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College, NBA, Pat's Sixers Blog / Mar 4, 2010 / 11:00 am

Maryland’s Greivis Vasquez vs. Duke’s Jon Scheyer: Pick the Better NBA Draft Prospect

Last night while watching Duke’s Jon Scheyer and Maryland’s Greivis Vasquez shoot it out in a great game on ESPN, we posed this question to our Twitter followers:

Between Scheyer + Vasquez, who do u think will be a better NBA player? Will either even have an NBA career?

The responses we received were pretty much all either supporting Vasquez or saying that neither one of them will be an NBA player. I think I have to respectfully disagree on both counts. I believe that both of them will at least get some kind of shot at playing in the League, with Vasquez almost certainly having a better chance of getting drafted than Scheyer. In fact, NBADraft.net currently has Greivis projected as a first round pick this summer, landing in the 25-30 range. Obviously, draft projections are an inexact science. Prime example: check out our other top NBA Draft resource, DraftExpress.com. Their 2010 mock doesn’t even have Vasquez getting picked at all, but has Scheyer being taken at the end of the second round.

So who is the better prospect? I think that physically, Vasquez has the edge, and will almost certainly test out better than Scheyer at pre-draft workouts. Greivis is an inch taller than Scheyer (6-6 vs. 6-5), is stronger than Scheyer (One of the biggest knocks on Vasquez after he tested the NBA Draft waters last summer was that he wasn’t strong enough; he clearly spent time in the weight room this past offseason), has a longer wingspan than Scheyer, and while Vasquez isn’t a super athlete, will most likely test better than Scheyer in the speed/agility/quickness tests.

In terms of basketball skills though, I still give Scheyer a pretty significant edge. Jon is clearly a better shooter and has made himself into some kind of combo guard hybrid with the nation’s fourth-best assist-to-turnover ratio at 3.06. Whereas Vasquez is streaky shooting the basketball and has a tendency to play out of control at times, Scheyer is a steadying force on the court. When he showed up in Durham, it looked he was going to be a poor man’s J.J. Redick, there to fill the need of a knock-down jump shooter in Coach K’s offense. His game has evolved drastically – partly out of necessity for his team and his own future prospects – to where he can potentially find his way on to an NBA team as a backup guard; a Matt Carroll who can also conceivably run your team’s offense (Don’t laugh at the Matt Carroll comparison. The guy is in his eighth year collecting checks in the NBA).

Whenever I have asked a longtime NBA scout friend of mine is so-and-so can play in the League, his first question is always, “Who can he guard?” For both Scheyer and Vasquez, stack them up against backup 1’s and 2’s in the NBA and ask that same question. Can they both effectively deal with guys like Jeff Teague, Daniel Gibson, J.J. Barea, Luke Ridnour, and Lou Williams? Maybe. You probably have to give the physical edge to Vasquez, but I don’t think there’s a huge gap between the two of them.

So all in all, if I were an NBA GM looking to take a flier on a guy at the end of the draft or considering which undrafted free agents to invite to camp, I would most likely go with Jon Scheyer over Vasquez. To me, erratic wing players are a dime a dozen. Shooters who may also be able to run an offense and not turn the ball over win out for me every time.

What do you think? Who is a better NBA prospect? Will either player make it in the NBA?

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  • The Journeyman

    First of all … YEAHHH!! Maryland…great game last night and I’m a diehard Terps fan!

    Second of all, it sucks that Vazquez has some flaws in his game and clearly I hear about it all the time with local sports talk radio, BUT for sure he has legit skills.

    I also noticed that he has the small tendency to turn the ball over, but his assist to turnover ratio is bananas right now. Like 4th in the country.

    All in all, it takes skill, personality, iq, and command to make it in the NBA.

    Vasquez has those. He knows he has to market himself and the way he has been doing it by willing MD to win this season should vouch for him to get picked over Scheyer in the draft.

