksFan84 says:
Man, I feel bad for Orlando. When you look at it now, they tried to swing a deal to go for it all this year. They just got Vince 1 year too late the way it’s looking. Hard to see any other player out there they could have gotten instead…..
They just gotta hope he becomes dominant in playoffs…
Come to think of it, it might be blasphemy to say it but they probably should have gone after Baron Davis or should do so even still now. Get as many explosive types that you can that you know will go nutz in the playoffs if they get hot!
February 1st, 2010 at 9:48 am
Shady says:
Orlando should rest Vince for a few weeks. He really isn’t contributing at all right now, so I don’t think they will lose many games because he is not playing. Give him a month to rest up and then come back stronger and healthier for a playoff run.
February 1st, 2010 at 9:57 am
AdvancedMind says:
LMFAO @ JJ Redick actually is still in the League..
God Stan Van is a horrible coach.
February 1st, 2010 at 10:44 am
sweetv0mit says:
Future HOF? Hmmm sounds like you gotta write a follow up argument on this one Austin
February 1st, 2010 at 10:58 am
nerditry says:
As it seems most people that write about the Magic don’t get to see them play except national tv, please believe:
1. JJ has been getting buckets and making the smart play. He’s the one that got the ball to Lewis for the game winning layup against the Celtics. He also played stellar man defense on Ray Allen in last year’s playoffs.
2. Jameer Nelson is still hurt and came back from injury too early…twice. Last year’s return in the Finals was a negative as Rafer and Anthony Johnson had been playing exceptionally well. Until he is 100%, the Magic are not going to be able to count on him being aggressive in driving the basket and kicking out to Dwight or the shooters.
3. Vince just looks to be out of gas and is jacking really bad shots. If he modified his role to that of distributor and replaced the movement that Hedo created, his lack of scoring would be a much smaller story. The ball ends up getting stuck in his hands unless he’s already thinking about the next pass.
4. A lineup including Lewis/Barnes/Gortat/Howard matches up amazingly well against the Celtics, Lakers, Hawks and the Cavs if they are playing big. Gortat and Howard can play on the court at the same time.
February 1st, 2010 at 11:11 am
Chicagorilla says:
@nerditry,
I agree with 2,3, and maybe 4. But I can not agree with one. JJ never played steller D, Ray was just off. And yes JJ made that pass to Rashard, but it was out of control and was actually a terrible play as KG had Shard trapped in the corner. Luckily Shard drove the ball hard to his right which KG couldn’t get the push off his injured knee to cut him off that direction. Also Sheed was in “lazy” mode and didn’t bother to even foul Lewis as he made the game winning lay-up. Good post though.
February 1st, 2010 at 11:18 am
Chicagorilla says:
Oh and Vince being constantly injured and not having the explosiveness at 33 has a lot to do with his work ethic.
Had VC actually trained his body, and not just relied on natural athletic ability to get him over, he would be playing much better at 33 than he is now. Rasheed and T-Mac are in the same boat. Actually I think T-mac did workout this past off-season so he at least looks to be in better shape.
This is what happens to guys like VC, Paul Pierce(its coming), Sheed, both O’neals, and AI, you may not need to work out, eat right, and perfect your craft when you are 20-28 because everything comes so naturally, but when you start to cross over 30, then you need to have a back up plan to compensate for losing certain physical abilities. Zo did it, Ben Wallace did it, Reggie Miller did it, Jordan did it, Clyde and Stockton did it, even Pippen was still somewhat valuable in his last days in Port playing PG.
Guys just don’t get it these days. I know DWade and Lebron better figure it out before their day comes.
February 1st, 2010 at 11:27 am
nerditry says:
@Chicagorilla – I’ll concede that it was a broken play and JJ got stuck with the ball about 30 feet from the basket in a double team. But, he still got the ball out to Lewis and the play should have taken place as soon as the inbound.
On Allen, you can chalk it up to just his fatigue as JJ was in active shot denial mode and stayed with him. Maybe we’ll meet in the middle and say one was as meaningful as the other.
What I can’t take back is that JJ is hitting the shots that he’s on the floor to hit. Interestingly enough, during last night’s game there were at least 2 instances where he made an aggressive drive and could have gone for the layup. Instead, he made the pass once under the basket and setup the shooter who converted. That is what the team needs out of Jameer and Vince, can’t be the saving grace from the 7th man over the long haul.
