Smack / Jun 18, 2010 / 5:41 am

Purple Reign 2: Lakers repeat as NBA champions, Kobe as Finals MVP

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In terms of putting a neat little bow on Kobe Bryant‘s legacy, this one didn’t exactly go as planned. In the days, hours and minutes leading up to Game 7 of the NBA Finals, the biggest topic of debate was what impact a win (or loss) would have on Kobe’s career. So with the Lakers winning their 16th championship as a franchise, Kobe getting the fifth ‘chip of his career, and L.A. its second in a row — albeit marked by Kobe playing one of the worst games of his playoff life — it’s tough to put a definitive period on the end of the sentence … If you only like scoring and offense, Game 7 was ugly. If you appreciate tough defense, cutthroat competition, and two teams willing to give up their bodies and beat the snot out of each other for a championship, Game 7 was beautiful. For three and a half quarters, it was all Boston. Kobe (6-24 FG) couldn’t find a clean look at the basket, and with the refs allowing the Celtics to play physical, he was also frustrated by not getting calls he usually gets … The Lakers fell behind by as much as 13 in the third quarter, but put together a 9-0 run in the fourth to get back in it. Kobe (23 pts, 15 rebs, 11-15 FT) found his stroke at the right time, and after L.A. got Boston in the penalty, it was a free-throw parade down the stretch. Rasheed Wallace and Rajon Rondo each hit huge threes to keep the C’s within one possession in the final minutes, but Sasha Vujacic stepped to the line with 11 seconds left and drilled the most important free throws of his life to put L.A. up by four and effectively end it … Kobe got MVP of the series — averaging 28.6 points, 8.0 rebounds, 3.9 assists and 2.1 steals — but you could have made a strong case for Pau Gasol. “The Spaniard” (Kobe’s nickname for him) put up 18.6 points, 11.6 boards and 2.6 blocks, and in the games the Lakers won, Gasol was arguably the lynchpin even more than Kobe, including the one leading L.A.’s dominance of the offensive glass last night … But for Game 7, you could also give Ron Artest his own MVP. Artest (20 pts, 5 stls) responded as a scorer when Kobe struggled, and made some clutch buckets in the fourth quarter. On the other end, he kept Paul Pierce (18 pts, 5-15 FG) in check, especially in the fourth when Pierce needed to take over as Boston couldn’t produce any offense … And how insane was Ron’s post-game interview? After thanking his ‘hood, Ron thanked his psychiatrist (“She really helped me calm down”), shilled his new single (“I recorded a song called ‘Champions’ LAST JUNE!”), and hugged the interviewer when he was done. And then his press conference was even more hilarious than that … What happened to Ray Allen in this series? He was great defensively against Kobe in Game 7, but continuing his weird up-and-down (mostly down) shooting, Ray couldn’t buy himself a bucket with an AmEx Black Card and three forms of ID. On his way to hitting 3-for-14 from the field, Ray was bricking threes, blowing layups, and even missed a free throw … So much is being made about Kobe tying Magic with five rings, but what about Derek Fisher tying Michael Cooper with five? Who do you think has been L.A.’s greatest role player between those two? … How mad would you be if you’d spent money on 2nd-row courtside season tickets at Staples Center, you’d gotten all the way to Game 7 of the Finals, and now you can’t see because Kendrick Perkins is standing in your way. But then you’re not gonna yell at the Angry Green Giant to sit down, are you? … Mark Jackson got real ‘hood towards the end of that fourth quarter, didn’t he? “I’ma roll these dice, and I bet’ not crap out!” Jax growled to punctuate a Kobe jumper in crunch time … Congrats to Lamar Odom for winning a title ring you can keep for yourself. Enjoy the moment, have fun at the parade, but you know the next time we talk we’ve gotta ask: How the hell did you have Brian Scalabrine guarding you 1-on-1 full court, and you couldn’t take him to the rack? You’re from New York City, son! … You know you’ve been watching too many World Cup games when Kobe flails his arm at Rondo after a foul and you expect Joey Crawford to come running at Kobe holding a yellow card … New rule: If a series gets to Game 7, players call their own fouls. Or maybe not. If a meaningless playground game to 21 can take an hour and a half ’cause dudes are arguing over calls, an NBA game might take 5 hours … We’re out like the season …

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  • http://www.paxtonavenue.com DGtheEnigma

    @Claw

    It was said earlier, but it would be silly to say “MJ never did…” because…HE DID. MJ’s last three close out games, he shot horribly, but he did other things to win the game (just like Kobe’s 15 rebounds last night). Scoring it not the only thing in basketball.