    AND THAT P.C. IS THAT!!!!

    boooo Philly

  • Patrick Cassidy

    @ The Journeyman,

    I love the “boooo Philly” at the end for a little added touch to your post. Good stuff.

  • The Journeyman

    ALSO…you gotta google the man! lol

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greivis_Vasquez

  • The Journeyman

    the game was crazy last night wasn’t it???

    I thought they did well when Vasquez sat for a bit in the 2nd half but his shots were money to seal it…that 3 was wild!

    lol i like Philly but since you picked against MD, booooo Villanova, 76ers & the Flyers

  • ctkennedy

    scheyer is a steve blake clone he always will play his role he can run pick and rolls he is a spot up shooter he cant straight guard nobody but who can? he will play great position d always be in the right spot ……vasquez could be chris duhon or sasha vajuic a streaky shooter handle the ball good enough to be a 15-18min pg backup will pressure u 94ft and aint scared to guard nobody

  • Jayo

    Gotta say that Vasquez is the better prospect. Anyone who’s paid attention to Maryland the last 4yrs has seen his game develop. He is a completely different player than he was as a freshamn. I could see him being an effective 1 or 2 & still has a little upside. I don’t see that with Scheyer.

  • http://www.WhyCandaceWhySheldon.thatbastard.com Chicagorilla

    I hate Dook. Jon Schyer is from IL, but my hate for Dook players outweighs that. Plus he’s not really good. Vasquez looks kind of annoying, but he go’s hard. Lot of emotion. Good passer. I’d take Vasquez.

  • Patrick Cassidy

    @ ctkennedy,

    Good point about the pick and rolls w/Scheyer. Such a huge part of the NBA game – it’s pretty much the only thing the Suns run, just pick-and-roll over and over and over again with Nash and Amar’e or Nash and a shooter.

  • spswange

    Vasquez – more athletic, better handles, creates on his own. better for NBA

    Scheyer – can only score in a DUKE offense; his high IQ is only due to duke offense. if you watch him he always leaves the floor to pass when he drives. his teammates bail him out a lot by trailing him to the open spots. that’s not bball IQ for him. Plus, he is too weak and cannot guard quick guards…

  • mac

    Vasquez, if only because he’s the most likely to bring back the testicle dance…

  • sweetv0mit

    I’m a duke fan but i got to watch the terps hokies 2ot game live and vazquez just went nuts in that game… the one thing that he’s lacking is a basketball iq.

  • BiGShoTBoB

    IMO Vasquez is a backup point guard while Scheyer is a backup shooting guard, JJ Reddick 2.0 if you will. Solid backup point gaurds are in higher demand in the NBA than unathletic 2 guards plain and simple.

  • rudderband man

    @ spswange

    None of those points were valid. In case you missed it, Scheyer has a 3.06 assist/turnover ratio. That’s no accident. Sure, Scheyer has some questionable attributes on the basketball court but his IQ is definitely not one of them. You don’t seem to know very much about basketball so I’m going to take a shot in the dark here and guess that you’re a UNC fan.

    Rule #5: You’re an idiot.

  • spswange

    @rudderband man

    have you not watched a DUKE game before or are you one of those ignorant fans that think duke is flawless… Again, let me reiterate, his IQ comes from his teammates. not him…

    you wrong on quoting the rule book…

  • redkangaroo8

    @spswange

    Can you please explain how a player can get their IQ from their teammates? I’m trying to think about it and in no way does that make a bit of sense. Thanks.

  • quest???

    vazquez sucks and he is an asshole…that is all

  • GM

    In my opinion Scheyer is more likely to fit into an NBA teams system. You can call the kid nonathletic if you want, but if you’ve been watching him play this season you’ll realize he finds ways to score when it matters, whether it be from the perimeter or driving to the hoop.

    I feel like Scheyer is the more disciplined of the two and more likely to adapt to a new system and play a role where Vasquez may have some trouble fitting in to a role where he is playing limited minutes and getting limited shots.