February 1st, 2010 at 11:43 am
QQ says:
I disagree with the whole ‘positive veteran presence’ myth. The only way he can be a veteran presence is when he plays well in the court. When he plays hard, when he competes, when he goes 100%. Those are the things VC could do that can make young cats on the team feel that veteran presence. He hasn’t done that this year. He hasn’t shed the soft label. He’s not fucking Darrell Armstrong that will spread positivity in the locker room. VC should do all of that IN THE COURT. He hasn’t done that.
PS: Oh yeah, I would like to believe that I invented the Vince Cancer moniker. DO I win a prize?
February 1st, 2010 at 12:13 pm
shiptar says:
Austin: For the first time in his career he has a legit shot at a championship.
I thought he was in the Finals twice with the nets. That was closer to the championship, than he will get this year with the Magic. Cause they aren’t goin to the Finals this year..
February 1st, 2010 at 12:15 pm
shiptar says:
and the salary he is being paid is pretty big for just a positive veteran presence. They should just get pj brown, or someone..maybe sam casell wants out of washington.
February 1st, 2010 at 12:30 pm
DTA4Life says:
shiptar,
Carter was never on those Nets’ Finals teams. The Nets made the Finals in 2002 and 2003. Carter was in Toronto wincing with his ‘jumper’s knee’.
QQ – Vince Cancer is an awesome name. A+
February 1st, 2010 at 12:31 pm
heavy d says:
The big keys to the Magic’s recent wins . . . not playing Carter and Nelson at crunch time. Carter may be saying the right things off the floor, but he’s been negatively impacting the Magic on the floor. Stan Van Gundy has apparently realized this. Now if he just realized how good Ryan Anderson is, they’d really be dangerous.
February 1st, 2010 at 1:04 pm
Royal says:
I stopped reading when you called Vince Carter a future HOFer
February 1st, 2010 at 1:08 pm
the cynic says:
chicagorilla never misses a chance to trash JJ Reddick; it just kills you JJ is a decent NBA player.
Not trying to sound like a broken record, but VC HOF!?!?! Hell NO! Greatest dunker of All-Time though
February 1st, 2010 at 1:13 pm
jackass says:
Hall of Fame will be a joke in couple decades if people like VC starts getting in. seriously
February 1st, 2010 at 2:03 pm
momo says:
Um, did you just call Vince a “Future Hall of Famer”?!
LMAO
February 1st, 2010 at 2:42 pm
ab_40 says:
ditto the VC needs to play at borderline all star level.
but with boston falling appart in front of our eyes I still think they can make it to the finals. As much as I like boston their D just isn’t there. Daniels is gonna make a change but not THE change… THE change would be a time machine which would set the four elder states men 5 years back
February 1st, 2010 at 2:42 pm
Chicagorilla says:
@the cynic,
decent? I wouldn’t even call him that. He is a shooter. If he ever stops doing that for whatever reason, he’s done with. I just don’t respect guys who can’t bring more to the table than one skill. Mike Miller is a great shooter, but look at the other things he brings. Joe Johnson also. Steph Curry is a phenominal shooter on the level of JJ Reddick in college and he has other skills that make him a legit NBA player even if he was just a decent shooter.
February 1st, 2010 at 2:44 pm
Posterboy15 says:
Just cause the man dont have a ring or played up to jordan or kobesque standards dont mean he cant get a nod for the HOF.he is his own man, and being him mad him one of the most enjoyable players to watch in his generation…his numbers alone are better than guys who are in there already..and F the numbers..Vince change the game when he came in and had the world on his shoulders at one point, and people questionin his heart, he is not ur boyfriend so quit wit dat HOMO ish..I thought only people from Toronto hated on him like this where in the hell are yall dudes from….A lot of dudes favorite players today grew up watchin VC, and u can see in there games what they have took from Vince..and for the bunch of High Jumping cats with ridiculous shooting range we have nowadays in the league..dats all Kobe,VC,Tmac status that started that type of guard playing which revolutionized the game…and it would be an insult if VC and Tmac didnt get to the HOF..We all know Kobe’s Status….