    MJ’s last three close out games:

    ’96 vs Sonics 5-19 22pts, 9rebs, 7ast 5 TOs
    ’97 vs Jazz 15-35 39 pts, 11rebs, 4ast
    ’98 vs Jazz 15-35 45pts, 1reb, 1ast

    Kobe’s not MJ, but he’s the closest by far.

  • Celts Fan

    @Michaelangelo – Kobe has not placed himself in the conversation w/ Jordan. He hasn’t even placed himself in that tier. He said as much himself last night in an interview w/ someone from ESPN that’s online. Oh, and you conveniently forget that the game you mention is the “Jumper – strip Malone – jumper-over-Russell game.” That ending makes up for it. The Lakers won in spite of Kobe last night, not the other way around.

    @Control – Rondo’s still a top 5 PG. After CP3 and Deron, you can make a case he’s #3, though I’d put Nash over him and maybe Chauncey (his J is every bit as bad as Nash’s D and Chauncey’s getting older, don’t see him staying up forever.) He’s an ELITE defender, passer, and rebounder. The ONLY knock on him is his J. I’m all for being real about it and dude needs to work that thing hard, but he’s soooo good at everything else, you can’t say he’s not a top 5 PG. That just doesn’t hold up.

    Anyway, I’m done here. Congrats Lakers fans.

  • Celts Fan

    @DG – he’s the 2nd best 2 guard ever, I’ll give you that. But he’s, NO DOUBT ABOUT IT, behind MJ, Magic, Russell, and Kareem, and I’d say still behind Duncan, Wilt, and Bird too. Give it time, not like they breaking up the team this summer.

    ok, now I’m done here.. haha

  • http://www.paxtonavenue.com DGtheEnigma

    @Celt Fan

    The fact that last night Kobe surpassed Bird/Duncan should not even be debatable. And I think any objective basketball fan would admit as much.

    Kobe has more rings now than both Bird/Duncan (Duncan never won back-to-back or even appeared in the Finals in back-to-back years and Kobe will be/has been more dominate over a longer period of time than Duncan — who is declining as we speak and he only came in one season after Kobe).

    As your name would suggest, I may not be able to convince you about Bird, but it should be a no-brainer why Kobe’s better.

  • Claw

    @ DGtheEnigma

    Way to bring the data, but shooting 15 for 35 is still 43% from the field, Kobe shot 25% in a close game 7.

    MJs 5/19 was a 12 point win over the Sonics where he didn’t need to do too much, game wasn’t that close.

    Kobe is as close as any guy in the NBA right now, but there is only one MJ and I don’t think he’s close to being at that level, let alone talking about surplanting Bird.

    Let me ask you a question, who had more impact Gasol or Kobe on giving the Lakers those last two wins?

  • LABaller

    Purposely havent posted on here during the finals cause I just wanted to enjoy the games, the series, the rivalry and keep it focused on that..besides that..i was too hungover most mornings to type my name out let alone thoughts..

    GREAT series imo…great defense…great will..toughness..grinding out games..clawing and scratching…it was all there..yeah it wasnt the best offensive series we could have watched but it was fun basketball nonetheless..

    the lakers won that last game in the best possible way in which they could have..without their offense..without their star hitting 40…by grinding it out..by doing everything everyone said they were weak with..and winning..thats got to count for something..

    gasol..wow..who is still calling him “soft”?? seriously..got to be one of the most skilled big men ever imo..does it all..can do it all..plays the right way..finds a way to win..

    artest is just simply not right in the head but he is probably the most loveable crazy person alive..really though at this point i would not be surprised if news stories surfaced that he went to the club and had a 100 person orgy to he ate a baby raw…it could be anything..i wouldnt be surprised…he brought some much needed toughness to this squad and call the muufucka crazy, but his crazy ass helped win that title..

    fish does what fish does..he wins..he always wins..hes up there in titles..hes up there in memorable plays..big shots..there when you need him always..the guy is the definition of glue guy..and like he said in the press conference..hes thankful first of all to be in the position continuously to be able to do what he does..but not everyone put in that position can succeed..fish does..

    and kobe man..yeah had a shit game offensively..jacked up shots he shouldnt have but if they were going in (which they have been in other games) no ones even talking about this..15 boards though? from your 2?? great d!! .. he found a way to win..

    thats what the squad did..they found a way to win..and that deserves credit..

    still gotta say it though..F boston..forever ever..

    who’s going to the parade? i know i am!!!!!!