    Either way I hope both players make it in the league, and if nothing else I am really rooting for a Maryland Duke ACC tournament final. It’s 1 – 1 right now with both teams winning on their home court, what better than a ACC championship game on a neutral court to settle things.

    Sidebar: I’ve been a Duke fan since I understood basketball and although I do look forward to the Duke UNC games more than any other, there is no crowd that brings it like the Terps fans. I’m not a huge fan of some of their methods, but I will not deny they are an amazing crowd.

  • Big Island

    I gotta go with Scheyer simply because he has a bit more versatility. I don’t think either one will be good though. Every time that I have seen Vasquez play he is just gunning and everyone else just hopes he passes. In all fairness I have only seen him play a few times.

  • spswange

    @redkangaroo8

    Scheyer makes a lot of stupid decision. his teammates bail him out is what i am saying. he always leaves the floor when he penetrates and makes a pass. never knows where he actually throws the ball. his teammates usually recovers the ball b/c the defense turns their backs. not IQ.

    i understand if he knew where he was throwing the ball. but mostly he just chucks it behind him somewhere.

    he is like paulus, makes stupid decision but when one goes his way, everyone praises him.

    i just think that he gets bailed out way more then people realize.

  • Raj S

    Vasquez. It’s not even close.
    Landon Milbourne, Maryland’s second best player, is a better draft prospect than any Dukie.

  • redkangaroo8

    @spswange

    I would understand your point if you were talking about one game. But how can someone get bailed out sooo much by their teammates and have a 3.06 assist/turnover ratio??? I wouldn’t call that getting bailed out and if you would then it’s obvious you don’t know too much about the game of basketball.

  • jm

    @spswange

    Scheyer is one of the most controlled guards in the nation. His numbers support that with his assist to turnover ratio. Not too bad for a kid that never played point til late last season. I am not sure who you are watching, maybe you watched one game and he got in the air on a pass and now you think it is a bad habit. Quite the contrary, he is very steady and methodical and rarely makes a mistake with the ball.

    Vasquez does that way more than anyone else. Even yesterday, he was bailed several times by Hayes making a nice cut to the basket.

    Neither one of those guys will be setting the NBA on fire. But please help me understand how an erratic pg that is not exceptionally quick, not exceptionally athletic, super streaky shooter without a great basketball IQ will fare better than the 6’5 combo guard who can play point and has one specific needed ability – he can shoot the ball. he also has the far superior basketball IQ. I also think although not lockdown defender does a better job on that end than he gets credit for.

    If Vasquez played at Duke he would go down as the most hated player ever in college basketball. But, because it is Maryland he gets that pass. They stormed the court yesterday like they were Stonybrook and just beat Duke. Act like you been there before. For the love of God you won the title in the last 10 years.

    Vasquez hit a couple shots out his @ss last night when they counted…I give him that. But, I hope both teams settle this season series in the finals of the ACC tourney. Vasquez won’t have the home crowd to pump him up like he did last night. If he doesn’t make it in the league he definitely has a future in wrestling as a hype man. He was doing some great macho man “I can’t hear you” gestures to the Terp fans.

  • spswange

    @redkangaroo8

    Watch this sat. game against UNC and count how many times he gets bailed out… its not just one game, it every game. he does it at least 2-3 times. as a senior, that shouldn’t happen. RUDDER!!! lol… why you think the lose when they play good PG’s?

    are you and rudderband man holding hands while posting or something

  • spswange

    @JM

    1st i would like to say that i am not a Vasquez fan, he seems to play his butt off against UNC every game… i am simply saying that he would have a better chance in the NBA than Scheyer… and about the, ‘if Vasquez played at duke he would be the most hated player’… are you kidding me, you dukies would love that guy. you hate him b/c he plays for MD, thats all.

    I am not making a case for Vasquez. i am making a case for the system that scheyer plays in. any other system, #’s would be totally different

  • spswange

    @JM

    i do agree with you on Vasquez… lol pretty funny stuff

  • http://heckler@aol.com Heckler

    no player out of Duke should ever be drafted in the 1st round again!!