February 1st, 2010 at 2:54 pm
shawn says:
its sad really…how the media brainwashes so many casual fans perception of players…yea vc is playing horrible right now..but to say hes not a future HOF is a joke lol it really is sad but the media needs to do wat it needs to do to market kobe and lbj and completely ignore and put down other players…its just sad…a CAREER 23ppg 6rpg 4apg…clutch performer throughout his career…top 10 athletically all time and greatest in game and dunk contest dunker of all time….great playoff performer…its just sad that there are so many casual fans out there that spread word that they dont have much knowledge of themselves
February 1st, 2010 at 3:54 pm
GABRIEL BROGDEN says:
@23
Hey Shawn – I don’t think the media is brainwashing anybody when it comes to Vince.
I believe Vince’s enshrinement in the Hall of Fame is VERY debatable.
To say “he’s not a future HOF is a joke” is a JOKE.
He’s nice, don’t get me wrong.
But c’mon, Hall of Fame???
23 6 and 4 is indicative of a really good player.
But Hall of Fame???
His athleticism is not a prequisite by itself to get in the Hall.
Dude is a career SUB 45% shooter.
Great playoff performer? Really???????
What do you remember most about Vince??
His dunks. OK
Bailing out of T.Dot??
Someone else might remember his ‘will to play’ is SUSPECT.
Nets always in the playoffs but never sealing the deal???
That’s WITH RJ…AND…Kidd.
I’m not really arguing.
Even with his notable credentials, including his off-the-court nobleness and citizenship, I just don’t think he’s a LOCK-IN for the Hall.
February 1st, 2010 at 4:26 pm
sweetv0mit says:
@Chicagorilla
Didn’t JJ hit the game tying THREE in that game before Rashard hit the game winner? I’m just saying… STOP HATING!!!!
February 1st, 2010 at 5:18 pm
Patrick says:
It sounds like a lot of people on this topic talk from public knowledge but not from actual perception of games. So if I may I would like to address a few topics:
1. I have been on of JJ Redick’s biggest critics as a die-hard Magic fan. I wasn’t sure if he would ever “get it”. And by it I mean learn how to adjust from college to pro level. That being said this year I have seen a completely different JJ. In fact I think he should be starting over Carter. JJ has been playing solid basketball on both ends of the court and doesn’t need a high shot volume to be effective. I don’t think JJ has been dynamite on either end of the ball, but to say that he doesn’t belong in the NBA is just plain ignorant.
2. VC is a borderline hall of famer. He may not be a lock because he has never been to the finals, nor has he won an MVP award. That being said Vince was easily on of the premier players in the late 90′s and early 2000′s. When Jordan retired basketball looked for another flashy player to keep fan interest and like it or not Vince was that guy. You may remember early on that Vince was compared to MJ often.
3. Stan Van Gundy being a bad coach is just plain ridiculous. In his 3 seasons with the Magic (this one included) he is on the verge of having 3 divison titles, a NBA Finals appearance (maybe 2 but we need to pick it up), and has dealt with more than most other coaches while still keeping his players focused and competitive. This year alone he has dealt with injuries to the following players that lasted more than 2 games: Jameer Nelson (starting pg), Vince Carter (starting sg), Mikael Pietrus (At one point starting sf), Ryan Anderson (back up pf), and a 10 game suspension from Rashard Lewis (starting pf). I think Van Gundy needs a little credit from basketball fans, considering most basketball players want to play for him and former players who aren’t media whores (Shaq) have spoken very highly of him (Dwyane Wade).
Thanks for reading and I hope some people took away at least something.
February 1st, 2010 at 7:53 pm
Fertsy says:
VC a Hall of Famer!!! What the hell have y’all been smokin?!?
What has Air Canada-New Jersey-Orlando actually done in the leage apart for win popularity contests… if that was all that was needed then T-Mac gets into goin by All-Star voting as well
February 2nd, 2010 at 9:41 am
Russ says:
finally a few people who actually watch the games without blind hate for jj……
February 2nd, 2010 at 10:41 am
bsteezy3 says:
Good post Patrick.
February 2nd, 2010 at 12:39 pm
QQ says:
@ 26:
On your number 3: FINALLY. SOMEONE WHO WATCHES REAL GAMES INSTEAD OF BASHING SVG BECAUSE IT’S THE COOL THING TO DO.