  • LakeShow84

    WEW

    Well talk about a GAME.. Props to Boston who made this Finals probably the best one we will see for AWHILE..

    You Boston fans still on that ref shit?? Guess what?? you guys shouldve been called for DOUBLE the FOULS lol the best part about taking that tho from Boston AND the refs??

    WE BEAT BOSTON PLAYING BOSTON BASKETBALL

    I told my boy it was bad for you guys at halftime.. “watch we gonna get ALL the calls in the 4th” Refs wanted to keep it close.. If they called it like it was it wouldve been game 6 all over again cept we wouldve had 40-50 FT’s.. Nah they let us beat the shit out of each other.. BUT WE’LL TAKE IT..

    Nothing like beating someone at their own game :)

    Kiss your dirty asses GOODBYE Boston and for the record,

    F#$K RAY ALLEN, PAUL PIERCE AND BIG BABY.. WHOSE THE PITBULLS NOW?? TEAM IS FULL OF DIRTY CHUMPS WHO GET AWAY WITH TOO MUCH SEEMINGLY BECAUSE OF THE GREEN MYSTIQUE..

    Anyhoo

    Gasol looked like Rambo by the time the night was over.. dudes arms looked like he was attacked by wolverines lol

    You Kobe Haters still on that “MJ never did” shit?? Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm i guess that just means its on your mind right?? the funniest part is even though people CONTRADICT what your all saying by SHOWING you stats of Jordan having horrible shooting nights there isnt any cracking that thickness..

    LIKE IT OR NOT HES COMING FOR THAT NUMBER 1 SPOT.. As a franchise we just reap the benefits from his assaults on history.. and its BEAUTIFUL..

    And for the record The Mamba grabbing all them boards testifies to what the man does out there TO WIN.. U dont think he heard about the team winning the battle of the boards winning each and every game?? Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm 15 boards for a #2?? Yeah dude just aint got IT lololol

  • JBaller

    Say Queensbridge Barrack! QUEENSBRIDGE!

  • B

    why is no one commenting on Artest being a frontrunner? Remember last year when he had his whole “beef” with kobe and he said “don’t you know your hitting Ron Artest?” I had so much respect for him. Then he suddenly jumps ship to LA and becomes Kobe’s buddy? c’mon. That means he’s all talk.

  • http://www.paxtonavenue.com DGtheEnigma

    Kobe is as close as any guy in the NBA right now, but there is only one MJ and I don’t think he’s close to being at that level, let alone talking about surplanting Bird.

    Let me ask you a question, who had more impact Gasol or Kobe on giving the Lakers those last two wins?

    ^^^

    Kobe passed Bird as of last night. If I need to layout the case in full, I will if necessary (which truly, it shouldn’t be…)

    Gasol had more impact over the last two games, but it was Kobe for the SERIES (hince the MVP). And before you go any further about Gasol, just know that he layed two stink bombs in this series, which is fine. Happens to everyone. (also, through the first half last night, Kobe and Gasol’s stat lines were basically identical.

    Yes, Kobe played bad offensively last night, but any true basketball fan knows it was Kobe’s DEFENSE that won the game. Kobe contained Rondo and pulled down an astonishing 15 rebounds.

    Look, I get Kobe may never get the props he deserves because people don’t like him, but c’mon. Even during his worst game, he found a way to get it done (8-9 FTs in the 4th and 15 boards).

    Given credit/respect where its due.

  • Lake Fan

    Celtics fans??? Are you guys still crying? Wouldve, couldve, shouldve…blah blah blah.

    I agree to a certain extent the games earlier in the series, refs played a major role. There were a lot of bad calls for both the Lakers and the Celtics. Game 7, you cant say anything. Lakers got more calls because they were living in the paint. As for the Celtics, not so much. And you cant blame the refs on this one, they allowed the game to be physical. I think the Celtics got called for 1 moving screen, when I saw like 7.

    Nonetheless, as a Laker fan, Im glad we pulled off the win. Thank you Mr. Ray Ray aka Jekyll & Hyde for being who you are. Hot one minute, and cold the next. Can never figure out what youre going to get out of him.

  • Claw

    Defense on Rondo? By guarding him below the FT line? That is on Rondo for not being able to hit a J over 10 feet. DFish’s D stopped Ray Allen? Dude missed 3 WIDE open 3s, its not the D sometimes its the player.