  • http://dime eyes

    Neither. OVERSEAS. Vasquez throws looking no looks. Never seen that before. They’re both at best avg college players in big time programs. Not to be a pessimist. Just evaluating the talent. Not the person or school. Stats & records broken don’t mean much. It’s total different era. It’s not like they can’t survive in this watered down league. It just the league doesn’t have enough stars. They’re basically end of the bench players. That have to go to the right system.

    Though with the right coach I could see Vasquez being a poor man’s George Hill. A real poor man Hill though. I see something in both players. Not enough to warrant drafting. See if they can make the team.

  • Seven Duece

    I go with Scheyer; he seems to be more in control of himself and the game on a more consistent basis. I can see Vasquez’s demeanor getting him in trouble ala Von Wafer.

  • JayZ

    definitely not. Vasquez is WAY too into himself and is like the Milton Bradley of College Basketball. Enough said.

    Jon Scheyer has more control and definitely more humbleness that the game needs. He hits the shots that his team needs him to make and he’s versitile with the steals and assists.

    Jon Scheyer’s a keeper.

  • jm

    @Heckler

    You are obviously just a Duke hater. Check the stats on Duke players drafted since let’s say ’99…only busts (first rounders that did nada) are William Avery and Shelden Williams. All others have contributed. Stats don’t lie. Can’t call JJ a bust because he is contributing for a finals contender. He will be in the league for many years. Whether you like them or not, check stats on players like Boozer, Dunleavy, Maggette, Deng, Battier, Brand, Duhon, etc. These guys have and are putting up pretty decent numbers. Superstars – no…but solid NBA players.

    When in fact UNC and MD have had more busts…especially UNC. Felton is the best UNC player drafted since ’99…that is not saying much. Steve Blake is probably the best of this era from MD…again not saying much. What is Sean May doing?? What about Rashad Mccants? What about Brandon Wright? Exactly. Until Harrison Barnes comes in and eventually leaves…that is not changing any time soon.

    So give the ol’ Duke players are busts in the league talk a rest as it no longer applies. That is old hat from Duke haters that have nothing to hang on to anymore.

  • righteousdewd

    I am MD alum and professional dook hater. Comparing these guys to each other isn’t the point. Both will go sometime in the draft.

    Vasquez will be playing overseas within four years. He has a lot of the physical abilities that translate to the NBA and somehow gets redonkulous shots to fall. But he’s been playing against chumps for the last four years. I just don’t see his game being effective in the NBA. Regardless, he’ll get a chance to prove me wrong.

    It pains me to say this, but Scheyer has a good chance to have a long career in the NBA. Since he is white, we are contractually obligated to compare him to another white point guard. Meaning, my man, Steve Blake. He isn’t nearly as good as a PG as Blake was in college. But he definitely has the chops to develop as a PG in the pros.

    Comparing them doesn’t exactly work because Vasquez was supposed to be a SG and ended up at PG. In the NBA, he would be a SG (redonkulous shots). I just don’t see him measuring up. Scheyer only has to run an offense. Which he has done better and better each year. Mind you, I HATE him.

  • accfanatic

    they’re both outstanding assets to their respective programs, but i give the edge to scheyer.

    does nobody realize that jon scheyer has been a shooting guard his entire career until he was asked to play point guard this year? i can’t help but notice a lot of these responses saying “scheyer would make a good schooting guard,” etc., but that’s what he’d be in the NBA. he’s only a point guard now because he was asked to make the transition when duke needed a point guard this year.

    oh yeah, and he did it while having the best assist-to-turnover ratio in the acc.

    vasquez has the slight scoring edge, but that’s because duke has so many other scoring options that scheyer is not looked upon to score every basket, much unlike vasquez. he also rebounds more, but he’s taller. he averages 1 more assist than scheyer per game, but also almost 2 more turnovers.