    Kobe and Gasols numbers were close but Gasol hit over 50% while Kobe was 20%. Kobe played the best “overall” but think back to all the Laker wins, Gasol was the MVP in 3 of those and Kobe 1, in the losses Kobe was definitely the better player. Gasol plays like a bitch on the road.

    Kobe makes plays that are unreal but other times he makes plays that shake your head. Maybe you don’t remember Bird playing but I can’t remember a time when people questioned his shot selection like they do Kobe. Bird made players play at a different level.

    Go back in your stats and see if Bird ever played in a game where the TEAM got only 12 assists. I’ll bet bank that’s never happened.

  • Claw

    @Lakeshow

    You comparing shooting 43% to 25% as being close? That must be the new math they use for the LA fans. Look I’m a Cavs fan and a Suns fan, I hate watching games that are influenced by the refs. That 4th quarter was a joke, they let them play the first 3 but then all of a sudden its like they remembered they were playing in LA and started blowing the whistle.

    19 FTs in a quarter? That’s not letting the teams play, that’s too much interference by the referees.

    Ray Ray did shoot himself out the game, I’ve never seen him miss shots with guys not within 10 feet, they could have played Rondo D on him.

  • K Dizzle

    I love how post 18 posts correctly that Mike amazingly also had some bad closeout games and the Jordan defenders come out with the “Yeah, but the game wasn’t that close” or “It doesn’t matter” Please. You miss 20 shots, you missed 20 shots. Give The Glove his props for makin Mike’s life miserable once George Karl made the switch.Give Kobe props for him not quittin on d and snaggin 15 boards like he was a center. Don’t try to discredit the man cuz his jumper as off. Appreciate that he did whatever he had to do to win, including givin the rock up.

    Is the legacy intact now?
    What else does he have to do?
    Is Fish still the weak link?
    Is 5 rings enough?
    Like Laker fans been tryin to say: Kobe is top 10 all-time, fair enough, but he’s got 3-5 seasons left.
    No more discussion till it’s over.
    Great series by the Celts. Win or lose, Lakers fans and Celts fans had to be happy with the effort.
    Glad we pulled it out and everybody found redemption in one game. Kobe got carried by Gasol, Fish, Artest, Odom an even Sasha. Sheed showed his lowpost dominance and got me stressin watchin him just kill us with bankers. Dude, why you even shoot 3s?

    All’s well that ends well
    Lakers, baby.
    We came for what was ours.
    I’m out

  • M-Intellect

    The Kobe-MJ arguement comes down to this, in the clutch MJ hit the jumper, stripped Malone and hit the game winner. Fact.

    Who felt Kobe could’ve/would’ve done that yesterday, if it was necessary to hold onto the league? Not me and I’m a huge Kobe fan.

    In fact, he took a contested 3 in the clutch that he bricked and lucky enough, someone bailed him out with an offensive board.

    That is the end of that.

  • K Dizzle

    @ Claw

    I’m gettin tired of haters(that’s what it is) actin like the Lakers shot more freebies in som, kinda fix.
    Go watch the 4th again. While Kobe and Pau were attackin the hoop, Pierce, Allen and Sheed were shooting jumpers. The more aggressive team got the calls all series. Even in game 5 when the Celts killed us, Pierce was shootin jumper after jumper while we ere still attackin the rim to stop clock and try to get back into the game.
    Go read the espn play-by-play of last night’s 4th quarter:
    Ray misses jumper, Kobe fouled on drive. Pierce misses 3. Gasol fouled on drive. Ray misses jumper. Artest fouled by Pierce on drive. No joke: that was the best defense that Lakers have played all season.KG was killin Gasol EVERYTIME. Phil made the adjustment. Brought Lamar to double team. KG found Ray. He couldn’t hit. Simple as that. The shotclock was always down to 3 and some Celtic had to throw up a jumper. Numbers are good and all, but let’s not pretend the Celts were attackin the rim half as hard as the Lakers were in the 4th. Pierce attacked once and got swatted and that was it. All jumpers after that.

    Can we enjoy the victory now?
    Probably not huh?
    Don’t matter anyways. It’s done.
    Both teams played hard. Celts did own the first 3 quarters, but we gutted it out.
    Peace

  • Celts Fan

    @DG – “The fact that last night Kobe surpassed Bird/Duncan should not even be debatable. And I think any objective basketball fan would admit as much.” You’re wrong. It’s debatable, but wrong.

    Bird has 3 MVPs and was THE MAN on 3 titles teams in the absolute peak of the league, talent-wise, before parody and over-expansion watered teams down. he was the best player on one of the best teams in history (those 80′s Celtics are behind only the Showtime Lakers, and maybe MJs Bulls and the Russell Celtics.)

    Duncan has 2 MVPs and was THE MAN on 4 title teams. Put it this way, before Duncan started declining, SA wouldn’t have traded him for Kobe straight up. That counts. Also, of course Duncan’s declining now and Kobe’s not. Duncan was a college sr. when he came in. Kobe was straight outta HS. Before he started showing his age, Duncan never lost in the first round of the Playoffs.

    Both of these guys let the game come to them, didn’t force the action, NEVER acted like Kobe used to w/ teammates (not anymore, but that 4 year stretch where he was a completely insufferable dbag that all his teammates hated counts for something. It’s a TEAM game) Not to mention, Kobe hardly ever makes his teammates better. he should average more dimes. Last night’s game was awful. Far more impartial people here have said as much. Kobe has 2 rings as THE MAN, and 3 as a sidekick (admittedly, on the Pippen/McHale etc. level as one of the best ever, but still.) There’s NO WAY IN HELL 24 year old Kobe was ready to be a #1 on a title team.

    Slow your role. He’s on the same tier as them now, but IMO, he hasn’t passed them. Pick this back up in a year or so and he may (probably will) have passed them, but right now it’s still 50/50 at best for him being over them. Just know that MJ is not reachable. Some of you guys need to learn the history of the game and appreciate the bigs more or just stop talking. More Sportscenter highlights on the way to your greatness doesn’t make you better. GREAT big guys are typically better than GREAT guards because bigs win titles more. Also, keep in mind that they changed the rules to allow for more scoring right as Kobe really started ascending. You guys complaining about how rough the C’s were, trying playing the Bad Boy Pistons and the 90s Knicks style of D. Kobe would not have been able to do what he’s done against that. Not a knock on Kobe – just putting Bird’s greatness in its proper context.

    In summary, if you’re knocking Bird, go watch some ESPN Classic. Kobe probably just needs to stay upright – no way that team’s done winning titles unless there’s an injury – to jump into the rarified air or MJ, Magic, Kareem, and Russell, and I firmly think he ends up there when all’s said and done, but slow down for now. He didn’t even have a good series by his standards (again, when talking the all time best players in history, the context shoots waaaaaaaaaaay up.)

  • Claw

    @KDizzle

    Big difference in missing 20 shots when shooting 24 (though he “only” missed 18) and missing 20 shots when shooting 35. MJ also scored 45 when shooting 35, Kobe scored 23 when shooting 24.

    All I’m saying is Kobe is the best of the players out there now, but not near Jordan and shouldn’t even be a discussion.

    Then to bring up Kobe better than Bird doesn’t even make sense. Kobe does have time, but he’s not there yet.

  • Celts Fan

    @KDizzle – reread that though. The Glove on MJ, Ray freakin Allen on Kobe. That’s not the same. Just saying… (and again, I got no problem moving him up when all’s said and done, but you gotta do more to get into the top 5 ever. He will, I’m sure, but he’s not there YET. Also 3 of those rings were as a #2. a GREAT #2, but a #2. That matters when you’re talking this context. He’ll get another one or 2 by the time he hang ‘em up unless he gets hurt, so we’ll talk then…)

    and no, the refs didn’t have anything to do with it last night. I woulda liked to have gotten a few more calls here and there, but it was a well-reffed game. You took 20 more FTs cuz you were more aggressive, rebounded more, and got fouled more. Period (the whining coming outta Boston today is ridiculous. You guys should hear the sports radio stations. It’s insane. I get why everyone hates us. The dbags make us all look bad. I hope I don’t get grouped in w/ that to you though. I try and be as fair and unbiased as possible in this stuff…)

  • fallinup

    Last 3 minutes of the 3rd. To the first 4 or so minutes of the fourth… Started off with Boston with a 13 point lead. Ended with Boston scoring just 1 point in that stretch. You can’t blame that shit on the refs.

    Everyone aside from Artest was gassed. It came down to plays. And Lakers won the more plays. Phil threw Odom in there and he got his. Fish comes back and hits a big 3. Hell, he throws Sasha in there JUST to hit two key free throws. Pau gets to the line. Artest pulls off some SHIT… the And 1… the HUGE 3. And Kobe did come through when it mattered. He hit his freebies. Got to the line.. and rebounded. All the while, he seemed non existent for the first 3 quarters. And Artest.. you can’t talk enough about him. I peeped a stat late in the 3rd. Both Pierce and Allen combined for like 3-15. Artest scored when he had to and kept them in the game.