    i don’t tend to root for duke or maryland particularly, but i’m a little shocked everyone is so pro-vasquez after yesterday’s game. scheyer had the edge going in (even though slight) and i don’t think vasquez proved himself enough to overtake that. the fact that scheyer matched vasquez statwise (for the most part) on vasquez’s senior night, at home, while the crowd was chanting “f*ck jon scheyer” is a feat it itself. i’d like to see vasquez put up the same numbers at duke. oh wait, when he did play at duke, he was held to only a few points in the first half. when he did finally score the rest of his 17 points, the game was over.

    looking at the whole season in its entirety, jon scheyer not only deserves ACC player of the year, he will make a better NBA player.

  • Amos Leak

    Vasquez is much better in college and in the NBA..one thing about Vasquez is, he really doesn’t need the best players to win. Scheyer doesn’t make his team better, the team makes Scheyer better. Vasquez has a mental of being a killer, regardless of who players and he has shown that above the ability to just shoot. Scheyer is like JJ Redick but with a better handle. He really isn’t defensive minded and we can’t say he really dominates the game at the college level. Vasquez, no matter who he plays, dominates the game, win or lose and Vasquez proved it at 6’6″….I watched Vasquez play in person against my college team in person and it was the best thing I had ever seen one person do in person beside Al-Farouq Aminu

  • jm

    @righteousdewd

    I think you made some good points. I agree Steve Blake is a better pg than Scheyer. I think Scheyer, if catches on with an NBA squad will play off the ball a lot, but still have some pg duties.

    @Amos

    I disagree that Scheyer doesn’t make his team better. That is a ridiculous statement. Of course he does. He is the most important player on that team. He for one has allowed Nolan Smith to shine by being more of a scoring guard. He takes away most of the handling duties from Smith and in turn Nolan has had a very good season. On the same token he has taken scoring pressure off of Singler. Scheyer is more consistent and steady than Vasquez. Even his own coach admits you never know what you will get with Vasquez…but you ride it out with him because he can help you win.

    Also, Scheyer and JJ do not have similar games other than being white and good shooters. But, JJ didn’t have any pg duties and only created from the wing or off the ball screen. No offense to Scheyer because he is a good shooter, but JJ was one of the best shooters ever to play college basketball. His senior year he did dominate games. He had one of the more dominate seasons by a college player in recent memory. He averaged nearly 30 a game. If that is not dominate with the type of comp that Duke plays night in and not out I don’t know what is. He also did that while shooting very goo percentages from the floor.

    It sounds like you watched Vasquez in person have a huge game and made this statement. Can’t base an argument on one game. You mentioned Aminu, he is a good college player, but not dominant by any stretch. But, he has more upside and most likely be a better pro.

    FYI – Vasquez and Scheyer have similar numbers. Vasquez had a 40+ performance which might shift perception. Look at Scheyer’s numbers in some games this year. He has put up some big games. He is like the quiet assassin. Vasquez, needs to let everyone know every time he scores by playing to the crowd. Bottom line it is perception…but in many eyes perception is reality.

  • Wes

    Vasquez reminds me of Adam Morrison. The emotion guys like that feed off doesn’t translate to the NBA, where every player is basically an independent contractor making a living. I am a Terps fan but after watching Vasquez almost singlehandedly lose at VA (!) with three boneheaded plays in a row, I’m not convinced his decision making has improved all the much. If he takes them deep into the tournament his stock will rise.

  • covey42

    Jon Scheyer will be a better pro than vasquez. Even though Vasquez is the better college player. Though neither will be MVP candidates or even first round draft picks thats for sure. If you need reasons read the above posts. man you gotta love fanboys..lol

  • gamadon9099

    Vasquez is a better player in terms the position they play in. Vasquez in NBA can play among the big boys as a Point Guard (more athletic, bigger, and faster). And his size can handle at least a mediocre starters in NBA.

    Jon Scheyer as a shoot guard among NBA players? I just dont see him doing well in that position against 70-80% of NBA player being taller, more physical against him.