    All the while, the Celts ran out of gas. They pulled some gutsy plays when it mattered. But Doc got tricked with them rotations. He kept the starters out there too long, and didn’t throw Nate and Baby in there until it was too late. But he kinda had to do it… the game was so ugly and close.

    You can attribute the rebound difference to Perk being out. You can attribute the foul difference to the refs finally calling shit, and LA taking full advantage of that.

    But until the end. Both teams had a chance to win it. No way this was given to anybody so ya’ll need to stop that mess. It came down to plays. And LA pulled it off.

    Nuff said. Props to the Celts. And BIG PROPS to the Lakers. Whoever was the winner… it’s deserved.

    A great, ugly series.

  • LakeShow84

    @ KDizz and LABaller and EVERY OTHER LAKER FAN

    ITS OUR TIME RIGHT NOW.. So let these foo’s do what they do best..

    SIT BACK AND TALK OUT THEY NECKS..

    And for the record..

    @ M Intellect

    “The Kobe-MJ arguement comes down to this, in the clutch MJ hit the jumper, stripped Malone and hit the game winner. Fact.

    Who felt Kobe could’ve/would’ve done that yesterday, if it was necessary to hold onto the league? Not me and I’m a huge Kobe fan.”

    As clutch as dude has been THIS YEAR ALONE you think with EVERYTHING riding one play Kobe wouldnt deliver??

    You call yourself a fan and you have no faith in ur boy?? DAMN thats some HALF ASS shit lol

    Those moments never happen until they happen and if theres one player you could bank on to do something like that.. Its Kobe Bryant..

    Save your energy haters.. you guys got 2-3 more years left of this chatter.. and by 4 years all you’ll be able to say is some turf hoppin shit..

  • Claw

    Lakers attacked? Like when Pierce blocked Kobe’s drive and it was called a foul, then Pierce drove the lane got hit in the head an no foul called. Then Gasol dribbling from half court runs into Pierce and Pierce is called for a foul. Let’s not forget Gasol not releasing the ball before coming back down for a little up and down not called. That was whack, refs sucked in the 4th but you are right the Cs didn’t do anything to help themselves as Ray Ray plain sucked last night. Actually since setting the record for 3s in a game he’s been terrible.

    Lakers got home court advantage, and there is a home court advantage in the NBA moreso than the other leagues. Usually in the 4th less fouls are called not more, just wish there were less calls for both teams so there is no question, and make them win it during the game not at the FT line. Mostly in a game 7.

  • control

    Kobe has a touch of “denis rodmanititus”. Doesn’t matter what he does, or how good he is, or what he achieves, he will always be purely hated on because he had periods in his career where he was (and still is) an absolute douchebag and asshole. The guy is purely selfish, a huge asshole and almost as unlikeable as you can get…but he gets results.

    Celts Fan

    You are like the only cool Celtic fan around most of the time.

  • Celts Fan

    @Claw – that Pierce-Gasol play wasn’t a charge. Pierce wasn’t set/going laterally. He went into him. It’s just a bad decision to try that.

    @Lakeshow – Kobe had that moment – he bricked a 3, then the real finals MVP grabbed the offensive board that locked up the chip for you guys.

    Either way, just making some points, don’t wanna sound bitter here. You guys won fairly, regardless of what some of the other Boston people say (my only ish is deading the Kobe stuff FOR NOW.) Congrats guys. Enjoy the parade…

  • LakeShow84

    @ CeltsFan

    All i have to say is..

    Kobe Bryant WOULD SMOKE Larry Bird like a pack of motherf#$kin Cools on a basketball court..

    Thats already a given right??

    And the resume now speaks for itself.. 5 rings and counting with 2 Finals MVPS and counting..

    Kobe Bryant could retire today and be more accomplished than Larry Bird..

    Take the names off the headers and tell me whose career resume is PHATTER.. PLEASE..

  • http://facebook.com/Mr.Brogden Mr. Brogden

    Kobe’s KOBE.

    When y’all gonna recognize???
    GREAT = GREAT = REGARDLESS

    KILL THE COMPARISON.
    We know MJ was and still is the PROTOTYPE.
    But c’mon…that was 10 years ago.
    THANGS ARE CHANGING.

    Alexander the Great was taught by…
    Aristotle

    Aristotle was taught by..

    Plato

    Plato was taught by…

    Socrates

    You don’t ever hear Plato is the closest thing to Socrates. Because they’re GREAT INDIVIDUAL THINKERS.

    GREATNESS NEEDS NO COMPARISON…but it welcomes it.

    I predict there’ll be a time when players are compared to KOBE…the one and only Kobe…and you might not hear an MJ reference…

    Kobe would trash Bird. No offense.

  • Celts Fan

    thanks Control. preciate that.

  • Celts Fan

    One on one, Kobe would beat Bird, sure.

    BUT, Bird’s got 2 more MVPs (3 straight,) was a much better passer and rebounder than Kobe (this gets overlooked. People think he was a 1-dimensional shooter; that’s far from the truth,) was a better shooter, and was THE MAN on 3 title teams (a transcendant ’86 team, which is considered one of the 2 or 3 best ever) in the NBA’s golden age. Even Magic and Wilbon said Kobe couldn’t touch Bird last night.

    Kobe has 5 chips, but only two as THE MAN. He’s alienated teammates, given up on big games to prove a point, and has 1 MVP to show for it. He’s a better defender and overall offensive player than Bird, but individually, Bird’s resume is better. As far as team accomplishments, you gotta call it about even. You coulda replaced Kobe w/ TMac (all-star scorer) and won those rings w/ Shaq in his MDE phase. I don’t believe for a second that 24-year-old Kobe was good enough to win those rings as the best player on a title team if you replaced Shaq with an all-star-but-not-GREAT center, so take that w/ a grain of salt if you disagree, but that’s where I’m at here.

    Either way, when the Lakers take one of the next 2 or 3 chips (if not more,) this argument’s over, but FOR NOW, I’ll take Bird. All last night did IMO was make it a legit argument between him, Bird, and Duncan for the #6 position, but I personally, still have him behind those guys right now (MJ, Russell, Magic, Wilt and Kareem – that’s not in order – are firmly the top 5 to me)

  • Celts Fan

    to clarify – I think Kobe was an ALL TIME GREAT sidekick then, but he was not capable of being a #1 on a title team at that point in his career, so when discussing greatness at this upper upper echelon, those first 3 are an extra point, but you cannot call it 5 rings like the first 3 were anywhere close to as impressive as the past 2 (and however many he ads in the next few years.) Again, patience. By the time all’s said and done, he’ll have at least one more, then we can really start this discussion for real.

  • http://www.paxtonavenue.com DGtheEnigma

    @Celts Fan

    As stated earlier, there will be no convincing you about Bird because you’re a Celtics fan, so no need in an exercise in futility. That’s your opinion. Fine.

    As for Tim Duncan/Kobe comparisons, everyone (talking heads, pundits, writers, league officials, every major sports network, etc.) has now said that Kobe is unequivocally the best player of his generation. Tim Duncan is a part of Kobe’s generation.

    Don’t let your feelings about Kobe’s personality/flaws cloud your judgment. There’s really no way to justify your statement.

  • M-Intellect

    LOL – Lakeshow, I WANT Kobe to be better then MJ, trust me but the truth is the truth and we saw yesterday Kobe forcing a dagger three and fucking it up.

    It isn’t about faith or hate or anything else, it’s about facts. As hard as it is to admit, Kobe nearly shot the Lakers out of the game.

  • http://www.paxtonavenue.com DGtheEnigma

    @Celts Fan

    Everytime ANYONE argues about who’s #1 or #2 or alpha dog vs. sidekick on a championship is silly.

    A championship is a championship. Period.

    …and as of last night Kobe has five.

    By your explanation, Tim Duncan only has 3 rings cause David Robinson was the man. That’s silly and unjustified. Duncan doesn’t win without Ginobili, Robinson, Parker, etc. Shaq doesn’t win without Horry, Kobe, etc. Kobe doesn’t win without Gasol, Fisher, Artest, Odom, etc.

    THAT’S WHY IT’S A TEAM GAME! WHY THE HELL DO YOU THINK IT TAKES MULTIPLE STARS TO WIN A CHAMPIONSHIP?

    Sheesh! Everytime someone brings this topic up I cringe…

  • http://www.paxtonavenue.com DGtheEnigma

    It isn’t about faith or hate or anything else, it’s about facts. As hard as it is to admit, Kobe nearly shot the Lakers out of the game.

    ^^^

    He nearly shot them out of the game…but still hit 8-9 FTs in the 4th qtr and had 15 rebounds in the game.

    Same thing MJ would’ve/has done when he had an off night.

    Kobe’s not “better” than MJ, but he’s the closest by far.

  • http://www.paxtonavenue.com DGtheEnigma
  • Celts Fan

    @DG – true, but by that logic, you could argue that Manu’s better than Wilt cuz he’s got 3. You need to define the role. It doesn’t matter when talking if you should be a HOFer, but IT DOES MATTER IN DEBATING WHO’S BETTER IN A GREATEST OF ALL TIME DISCUSSION. I’m not discounting role as a #2, but it’s comparing completely different things when you talk THE MAN on a title team vs. a #2. When you get to this level of greatness and comparing them, that has to factor in (and in yesterday’s Smack, I noted that Duncan only has 3 as the man, w/ 1 as DRob’s #2, but that’s still more impressive to me than 2 as THE MAN and 3 as a #2. Again though, it’s as close as it can get. When Kobe takes one more chip – and it’ll happen, much as I hate to say it – he leap-frogs Bird, Duncan, and probably Wilt too, just behind MJ, Russell, Magic, and Kareem.)

    and for the record in the Duncan over Kobe discussion, one thing I forgot to mention, he’s been all nba team and all nba defense every year of his career but one up until 08 when he started to fall off.

    Like I been trying to say, he WILL end up better than those guys, but right now, I’d still give the slightest of edges to Timmy and Larry Legend.

  • sh!tfaced

    Hah! Celts already lost to the Lakers. And now Laker fans going full overkill bringing Kobe past Bird. Ugh… Damn man, hard to be anything Celtic right now… LOL

  • frmkt

    what do we do with bynum??? he was game and all but damn! Dude has never been even 80% for Finals. i don’t see us getting away with it again. we didn’t in ’08 and almost didn’t get away with it this year. i wish shaq never put his head up his ass. i see that issue being much larger than the 1 and of course, LO is an issue as well. 6’10″ and potential to 25% as good as Magic in regards to handling a basketball and creating a shot driving to the basket. that’s all we needed from him coming off the bench. those are the holes i see that if filled, will guarantee this squad at least 2 more ‘chips before kobe and pau’s contracts expire. c’mon mitch! you can do it because you learned from the best and you still have the best owner in all of sports.

  • frmkt

    BTW: i think boston is in for another dry spell. that current roster has been the shit, bad ass motherfuckers “fo sho!”

  • the cynic

    nothing gives me greater joy than watching Paul Pierce play a miserable game, thank you Artest.

  • http://newestwear.com/ Randy Handbag

    Boston had that game won. They blew it mentally!

  • wah

    I think people are forgetting Kobe is playing on a BUM KNEE AND BROKEN FINGERS.

    And all the talk about things Kobe never did that MJ did…

    uhh…

    81 points.

  • A.R.

    Who the hell cares if kobe won 3 rings with shaq as the “dominant” player. The argument changes every time the man accomplishes something. First it was he’ll never be a good leader, then it was he’ll never win one without shaq now its he won three rings as a sidekick it was shaq’s team. Perhaps you guys should take a little trip to youtube and watch Kobe show he earned those rings just as much as Shaq did. Let us not forget Shaq played in those finals against lackluster competition down low. Aside from Mutombo who was going to cause a problem for the man? Anytime he’s had some comp down there he has lost in the finals. Olajuwon and the Wallace boys in Detroit both knocked him off. Kobe isn’t perfect, neither has any other player in the history of the world been, but show that man respect. He’s top 10 of ALL TIME and yes he is better than Bird! Sorry Celtic fan I know that hurts but its true 5 rings is 5 rings. And the man more than earned every last one of them. Never do i remember watching Kobe get a ring by waving a towel and cheering on Shaq, he went out and made phenomenal plays and busted shot after shot for those rings period. And as far as the MJ comparison, really people find something else to talk about. All I care about is the FACT that Kobe has brought the LA Laker’s franchise 5 championships and god willing a couple more before he hangs them up.

  • A.R.

    And lets not forget that even though Kobe had a bad shooting night he went out and grabbed 15 rebounds! And it isn’t like he’s Dwight Howard out there. He also knocked down keys free throws and made that pass to Artest for the key three. If Jordan can get love for making those passes to Kerr and Paxson during his run Kobe should get love too.

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